Time limit to re-enter dungeons

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Originally Posted by Richard

unless you know you have a 'linkshell' of all like minded people who have the same playtimes?

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You are telling me you have a linkshell that consists of people that plays 20 hours a day and will only spam dungeons everyday? more power to you then.

Majority of players probably doesn't play that way.

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Originally Posted by Richard

the word "force" is not mmo friendly.

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You must really hate Star Wars MMORPGs then!

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Originally Posted by Misha

Sorry you fail at the concept of freedom... usually these low IQ people make me laugh but you people are pathetic and hopeless. We have the freedom to do what we want in the game! This is great news for casuals and people who plays lots... if you don't wanna plow through content SUPER FAST then DON'T do it... is it hard to understand? ugggh, I usually laugh at low IQ's like this but I feel all disgusted now lmao Have fun... complaining... about... freedom!

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[Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XIV FORUM Guidelines.]

Anyways I can see where both sides are coming from but there needs to exist some risk in all this. You should at least have to get some sort of item to enter.

[Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XIV FORUM Guidelines.]

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Originally Posted by Richard

I never said there was anything wrong with lesser skilled groups being able to accomplish the same goals. There is this whole thing called risk vs reward - something that games like XI got right in some areas. Games like WoW got it completely wrong due to the fact that if you wiped you just immediately got up and tried again. If you can consistently spam dungeons 20 times per day you will eventually, no matter how bad of a player you are, break that learning curve faster and finish the content quicker. The faster you blow through content the longer you will have to wait for more things to come out.

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Again we don't know the about any of the risks or rewards yet for these raids and the 5 minute re-entry timer could be well balanced to the drop rate of the good items. Also if you are a bad player who improves their gaming through practice and experience, I really would not think of them as a very bad player at all but rather someone who progresses slower then most. I would be satisfied for now with something to do a few times regularly with some good friends when they are on over worrying about how well other people are doing inside the raids and what they got before you.

I'm sure even with a 3 day wait timer, there will be a few insane groups of players who will come out and burn through all the content quickly and go back to complaining how there wasn't enough. There is no extra rewards for being first to finish the new content so if the released content is not enough for your standards, you could probably enjoy doing the content of an additional game that you find enjoying.

im having a dejavu right now with NM respawn = 5min 1k replys hate battles .

POPCORN WORTHY threads.

bring it on ª.ª

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Originally Posted by Demacia

Maybe the dungeons will require some sort of item or currency to enter? Otherwise yeah it's a bit iffy. No risk all reward.

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I would like some sort of item actually.

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Originally Posted by Zkieve

im having a dejavu right now with NM respawn = 5min 1k replys hate battles .

POPCORN WORTHY threads.

bring it on ª.ª

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With drop rates like that I don't give a fuck lol. I hated NM farming in XI, though the rarity of actually getting what you wanted did make it a lot more satisfying (but frustrating).

Guys before you start thinking you can do it 50 times a day, remember there may be some form of currency required to enter like BCNMs.

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Considering you can get full on 1shotted and its already confirmed if you return you get taken out the dungeon or if you dc you go out the dungeon, its no surprised.

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They never said you can't re-enter all they said is you will log back in at the entrance (outside). Secondly why would you return when everyone should have raise.

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Also what if I want to spend the night dungeoning? Why should I be forced to do 1 then do another hours/days later? Why cant I blast out 3-4 runs in 1 night (3-4 hours that is respectively) and if its hard good, it will make completing worthwhile, and then we can do something else next day or whatever since I have busy RL so I cant play a lot, thus being able to do things when I want and not when SE wants is absolute win.

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Still shortening content life expectancy no matter what spin you put on it.

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Plus you need a minimum of 8 to enter, you are not always going to be able to keep 8 people on all the time or have 8 friends who play 24/7, some might, but i dont really. I dont want to join randomers due to the shitty loot system so sometimes I am forced to wait due to the nature of not everyone is online.

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There are more linkshells on each server than I can count on 2 hands that have more than 15 people online at all times. The only people who will have this problem are those that a) have no LS or b) play 1 hour a day.

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A lot of you are way too worried about people boosting them out in a day or week and then complaining again, why you care!?!!? Thats gunna happen either way "omg so bored of dungeons, finished them all, wtf this shit?" or "WTF? 24hr timer? Just finished one and was so fun now im forced to wait another day until I can do it again?"

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Im not worried about other people saying this because IM SAYING THIS. I also know everyone in my LS is saying this and I know of 10~15 other linkshells off the top of my head who are saying this.

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When there is enough content, then we can have timers. Dynamis was fine being 3 day because there was other things to do during that time. This game has nothing to do during that time so dont ruin it!

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Beastmen settlements/strongholds, company quests, new leveling system, other dungeons, frontier hubs and more side quests? we wont have content 1.18 ~ 1.19? You must have forgotten all that stuff.

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Originally Posted by Chinook

New info concerning dungeons. The wait time between every new dungeon attempt will be of 5 minutes. Based on the information at hand, it will be possible to complete the dungeon and re-enter after.



I'm speechless ...

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If that is accurate then how it will be with the reply we got here, I dont want to quote it so pardon me. It was something like this : Who first come, first serve.

I think it is not important to know now anyway. patch day after tomorrow.

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Originally Posted by Misha

Sorry you fail at the concept of freedom... usually these low IQ people make me laugh but you people are pathetic and hopeless. We have the freedom to do what we want in the game! This is great news for casuals and people who plays lots... if you don't wanna plow through content SUPER FAST then DON'T do it... is it hard to understand? ugggh, I usually laugh at low IQ's like this but I feel all disgusted now lmao Have fun... complaining... about... freedom!

/block

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oh man insufferable underage white girl indeed rofl

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Originally Posted by Misha

Sorry you fail at the concept of freedom... usually these low IQ people make me laugh but you people are pathetic and hopeless.

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Are you praising your own IQ? If you would have a higher IQ than a chicken, you wouldnt laugh at different oppinions.

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Originally Posted by Misha

We have the freedom to do what we want in the game!

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Who is "we"? Your imaginary friend?

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Originally Posted by Misha

This is great news for casuals and people who plays lots... if you don't wanna plow through content SUPER FAST then DON'T do it... is it hard to understand?

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That is your personal oppinion and yes, it is great news for casuals. But you forget any Sideeffect which can go along with a fast re-enter posibility. If you would have an high IQ like you are trying to say, you would try to watch at things out of different views.

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Originally Posted by Misha

ugggh, I usually laugh at low IQ's like this but I feel all disgusted now lmao Have fun... complaining... about... freedom!

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That just made me loosing any respect into your person. Its just a foolish statement to do. Let everyone have their oppinion, let everyone discuss and speculate about things and be constructive. THAT is freedom. Get real please or you will lower the image you gave everyone from yourself, even more.

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Originally Posted by Demacia

With drop rates like that I don't give a fuck lol. I hated NM farming in XI, though the rarity of actually getting what you wanted did make it a lot more satisfying (but frustrating).

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like i said everything have its pros and cons, arguing everything is super 100% is completely selfish and one sided.

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Originally Posted by Wolfie

And you think with a 8-24 hour lockout, the same equally lucky linkshells won't be done long before the other guys?

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longer lockout = extended life of content and % of gaining loot goes down. Simple math.

Never mind

If these are used to exp, good.

If this is the end-all endgame content, meh. Doubt it tho.

5 minute feel like a joke to me. Besides, if they are really so hard, maybe isn't a bad thing after all. Let's wait and see

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Originally Posted by Nero

Are you praising your own IQ? If you would have a higher IQ than a chicken, you wouldnt laugh at different oppinions.



Who is "we"? Your imaginary friend?



That is your personal oppinion and yes, it is great news for casuals. But you forget any Sideeffect which can go along with a fast re-enter posibility. If you would have an high IQ like you are trying to say, you would try to watch at things out of different views.



That just made me loosing any respect into your person. Its just a foolish statement to do. Let everyone have their oppinion, let everyone discuss and speculate about things and be constructive. THAT is freedom. Get real please or you will lower the image you gave everyone from yourself, even more.

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I think I found a video of the person you're quoting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8CjZt-xSLI

At least 10 years in the future though.

The only reasonable explanation for such a short lockout timer would be that they want people to give lots of feedback and quickly about the dungeons and how they work so SE can optimize future ones.

If the other dungeons added in 1.19~1.20 are also 5 minutes - Yoshida needs to rethink things. He totes about EverQuest all the time and wants to add things from it. This is not EQesque. This is even more casual than Hello Kitty Online.

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Originally Posted by Richard

longer lockout = extended life of content and % of gaining loot goes down. Simple math.

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No it doesn't. Chance of loot remains the same regardless of the amount of time between trials. The super-lucky linkshell that would have gotten full drops for all their 8 members in X amount of runs would get it the same regardless if they had to wait 0 minutes between runs or 8-24 hours.

It DOES extend the life of the content, you're right. But you're not the ultimate judge on how long content should last. For every person that wants a lockout, and to only be able to have one attempt a day or whatever, there's at least another person who wants to have unlimited attempts a day (and vice versa).

The BALANCED solution to that, of course, is to give a short lockout to allow for multiple attempts, because you can police yourself to only have one attempt a day when the content has a short lockout; but you can't get in multiple attempts a day if the lockout is long.

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Originally Posted by Demacia

I think I found a video of the person you're quoting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8CjZt-xSLI

At least 10 years in the future though.

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i lol'd. XD

and i totally agree with Richard. There is the posibility that SE will change the Timer in the Future with more Dungeons and Content. We have to see, if they will do.. but for now im curious how the Dungoens will work out... we will know very, very soon.

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Originally Posted by TonyMontana

Guys before you start thinking you can do it 50 times a day, remember there may be some form of currency required to enter like BCNMs.

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Exactly, not much is known now aside from the fact that you can run dungeons however you want, so if you work and don't have much time during the week can do a few runs in a row on a day off. Or if a friend invites/wants/needs you, you can just go ahead and do it with no worries^^ Especially useful if you have friends from all regions of the worlds so you don't have to coordinate specific times :)

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Originally Posted by Wolfie

No it doesn't. Chance of loot remains the same regardless of the amount of time between trials. The super-lucky linkshell that would have gotten full drops for all their 8 members in X amount of runs would get it the same regardless if they had to wait 0 minutes between runs or 8-24 hours.

It DOES extend the life of the content, you're right. But you're not the ultimate judge on how long content should last. For every person that wants a lockout, and to only be able to have one attempt a day or whatever, there's at least another person who wants to have unlimited attempts a day (and vice versa).

The BALANCED solution to that, of course, is to give a short lockout to allow for multiple attempts, because you can police yourself to only have one attempt a day when the content has a short lockout; but you can't get in multiple attempts a day if the lockout is long.

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so again players have to "police" themselves and force themselves to stretch out content. you're right the company shouldn't be in-charge of that. [size=30]LIKE IN EVERY OTHER MMO[/size].

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Originally Posted by Richard

This is even more casual than Hello Kitty Online.

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XDDDDDD,

altought i must have missed were he said he wanted EQ type game , all i see is he is making it super casual friendly game and alienating all the hardcore gamers (altought the second part he does not say it , but he is doing it regardless).Not saying is good or bad but i saw this coming since the guy sit on the leader couch.

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Originally Posted by TonyMontana

Guys before you start thinking you can do it 50 times a day, remember there may be some form of currency required to enter like BCNMs.

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There is no god damned currency to enter. How many times do the devs have to post that? Do you people not read??

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Originally Posted by yukikaze_yanagi

5 minute feel like a joke to me. Besides, if they are really so hard, maybe isn't a bad thing after all. Let's wait and see

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Exactly what I was thinking...

What if these things are insanely difficult (like pre-pre-nerf CoP missions) and/or have very low item drop rates?


Wait and see I guess.


BTW, where is it confirmed that there are no item/quest reqs for entering these things?

Casual is the way to go.

The changes aren't really changes for the casual though. Too bad.

Short re-enter time means = those with more time on their hands benefit the most. This isn't casual.

Casual would be a weekly lock-out timer with excellent drop rates and forgiving difficulty.

Similar to how abolishing fatigue and introducing exp bonus for not playing helps hardcore and punishes casuals. Yet people don't get it. Brilliant.

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Originally Posted by Richard

if this is accurate then I think that was the seal on the coffin for XIV.

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I fail to see the problem. This aligns with Yoshi's goal of making us able to play the game the way we want.

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Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah

Casual is the way to go.

The changes aren't really changes for the casual though. Too bad.

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1 hour timer (after their window) is extremely casual. 5 minutes is beyond insanity for something yoshida himself considers a raid or dungeon.

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Originally Posted by Richard

so again players have to "police" themselves and force themselves to stretch out content. you're right the company shouldn't be in-charge of that. LIKE IN EVERY OTHER MMO.

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Why is it so wrong that you police yourself? The solution that SE put forth allows for BOTH types of players to play as much or as little as they want. NOBODY is forcing you to run these dungeons 10 times a day. Play them once a day, go out, smell the daisies, pick up some chicks, and let the shut-ins play the game all day.

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Originally Posted by Richard

There is no god damned currency to enter. How many times do the devs have to post that? Do you people not read??

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Rawwwwww. On an off topic note, are you the same Twenty Two from those old ass BG FFXI videos? Man those were something.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

I fail to see the problem. This aligns with Yoshi's goal of making us able to play the game the way we want.

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If the dungeons had a 24 hour lockout timer and people were complaining that it was too short you'd say the exact same thing.

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Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah

Casual is the way to go.

The changes aren't really changes for the casual though. Too bad.

Short re-enter time means = those with more time on their hands benefit the most. This isn't casual.

Casual would be a weekly lock-out timer with excellent drop rates and forgiving difficulty.

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the hardcore will always do what the casual can 10X times or more.The point is to let the casual experience all the game without restrictions, no limitations on entry does it well.

A casual will never achieve more than a hardcore, is a time = reward 100% of the times, the problem with hardcore vs casual is not that , is hardcore running out of content to fast.

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Originally Posted by Demacia

Rawwwwww. On an off topic note, are you the same Twenty Two from those old ass BG FFXI videos? Man those were something.

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I am not no, that would be Twentytwo Obv who is also in my LS. - a lot of the same people from the old Bahamut BG.

I have no problem whatsoever with the 5 minute restriction.

From my own personal experience I get 4-5 hours of gameplay a night. So if all I wanted to do is Dungeons (completely ignoring Companies and Settlements) then I "may" get in 2-3 full completed dungeon runs a night (keep in mind the timelimit is an hour). So for the higher rank dungeon I'll be going in with 8 different people. That means the treasure IF it drops, and IF I can use it on my class, and IF i'm next in line for that treasure would have to go 8 different ways. Don't forget there are 8 different battle classes, and there could be gear for each one of them. Don't forget that there are multiple equipment slots, and there could be dungeon gear for each slot. (weapon,feet,hands etc.) you start to multiple that by 8 jobs and all of a sudden you could look at a quite large gear pool. Now also couple that with the fact that the drop rate for some of this gear could be quite bad (think on the small NM drop rate being 10% sometimes).

With all that said, are people really concerned with being "done" with this content within a few weeks? Do the math. I don't see it happening.

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Originally Posted by Richard

1 hour timer (after their window) is extremely casual. 5 minutes is beyond insanity for something yoshida himself considers a raid or dungeon.

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Read the rest of the post.

It's not.

This also helps with linkshell that doesnt have exact 16 members, so they can cycle through people that missed out the run or there will be time when only 1 tank is available, don't only see this from your linkshell PoV that have r50s at all class, put your feet on others shoes.

The reason they NEED a 5 minute refresh timer is because these 2 new Dungeons are slated to become a new source of group SP. We're losing the benefit to grouping up and running Leves as a group, so to ease the loss of Leve-Linking, The team has given us dungeons we can run through for a constant source of good SP. No fighting for other groups for hunting grounds. No r50s running around farming SP mobs.

How is this a bad thing?

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Originally Posted by Wolfie

Why is it so wrong that you police yourself? The solution that SE put forth allows for BOTH types of players to play as much or as little as they want. NOBODY is forcing you to run these dungeons 10 times a day. Play them once a day, go out, smell the daisies, pick up some chicks, and let the shut-ins play the game all day.

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Going around in circles here - just more players telling players "go and play this way if you don't like it". notice how i'm a hardcore player and don't tell you to "play a certain way"? If the lockout was 36 hours SE wouldn't be telling you YOU CANT play the dungeon was much as you want, because you would be able to - every 36 hours.

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Originally Posted by Richard

Going around in circles here - just more players telling players "go and play this way if you don't like it". notice how i'm a hardcore player and don't tell you to "play a certain way"? If the lockout was 36 hours SE wouldn't be telling you YOU CANT play the dungeon was much as you want, because you would be able to - every 36 hours.

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36 hours is not enough if you have a group of 8 people that want to SP together, and as Yoshi-P stated, Dungeons are going to be a viable way to get group SP. Honestly, we should have seen this coming.