What is a Bard?

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Originally Posted by dramamine

I just hit 50 with my bard. I was gonna start a new thread, but this seems like a good place to ask:

For those of you who sing in DF/PF groups, are there any rules of thumb/mental flowcharts/whatever you use to decide when to sing which songs, or do you kind of play it by ear?

I can think of a few obvious conditions for singing in general. if there are SMN or BLM in your party, be a lot more aggressive with your offensive cooldowns during bosses and sing when you're waiting for them to come back. Mages ballad any times healer MP gets low. army's paeon for big pulls in dungeons, esp when the other DD is also a TP user. Are there any other less obvious cases where it's a good idea to sing?

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you simply use them when needed, lazy bards are told when mana song is required, good bards actually watch the parties mp usage... and i just wish the TP guage showed for all party members, since i'd watch that too.....

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Originally Posted by dramamine

I just hit 50 with my bard. I was gonna start a new thread, but this seems like a good place to ask:

For those of you who sing in DF/PF groups, are there any rules of thumb/mental flowcharts/whatever you use to decide when to sing which songs, or do you kind of play it by ear?

I can think of a few obvious conditions for singing in general. if there are SMN or BLM in your party, be a lot more aggressive with your offensive cooldowns during bosses and sing when you're waiting for them to come back. Mages ballad any times healer MP gets low. army's paeon for big pulls in dungeons, esp when the other DD is also a TP user. Are there any other less obvious cases where it's a good idea to sing?

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The things is your MP that require for sing doesn't regenerate as fast as those DoM, so, you have to look at the party is the tank require much heal? Is the healer experience enough to manage their mp? Do this party need excessively heal? and normally you don't have to give a shit to other DPS cause if their are DoM they can manage themselves. If the tank require more heal, healer is new, or your party tends to run into AoE or have a hard time dealing with AoE, you might want to save your MB for the harder fight like the boss or so. If all is save extra MP for healer is not required you may sing FR. In heavy AoE situation you may want to use AP but as far as I can tell AP is useless even in an extra large pull in BFHM speed run!

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Originally Posted by DishSoap

A miserable little pile of music!

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But enough singing… Have at you!

Bard is a DPS role with a sub-role of Support.

More jobs should have the same sort of split IMHO.

Is this a ranting about Bard's performance?

We seek to max out dps like all other damage dealing roles with only 2 support skills. I don't see how this should be called a "support" role.

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Originally Posted by Squa11_Leonhart

you simply use them when needed, lazy bards are told when mana song is required, good bards actually watch the parties mp usage... and i just wish the TP guage showed for all party members, since i'd watch that too.....

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seeing tp would be nice, but then you get to see some drgs go from 1000 to 200 in 15 seconds spamming AOE. to answer dramamine tho, usually the best time to sing changes all the time. if a healers mp is getting close to half, sing. if its you and a smn/blm in a party, sing foes every chance you get. whm might also join in to help move things along. if you have used invig and you are coming close to needing it again, but its not up, then the tank may also need it. tp song time.

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Originally Posted by Kaze3434

seeing tp would be nice, but then you get to see some drgs go from 1000 to 200 in 15 seconds spamming AOE. to answer dramamine tho, usually the best time to sing changes all the time. if a healers mp is getting close to half, sing. if its you and a smn/blm in a party, sing foes every chance you get. whm might also join in to help move things along. if you have used invig and you are coming close to needing it again, but its not up, then the tank may also need it. tp song time.

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Actually, most of my whm friends prefer to use shroud at half mp and save bard mp for manasong in possible critical moments.

Yea. I would only ballad in a few situations. Dead time in a fight, for example. Doesn't really hurt to ballad then. Healers in triple digit MP? May want to ballad. But even then it's not necessarily needed. WHM may be able to shroud or pop an ether pot. SCH may have aetherflow to pop and then can energy drain. Usually healers will ask if they actually need it. Because often it can look like they do, but they, in fact, do not.

Often the only times to ballad are dead time (nothing to DPS) or when a healer is solo healing a fight that is intended for 2 healers. Depending on the fight that 1 healer may need ballad. Depends how intensive the fight is and how good they are.

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Originally Posted by Squa11_Leonhart

Actually, most of my whm friends prefer to use shroud at half mp and save bard mp for manasong in possible critical moments.

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all the whms i have played with do it the other way around lol. for myself when playing on whm unless im playing with someone i know, i try not to trust df or pf bards to sing at all, even when needed.

Bard is a jack of all trades, it can DPS, but not as good as DRG/MNK, it can AOE, but not as good as BLM, it can DOT, but not as good as SMN.

A bard is a DPS job that trades off some of its raw DPS in exchange for utility (songs) and stable damage output in nearly all situations. Look at any DPS job and you'll see a sliding scale between raw output and utility.

Certain jobs are very fussy about range, buffs, movement, flanking, etc.; bards don't have to deal with any of that.

Songs are super useful. I'm not certain what reality people here are playing in where TP and MP regen aren't needed, but it's not the same experience I've had or seen.