Relic quest streamlined

After all the hardwork to get one...I would hate to see it nerfed like mad.
That isn't to say, Im against any and every nerf. I for one think the whole relic thing sometimes harms the game, especially for new players...its very daunting. Yes, you don't have to have a relic...but at the end of the day it's content >.< everyone loves content!

"I payed 1000$ for this TV. But now it costs 750$. What a rip off!"

Well, almost like that. With time new stuff replaces the old. And the old gets cheaper.
I dont know if that will happen here though. But if might. Maybe not. Who knows? SE probably, but they won't tell... Yet.

Personally I can't see that a new weapon will replace the old ones.
But then again, I could never imagine that the look of the weapons would change in the end (Zodiac).


Edit: changed it a little. ^^

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Originally Posted by Evergrey

"I payed 1000$ for this TV. But now it's on sale for 750$. What a rip off!"

Well, almost like that. With time new stuff replaces the old. And the old gets cheaper.
I dont know if that will happen here though. But if might. Maybe not. Who knows? SE probably, but they won't tell... Yet.

Personally I can't see that a new weapon will replace the old ones.
(Zodiac).

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lol. thats a good analogy. But i would change it a little, cause "being on sale" means its temporary. Its more like "I bought this 60 LED HD TV few years ago when HD TV's were still pretty new for $1000, now the same type of tv's are going for $200 to $300, its not fair. I want new buyers to spend the same amount of time to save up the money and pay the same price that I paid for mine. And I want SE to let me trade in my old TV for a new model free of charge because I was one of the first to buy it so they should honor me." Sounds silly, right?

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Originally Posted by QiLymePye

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-hehe- Yes, I know my choice of word were not the best (sale). But, it's new year. Had some drinks and just wanted to add my thought to this topic. ^^
Happy New Year!


Edit: I edited the original post. ^^

Nerfs I see happening with high likelihood:
atma drop rate increased to above 50%
atma book cost decreased to less than 200 "current" tomestones (whatever they may be)
faster repop of atma book FATEs
reduced number of enemies required to kill for atma book
reduced cost of alexandrite maps from tomestones and allied seals
reduced amount of light needed to progress to nexus
Zodiac weapon dungeon item drop rate increased to above 30%
Zodiac weapon tomestone requirement reduced by at least 1/2
Zodiac weapon GC seal requirement reduced by at least 1/2
Zodiac weapon gil purchased item requirement reduced marginally

Nerfs that are possible but not as likely:
reduced number of dungeons to run for atma book
extremely easy way to "farm" alexandrite in large quantities, such as much higher drop rate from FATEs, purchased directly with gil/GC seals/tomestones, or guaranteed/high % drops from dungeons
reduction of nexus light requirement to 500 light or less
reduced number of dungeon drops for Zodiac weapon required

Nerfs which are extremely unlikely:
reduced number of atma required
reduced number of atma books required
reduced number of alexandrite required
reduced number of HQ crafted mats for Zodiac required

I think a possible solution to the Zodiac weapon continuation in 3.0 is an "alternative" quest that is available upon the release of the main Zodiac quest in 3.0. The reward of this quest is a fully upgraded Zodiac weapon with the same name as the final Zodiac weapon from 2.x but with the original stat distribution of the vanilla relic. The "punishment" for players who took this shortcut is the fact that their fully upgraded Zodiac weapon will have terrible stats compared to people who customized their weapons properly by doing all the 2.x quests and will not have the opportunity to recustomize it until much later in the 3.0 Zodiac quest line.

^ I totes would love for my 2nd relic (hehe) the infusions of the Sphere Scroll to be changed...instead of +1 stat each time...it+ the value of the materia...so you don't need 75 materia's xDD

DO IT SE...save me some money :P My pockets are still empty from MNK Zodiac

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Originally Posted by axemtitanium

I think a possible solution to the Zodiac weapon continuation in 3.0 is an "alternative" quest that is available upon the release of the main Zodiac quest in 3.0. The reward of this quest is a fully upgraded Zodiac weapon with the same name as the final Zodiac weapon from 2.x but with the original stat distribution of the vanilla relic. The "punishment" for players who took this shortcut is the fact that their fully upgraded Zodiac weapon will have terrible stats compared to people who customized their weapons properly by doing all the 2.x quests and will not have the opportunity to recustomize it until much later in the 3.0 Zodiac quest line.

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See thats not gonna work, cause you would be punishing new players and new players to be. Now what i think that could be a compromise is to have existing relics ba able to be turned in for maybe some type of materia or something that will give your new relic additional stats depending on lvl of relic turned in. That I can deal with, because people that put in time will have at least something for the time, or they could just keep the weapon and glamour it. But to force new players or slower players to backtrack will be problematic.

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Originally Posted by QiLymePye

See thats not gonna work, cause you would be punishing new players and new players to be. Now what i think that could be a compromise is to have existing relics ba able to be turned in for maybe some type of materia or something that will give your new relic additional stats depending on lvl of relic turned in. That I can deal with, because people that put in time will have at least something for the time, or they could just keep the weapon and glamour it. But to force new players or slower players to backtrack will be problematic.

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I don't think they were necessarily saying the new or slower players have to backtrack... that wouldn't really be the proper words to use. Essentially, it would be kind of like what you suggested. The players who have the newest and shiniest relic going into 3.0 would be able to keep the customized stats on their relics. Those who are still on Novus, Nexus or Zodiac (which will be outdated as soon as 2.5/2.51 comes out) could either trade in their current relic for an upgraded relic weapon with no stat customizations, or complete quests that have been made easier to finish their relic to the point coming out in 2.5/2.51, and then maybe continue it on the same quest line as the 3.0 relic, but with the customized stats. New players or new players to be aren't being punished at all really, they simply have a choice, either do the relic quest line from 2.0-2.5/2.51 made easier, or just skip all that and get a relic weapon from the 3.0 without the customized stats, just the stats in the base line ilvl 80 relic, only buffed up to be on par with the ilvl the new relic begins at.

This isn't punishment, it's choices. Either spend time to customize, or skip that and take what you're given. Either way, you have the new relic weapon, just the people who would like to feel that their time, gil, and effort weren't just a waste would get their wish. Also, your suggestion is quite viable and good too. Just trade in your current relic for a material, or maybe a scroll, or book, or some other meaningless medium with no real rhyme or reason, which will alter the 3.0 relic's stats to those of your 2.5/2.51 relic weapon, and make those stats 3.0 equivalent. In essence, just continuing what has already been worked on so hard. So yeah, both of your suggestions were really the same, only you kind of just got hung up on the punishment part. In the end, it's really the same results with the same effect. I don't think Axe was suggesting that they do away entirely with the 2.0-2.5/2.51 relic line, just that they give the option of either taking the easy way out, or putting in some work (much less work than what players who already have Zodiac have put in) to be able to customize your relic weapon.

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Originally Posted by Pomelo

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Unfortunately, this is the problem with relic weapons. Having long steps (like nexus or atma) was somewhat fine when it was current content, or the highest step at the time. Now you're looking at doing the same grind for a non-BiS item which can get eclipsed by a tomestone/primal weapon.

Yeah I chose the wrong word. "Punishment" isn't what I'm going for. "Missing out" is closer. Players who opt for the easy "skip to final stage" relic quest "miss out" on the ability to customize their stats to what they want.

Wow. Did not expect this but loving how the thread went. The uh scrolls to customize the stats... Is there a place that has that step detailed to get the best possible set ups for each weapon or is kinda you're on your own?

But ya to help newer players I'd like them to reduce costs or raise the RNG rates to reduce the amount of time people have to spend on each stage. The amount of enemies you kill I don't see changing since even during the relic reborn you had to kill 8 of each enemy.

They may change the dungeons you have to go to for some steps. But ultimately at some point I think they will add in a skip step that takes you to a later stage but without the customized stats.

With linear content like this, they'll have to eventually make it easier just so there's enough people to catch up. New content is made hard and eases as it is replaced.

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Originally Posted by Coatl

Idk I would be pretty happy if they made all the quests easier. I have a zodiac weapon so far, a Nexus, a novus and an up and coming animus for my WHM so you bet I would be thrilled if they made some steps easier.

No one complained when they nerfed atmas unless to complain about it not happening sooner.

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My plan is to hopefully be done with animus and novus b4 patch 2.5. Then I can do zodiac and nexus stage at the same time ( because I already have a zodiac ). So between doing the zodiac part and running the crap out of 2.5 content, my nexus should be a breeze and should both wrap up at the same time maybe.

I would be thrilled also if they ease up on this crap, I in no way wish others to have the same pain xD

A good solution would be to make the steps post atma doable at the same time. So when you start gathering animus books you could gather alexandrite, gain zodiac light and do the dungeon quests at the same time. They would have to tweak the quest so that it's the zodiac glass gathering light and not the weapon itself. I think it's a good compromise, nothing is directly made easier. Just a bit of multitasking.

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Originally Posted by t-a-l-a-n-m-e-r-c-e-r

A good solution would be to make the steps post atma doable at the same time. So when you start gathering animus books you could gather alexandrite, gain zodiac light and do the dungeon quests at the same time. They would have to tweak the quest so that it's the zodiac glass gathering light and not the weapon itself. I think it's a good compromise, nothing is directly made easier. Just a bit of multitasking.

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You can already do that for every single step except for Nexus light, for 2nd relic and beyond. Alexandrite can be stocked up forever and the Zodiac quest items are stackable too so you can basically have those 4 repeatable quests active forever in case you get roulette'd into a required dungeon and have a chance at the dungeon drop.

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Originally Posted by axemtitanium

You can already do that for every single step except for Nexus light, for 2nd relic and beyond. Alexandrite can be stocked up forever and the Zodiac quest items are stackable too so you can basically have those 4 repeatable quests active forever in case you get roulette'd into a required dungeon and have a chance at the dungeon drop.

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Last I checked, the zodiac items (dungeon drop ones, which honestly are the only ones worth talking about in the entire step) are quest items; you can't stack them or store them away.

The Flawless Alexandrite, Book of Skylight, etc. rewards from the repeatable quests are stackable.

Nerf: "Oh hey, my retainer just brought me another Flawless Alexandrite again" *discards*