3.2 Sephiroth

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Originally Posted by SaitoHikari

I only began playing somewhat recently, and I wasn't allowed to progress in the MSQ at some point (I think 2.4 quests?) until I completed Garuda, Titan, and Ifrit HM.

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Oh, so that's how they solved it...

Minfilia is the questgiver for the start of that chain, so they need to be sure you've gotten her out of the Waking Sands after a certain point so she's not still there after the coup in Ul'dah. Clever. And also why every quest in the known universe post-Heavensward uses a proxy questgiver. Guess that means Urianger has more job security than anyone else in the cast, because that Final Coil unlock makes him bulletproof.

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Originally Posted by Fenral

Oh, so that's how they solved it...

Minfilia is the questgiver for the start of that chain, so they need to be sure you've gotten her out of the Waking Sands after a certain point so she's not still there after the coup in Ul'dah. Clever. And also why every quest in the known universe post-Heavensward uses a proxy questgiver. Guess that means Urianger has more job security than anyone else in the cast, because that Final Coil unlock makes him bulletproof.

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Not to mention EX Primals (notably his role with these has been delegated to Unukahai, which makes it likely that wither Bismarck and Ravana will be gatekeepers or they are here to stay)

Probably, the HM version would be a weak version summoned by the tree tribe, and the ex the real deal, unsealed by RPG magic, and related to Unukalhai's quest chain.
(Assumption made : the sealed one isn't a summon already, or you can summon something that is already summoned)

I hope they copy ff7 final boss music when fighting Sephiroth.

lorewise what is the difference between mako and crystals? both are formed from the life stream as FF general universal law.

So I'm saying why the heck not bring Sephiroth into this as to many of us would bring back fond memory's too.

another quick off thought primal's are summoned with crystals based on the users image of what they think should be there god.

so using that could add all FF series bosses eventually.

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Originally Posted by SaitoHikari

I only began playing somewhat recently, and I wasn't allowed to progress in the MSQ at some point (I think 2.4 quests?) until I completed Garuda, Titan, and Ifrit HM.

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I was wondering about that, since the HM Primal quests also involved interacting with the Scions. Obviously not something you can do post-2.55.

So, people were really thinking that the name of one of the statues were related to FFVII's Sephiroth? Geez...

Also, FFXIV statue is called Sephirot (without the H), just like it's written in the sightseeing log entry. Probably all the statues will be labeled like Nomura's concept names for the original Warring Triad, being Sephirot (Fiend), Zurvan (Demon) and Sophia (Godess).

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie-Amber

snip.

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if I remember correctly, yoshida said that Sephiroth from FFvii was a big no.

What we are getting is FFvi's Sephirot (Fiend). They are largely different

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

if I remember correctly, yoshida said that Sephiroth from FFvii was a big no.

What we are getting is FFvi's Sephirot (Fiend). They are largely different

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So much this.
I hope they use a remix of Catastrophe as the theme for this battle, it would be awesome!

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Originally Posted by Harz

Not strictly lore related but my god I'm hoping for a remix of Battle to the Death for these three.

I'd happily wipe to that for hours.

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YES! First phase: slow paced mechanic battle with a remix of Catastrophe + Second to final phase: brutal battle with a remix of Battle to the Death. I'm dying here!

Uhm, just in case someone didn't noticed.

Azys Lla = The Floating Continent

The Warring Triad FFXIV = The Warring Triad FFVI

http://imgur.com/gv0WfY8 Plus http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/...20140403213200

Look at their Faces. I imagine SE is pulling the three first Forms of the Final Boss off in forms of Trials.

Man, I am so HYPE for this! My jaw hit the floor when the announcement came in the Live Letter. They calked it a 'series', and implied we're going to get one WT trial per patch. Which naturally implied we're *at least* going up to 3.4.

I'm curious if the Garleans are going to be involved. Probably. If so, the WT series is probably going to conclude with a significant turning point in the Garleans storyline, leading us into what will likely be the Ala Mhigo expansion. This is because the Garlean Empire has practically been a walking FFVI reference since 2.0 launched (see: The Magitek Armor complete with Terra's theme.) Now we have the Floating Continent and the Warring Triad, *huge* lore pieces from FFVI. I'll be surprised if this doesn't result in similarily huge development for the Garlean storyline.

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Originally Posted by Alisa180

Man, I am so HYPE for this! My jaw hit the floor when the announcement came in the Live Letter. They calked it a 'series', and implied we're going to get one WT trial per patch. Which naturally implied we're *at least* going up to 3.4.

I'm curious if the Garleans are going to be involved. Probably. If so, the WT series is probably going to conclude with a significant turning point in the Garleans storyline, leading us into what will likely be the Ala Mhigo expansion. This is because the Garlean Empire has practically been a walking FFVI reference since 2.0 launched (see: The Magitek Armor complete with Terra's theme.) Now we have the Floating Continent and the Warring Triad, *huge* lore pieces from FFVI. I'll be surprised if this doesn't result in similarily huge development for the Garlean storyline.

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I wouldn't be surprised to see the 6th legion get involved.

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Originally Posted by Fenral

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Also the quests for the individual HM primal are given by the other sons that go missing.

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Originally Posted by Alisa180

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I'm sort of hoping that there will be a twist. In that we'll side with the Garleans against a greater threat. The Garleans deserve more than to be wiped out or treated like a generic evil empire - they'd be better off being given the same treatment as the Archadian Empire in FFXII. I'm hoping they'll go in that direction because an expansion based around helping psychotic refugees reclaim Ala Mhigo just doesn't appeal to me if they're pushed as the 'good guys'. Especially not after what Ilberd did in the name of 'Ala Mhigo'. Or the Corpse Brigade.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I'm sort of hoping that there will be a twist. In that we'll side with the Garleans against a greater threat. The Garleans deserve more than to be wiped out or treated like a generic evil empire - they'd be better off being given the same treatment as the Archadian Empire in FFXII. I'm hoping they'll go in that direction because an expansion based around helping psychotic refugees reclaim Ala Mhigo just doesn't appeal to me if they're pushed as the 'good guys'. Especially not after what Ilberd did in the name of 'Ala Mhigo'. Or the Corpse Brigade.

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I wouldn't condemn all Ala Mhigans based off Ilberd or the Corpse Brigade, particularly since the Corpse Brigade attacks other Ala Mhigans. Wilred and his elder, Minfilia, probably Yda and even Raubahn are examples of Ala Mhigans that probably would like to see their old home in the hands of its people again. The vast bulk of the Refugees seem like decent, if desperate, people.

Likewise, I don't think I'd call the Garleans a generic evil empire. You could argue they have noble goals for the greater good. Infact the Scions biggest issue with the Garleans is their constant desire for conquest and the methods they use to achieve their 'greater good' such as the treatment of Ala Mhigo after it was conquered and their methods to solve issues like the Eikons. We only ever deal with the armed aggressive face of Garlemald.

I don't think in the long run Garlemald will be wiped out. I think if anything it might face some reforming. Garlemald's current issue is it's aggressive nature and hubris, not its technology or fundamentally its culture. We have seen several examples of good Garleans and we know Garlemald is a nation with factions.

Garlemald is a example of hubris and misguided conviction carried too far. The fact they desire to emulate the Allagans only highlights the inherent flaws in their doctrine.

I'm pretty sure the Allagans were doing their damnedest to make sure they avoided the pitfalls the civilization that preceded them fell into, fully assured that they would never make the mistakes of their forbears. I'm not so sure present-day Eorzea (or even the future of present-day Eorzea) is so enlightened as to be guaranteed success where the Allagans failed, and even if they were, to be confident of that is... agh, what's the word?

I think Garlemald's probably a lot more open-minded on that front. They're putting more effort into understanding the Allagans than any other civilization out there, and they're not afraid to keep at it even as borderline-sentient maintenance units laugh at their ineptitude. Hard work and a "never give up" attitude have to count for something.

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Originally Posted by Fenral

I'm pretty sure the Allagans were doing their damnedest to make sure they avoided the pitfalls the civilization that preceded them fell into, fully assured that they would never make the mistakes of their forbears. I'm not so sure present-day Eorzea (or even the future of present-day Eorzea) is so enlightened as to be guaranteed success where the Allagans failed, and even if they were, to be confident of that is... agh, what\'s the word?

I think Garlemald's probably a lot more open-minded on that front. They're putting more effort into understanding the Allagans than any other civilization out there, and they're not afraid to keep at it even as borderline-sentient maintenance units laugh at their ineptitude. Hard work and a "never give up" attitude have to count for something.

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I would have easily sided with Gaius instead of the Scions if given the option. But people like Nael, Regulous, and The Empeor (current) are far to fanatical and open to mass genocide. Gaius was at least subtle when needed. That's why I keep hoping he's alive.

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Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

I would have easily sided with Gaius instead of the Scions if given the option. But people like Nael, Regulous, and The Empeor (current) are far to fanatical and open to mass genocide. Gaius was at least subtle when needed. That's why I keep hoping he's alive.

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I'm torn. I disagreed with Gaius on a number of fundamental levels such as the beastmen genocide thing plus what happened in the wake of him taking over Ala Mhigo makes me distrustful of what treatment Eorzea would get under his rule let alone Garlemald proper. I also dislike Garlemald's caste system that basically leaves the people of conquered territories without even the rights of citizens.

I liked Gaius in a lot of ways but still wasn't sold on his methods. Again hubris, ambition and arrogance were issues and the reason Cid turned from him.

Garlemald has many characteristics which are quite admirable but their self certainly and sense of superiority leave them open to foolish and catastrophic mistakes. Lets remember this is a empire that thought dropping a moon onto the planet was a feasible idea and proceed with this plan after messing with the Allagan tech related to the plan levelled one of their own cities.

Cid, to me, simply comes across as a traitor. I'm never been terribly impressed with the 'defector' trope in general though. Usually it results in being a convenient plot device for important information to be given to a faction's opponents and then, somehow, the faction's opponents manage to overcome all odds and beat the supposedly mightier faction at every turn. What isn't often explored, however, is the reality of war. Yes, some Garleans are advocating genocide - but how many Garlean soldiers have been slaughtered or even murdered unnecessarily by Eorzeans? How many innocent civilians/non-combatants on Garlemald's side died when the Castrum's were assaulted? Or when uprisings occurred?


I'm sort of hoping for more information on the Doman uprising. What if the Garlean's reacted so harshly because innocent Garleans were taken hostage and killed in an attempt to gain Doma's freedom? I think the story would benefit greatly from more morally grey plots along those lines. They certainly did a great job at making the Dragonsong War complex.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

*snip*

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I hear this sentiment a lot. It seems to stem from Gaius and the fact he's sympathetic and understandable. Leaving aside the fact I don't share said sentiment (like I don't see how the WoL would have joined Gaius instead of the Scions under different circumstances), its been made pretty damn clear that Gaius was the exception, and nowhere close to the rule. Remember, the XIVth Legion he was in charge of was effectively rogue by 2.0. Even if he'd survived, he'd sure as hell wouldn't be welcome in Garlemald.

As much as some don't want Garlemald to go the 'generic evil empire' route, I honestly can't see them becoming anything but. I've stated in another thread that they believe genocide is the answer to the 'eikon problem', and now that they know normal Eorzeans can summon primals and not just the 'beast tribes'...Well...

Alphinaud even said that any 'reasonable' factions left within Garlemald would cease to exist upon that little revelation.

Barring a plot twist that allows otherwise, its looking increasingly like Garlemald will be the 'arc enemy' for the Ala Mhigan expansion, and again unless something about the primal situation changes, they will very likely fill the 'generic evil empire' role.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Cid, to me, simply comes across as a traitor. I'm never been terribly impressed with the 'defector' trope in general though. Usually it results in being a convenient plot device for important information to be given to a faction's opponents and then, somehow, the faction's opponents manage to overcome all odds and beat the supposedly mightier faction at every turn. What isn't often explored, however, is the reality of war. Yes, some Garleans are advocating genocide - but how many Garlean soldiers have been slaughtered or even murdered unnecessarily by Eorzeans? How many innocent civilians/non-combatants on Garlemald's side died when the Castrum's were assaulted? Or when uprisings occurred?


I'm sort of hoping for more information on the Doman uprising. What if the Garlean's reacted so harshly because innocent Garleans were taken hostage and killed in an attempt to gain Doma's freedom? I think the story would benefit greatly from more morally grey plots along those lines. They certainly did a great job at making the Dragonsong War complex.

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The Castrum's are military outposts of an invading army. Yes there are a lot of Garlean soldiers who have died but they are part of an invading army. I might add that most of those we have actually killed are not actually Garleans but leves conscripted from conquered territories including Ala Mhigo where large numbers of the youth were forceably taken from their families and brainwashed to flow Garlean doctrine after Ala Mhigo was occupied. We have ironically probably killed a lot more Ala Mhigan conscripts than actual Garleans. Most of them probably didn't even have citizenship in the Garlean empire as that takes 20 years of military service to earn.

Genocide is also currently Garlean policy.

Garlemald as an empire might not be evil. Even culturally it might be alright. How they have been aggressively conquering and subjugating the rest of the world and how they have been treating the world as they conquer it. Yes, Garleans have been dying but in a war the Garleans started and have been continuing to perpetrate.

All that said, I think its far more likely we will see more moderate Garleans and even Garlean citizens when we get to Ala Mhigo. I think its almost certain we will find ourselves caught between angry Ala Mhigan revolutionaries and Garleans citizens who have made the city whole and who have actually been responsible for good works. The Garlean Military complex though I see being villians regardless. I wouldn't even be surprised to see them turn on the Moderates if the Moderates at some point for being 'uncommitted' to the Garlean empire.

I'll not quote anyone in particular but you all brought up point I'm the wake of my post id ike to address.

The meteor project was Darnus' idea and Gaius helped the 1.0 heros stop him. To Gaius genocide was unneccicary.

The best tribes could be justified because anyone without the echo could easily be tempered. And no one has ever found a way to reverse it.

Regula seems to be a tech master and likly the one who invented the brain washing. Gaius conqured Ala Mihgo by taking advantage of their rebellion against the King of Ruin. Yes they are conqured, but when Gaius was regent they may not, and still may not, have a problem. We can't take people like Ilberd at face value on the "Ala Mihgan plight".

The new Emperor though, he alone is why I'm now against the Empire. He is even willing to kill everyone who opposes him now. Possibly even his own subjects. A fact Gaius opposed once when he spoke out against the meteor project.

Darnus may have had the idea but it was indorsed and authorised by the Garlean leadership. Gaius was very careful in what he did in 1.0 to opposed the plan since he was walking very close to being a traitor. Gaius saw the total destruction of Eorzea as unnecessary, not the destruction of the beast tribes.

Half the behaviour of the beasttribes is due to the Garlean invasion. The Sylphs are only summoning Ramuh cause Garleans from the local Castrum keep invading their lands. The Sahagin had to invade Limsan lands after the Meteor project destroyed their old spawning grounds. The Kobalds only summoned Titan due to hostile attacks on their lands.

As for Ala Mhigo, I don't think Regula was even in Ala Mhigo. Regardless Gaius was the administrator and it was under his watch that the treatment of the Ala Mhigans took place. Also we don't just have Ilberd as our source we have several including the Ala Mhigan fellow in Revenant's Toll who was used as slave labour while his sister and mother were used to 'entertain' the soldiers. They threw themselves off a cliff rather than get recaptured.

I agree that I don't think Gaius was completely irredeemable. I think in a rather arrogant and twisted fashion his intentions had some noble qualities. Further, I don't expect the Garleans to remain a simple one dimensional evil. I think the factions within Garlemald will eventually show us a more broad range of opinions.

Way to miss the stab I mad about how being too critical of hubris is a form of hubris. Ah, well. Subtlety was never my strong suit.

Cid kinda strikes me as a petulant manchild, at least where Garlemald is concerned. More in general, the idealism of our protagonists comes across as stubborn and baseless, like they can never admit that the villains have even the tiniest bit of a point even when it's obvious to we, the audience. Fact of the matter is, we've had two FFXII's worth of MSQ volume and still haven't seen much progress breaking through the Empire's painfully thin veneer of generic evil. Clock's ticking.

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Originally Posted by Fenral

Way to miss the stab I mad about how being too critical of hubris is a form of hubris. Ah, well. Subtlety was never my strong suit.

Cid kinda strikes me as a petulant manchild, at least where Garlemald is concerned. More in general, the idealism of our protagonists comes across as stubborn and baseless, like they can never admit that the villains have even the tiniest bit of a point even when it's obvious to we, the audience. Fact of the matter is, we've had two FFXII's worth of MSQ volume and still haven't seen much progress breaking through the Empire's painfully thin veneer of generic evil. Clock's ticking.

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We are dealing with a much more fleshed out world as is the case in most MMOs. The Garleans have been an overarching threat but we haven't really even gotten into them in detail yet. Hell, we bearly actually even fought any real Garleans in 2.x. It was mainly just leves. Garlean culture is something we have only gotten a slight glimpse into in the same way we really only had a surface understanding of Ishgard prior to HW.

Garlemald's time will come. They cant do everyone at the same time.

Found an Artwork on the Wiki, though I guess it is already known.

http://i.imgur.com/5W0V1vD.jpg

Question is, who are these 3 Figures below the Warring Triad?

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Originally Posted by Mwynn

Found an Artwork on the Wiki, though I guess it is already known.

http://i.imgur.com/5W0V1vD.jpg

Question is, who are these 3 Figures below the Warring Triad?

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The Warriors of Light? Not sure who else would stand clearly in opposition to the Triad.

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Originally Posted by Mwynn

Question is, who are these 3 Figures below the Warring Triad?

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DRGlander, Estinien, and Alphinaud? Definitely Alphinaud judging by the hair. Definitely two Dragoons, so I'd assume Estinien.

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Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

The Warriors of Light? Not sure who else would stand clearly in opposition to the Triad.

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I don't think they're standing in opposition, I think that's more discovering the statues on the Flagship... Despite my memory being us flying there alone...

That artwork was from the TGS fan kits, Day 3 if you check it on the Lodestone. It's definitely 3.0 related, so yeah, probably Est and Alph.

That Dragoon looks like he's about to use our Spear Throw technique though. Not sure why you'd throw a spear at a statue.

I never wanted sephiroth to actually be in the game, but I think I'd like the idea of Fiend borrowing a few aspects of Sephiroth.

Considering i've never met him, i find fighting Fiend a more interesting idea than Sephiroth.

(Geez, this is the whole M.Bison/Vega/Balrog mix up again, isn't it? :( )

Nael van Darnus was exactly like Sephiroth in every aspect. Yoshida modeled Nael after Sephiroth.

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Originally Posted by Naraku_Diabolos

Nael van Darnus was exactly like Sephiroth in every aspect. Yoshida modeled Nael after Sephiroth.

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That's not true! Neal didn't use a sword:P

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Originally Posted by Belhi

That's not true! Neal didn't use a sword:P

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The length of Masemune is identical to a spear and the way it's weilded are the same forms as how a quarter staff would be used when held towards the rear.

A sword he may have been wielding, but Sephiroth's favors a Lance weilded more than a sword wielder.

Notice in that pic the right side DRG is black/crimsom? Definitely Estinian.

So now we know what Sephirot looks like: a big angry monster with six arms, a tail, and bulging muscles.
http://img.finalfantasyxiv.com/t/fcf...e6152a85_0.png
(Image courtesy of the JP Lodestone)

The fight should be interesting to say the least!

Fits the artwork thought I'm a bit disappointed in the legs. When I saw the old FF image I had visions of him being a monstrosity bursting out of the ground.

I'm more interested in that arena. That root looks like it's been twisted with Allagan tech, but is it growing, being destroyed, or is the tech acting like a nourishment source (like a long-term pot)?

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Originally Posted by WyrahFhurrst

So now we know what Sephirot looks like: a big angry monster with six arms, a tail, and bulging muscles.
http://img.finalfantasyxiv.com/t/fcf...e6152a85_0.png
(Image courtesy of the JP Lodestone)

The fight should be interesting to say the least!

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is it just me or does Sephirot look like Asura?