Why are they nerfing content already?

why would they not nerf content?

t1-5 is old hat. there's no point in denying it to people once t6-9 is out and all the serious raiders have moved on to bigger and better things.

I for one am happy with the system. New content comes out to keep those interested in progression busy, while old content becomes more accessible to those who can't/haven't done it yet.

I'd get bored pretty quick with a system where I get gear and it's the best forever. What is there to work towards after you get the best gear? Why have the best gear if there is no new challenge with which to utilize it?

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Originally Posted by MaethusXion

You act like there were actually bees in the fight in the first place.

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*high five* Somebody else gets it :D

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Originally Posted by Mikara

Then transfer to his server and get it.

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Depending how much he had, I'd totally make a few characters there, load them up, and jump them all to my home server.

The hell is wrong with people, I'm surprised how much patience the developers of this game have. They are giving you NEW content for all those leet hardcore players that wiz by the game at lightspeed. They are nerfing OLD content that you as a pro player won't do anymore anyways because it's insignificant so that people who don't play as much or aren't as gifted holding a controller or playing with a keyboard, have the option to see more of the game. This way everyone is a winner.

I know the truth though, these threads are created for the 'oh no now everyone will have the gear i worked so hard to get' reason :p
If that's the case I'm happy they make it easier to get i90 stuff, it makes us i90 people a reason to get the ilv 115 stuff etc instead of being stuck like so many other games.

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Originally Posted by ulti_19

*Undeniable truth*

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Well, you need to take into account that for those people, it's not enough for them to beat things as quickly as possible to whine that there's no content: they need to step on the "noobs" too. Giving those bums a chance to not stay so far behind and do the same things in the game as the glorious them is clearly an outrageous insult!

I wonder about the future if a new player enters the game, plays up until 50 then plays the latest i55 dungeon that hands out i200/300/400+ tomes for the latest gear and pretty much skips a huge amount of content that was in the game previously, challenging or not. I fear that the future players might not even play older content, like asking someone decked out in the latest max ilevel gear a question about Wanderer's Palace and having them go "what's that?".

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

oh well at least demon wall will be more like the actual demon wall bees were never in his fight!

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There never were any bees to begin with, only gnats. [/smartass]

I think ppl seem to forgot that they are also looking at ppl who leave after 1-2 wipes in primal fights, lack of patience from vet players, things that say that they don't have time for new players to learn, adapt, get better at the game. Usually those who say that they don't like the idea are the same ppl who won't have the time to help the casual players, that's how I see things. At the same time ppl don't want to go through that old content the moment new content comes in. Do u think ppl will go back to coil 1-5 once they have the gear they want? How about extreme primals, hard mode primals, etc. Are vet players gonna go back and guide constant new players to learn the mechanics and help them get better? I know ppl will say yeah, but how long do u think that will last?

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Originally Posted by ulti_19

Said things

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Pretty much its some weird insecurity that a few mmo player have about new players catching them or not having to do the same amount of work they did to get gear etc.. I used to be like that then I grew up.

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Originally Posted by NotTheNameIWanted

The first expansion isn't even out yet. There's no point in doing challenging content when they nerf it before it's completely outdated.

Really, really bad sign for the direction the game is going to take imo.

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Get out then. We need less players with your attitude.

Reason because its a smart move.

They don't want it to end up like final fantasy 11, where new people join and the older players already beat stuff and didn't do other content, they tried to fix it with 1000 exp bonus if you helped with Cop but nobody came to help, then same with the past everyone did the stuff didn't come back dynamis same thing.

You have a lot of players who couldn't catch up with anyone else in game so what else is there to do but quit the game SE loses revenue and they aren't gonna do that because your subscription doesn't out weigh the many, so if you quit see you later but if not quit crying.

I don't see why people complain about AK's gnats anyway. When's the last time anyone actually killed them? The tank grabs them, and everyone just DPS's the wall. Heck, get a group of I80+ people and you'll likely never even see the gnats you kill it so fast.

I'd also like to say that people that have BC 1-5 and the Extreme Primals on farm are in large part to blame for these nerfs. You complain about them nerfing the content so causal people can participate more and yet when was the last time you let one of these people into your group? Almost every single Turn 4, 5 and Ex Primals PF group I see demand experience and threaten to kick if people make any mistakes. If people weren't so exclusive with this content, then maybe SE could have left it alone. As is, these buffs will give these excluded people a way to start groups of their own without having to beg you to include them. And sure, they can make learning groups now, but in my experience, those groups never last long. I've been further in titan Ex in a DF group than I have in PF learning groups.

Anyway, maybe next time a player sends you a tell saying "Hey, I watched a video, but I've never done this before", you'll think twice about just scoffing and not responding. Then again, you probably won't.

2.1 is old and busted.
2.2 is new hotness.

Screw Costa del Sol I wanna go to Doma please.

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Originally Posted by Versiroth

I don't see why people complain about AK's gnats anyway. When's the last time anyone actually killed them?

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Did AK yesterday for my relic on my ilvl 72 PLD. The DF group I got consisted of a SMN in fairly good gear (at the very least had 3 ilvl 90 AF1.5 pieces, I never checked his equips so can't say about accessories), a DRG in ilvl 55 WP and AK drops, and a WHM in similar ilvl gear as the DRG. Killed the adds because of the lack of DPS, not everyone is Ilvl65+ to just burn the boss.

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Originally Posted by File2ish

Did AK yesterday for my relic on my ilvl 72 PLD. The DF group I got consisted of a SMN in fairly good gear (at the very least had 3 ilvl 90 AF1.5 pieces, I never checked his equips so can't say about accessories), a DRG in ilvl 55 WP and AK drops, and a WHM in similar ilvl gear as the DRG. Killed the adds because of the lack of DPS, not everyone is Ilvl65+ to just burn the boss.

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This is true, but it doesn't really depend solely on item level. The group composition and competence are a greater factor in this case. Killing the gnats wasn't a huge hassle to start, but if it helps keep the focus on the wall by getting rid of them entirely I'm all for it. Some people tend to tunnel vision their way through content as it is so this should make things a bit easier all around.

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Originally Posted by mikoto_qc

hmm actually when patch 2.2 come out, every thing we are doing now and since 2.1 will be outdated. Just take a look @ stuff from 2.0 to 2.1. those things are tottaly outdated. i havent done a single AK, WP or Castrum when 2.1 came out. so yeah everything that we have done right now will be outdated for most of the pepeol.

Yoshi will always nerf old stuff so new players or Bad players can reach the new content, be happy and keep putting money in SE Pocket.
you better get used to it, because every patch it will be the same cycle over and over.

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I don't understand why can't bad players just learn how to play better. Instead of things being handed to you on a plate or having good players carry you. I hope things change after the First EXP pack.

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Originally Posted by File2ish

Did AK yesterday for my relic on my ilvl 72 PLD. The DF group I got consisted of a SMN in fairly good gear (at the very least had 3 ilvl 90 AF1.5 pieces, I never checked his equips so can't say about accessories), a DRG in ilvl 55 WP and AK drops, and a WHM in similar ilvl gear as the DRG. Killed the adds because of the lack of DPS, not everyone is Ilvl65+ to just burn the boss.

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So, due to lack of DPS, you had the DPS stop DPSing the boss so they could instead DPS adds? That doesn't really make a lot of sense. As long as the tank can grab and hold aggro and the healer can keep him alive, there's zero reason to ever ask the DPS to kill those adds. It's a waste of time and could cause you to lose due to the boss closing in before the DPS can get him down.

Because people are bad enough to still be stuck on it

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Originally Posted by NotTheNameIWanted

The first expansion isn't even out yet. There's no point in doing challenging content when they nerf it before it's completely outdated.

Really, really bad sign for the direction the game is going to take imo.

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It's not surprising.

The

"I DONT WANT NEW/BAD/UNDERGEARED PLAYERS IN MY GROUPS AND I DONT WANT TO TRY TO HELP THEM CUZ IM TO LEETZ FOR THAT AND I DONT WANT THEM TO BE ABLE TO BEAT OLD CONTENT I WILL NEVER EVEN PLAY AGAIN UNLESS I RANDOM ROULETTE OR HELP A NEWBIE FC MATE CLEAR CUZ I HAD TO DO IT THE HARD WAY AND I DONT WANT THEM TO HAVE ACCESS TO THE GEAR/CONTENT I HAVE ACCESS TO CUZ THEY DIDNT LEARN NOTHING FROM EASY MODE AND I DONT WANT THEM TO BE ABLE TO BUILD THEIR OWN GROUPS OF PLAYERS AND BEAT ON EASY MODE CUZ IT WOULD UNDERMINE ALL THE HARD WORK ME AND MY OTHER FELLOW LEETZ PUT IN TO LEARN IT WHEN IT WAS HARDER AND I REALIZE THIS IS A CASUAL GAME BUT MY 5% DESERVE TO BE GODS AMOUNG THE MASSES OF CASUALS CUZ WE ARE COOL LIKE THAT SO DONT NERF THE OLD STUFF I WILL NEVER PLAY PLEASE CUZ I WANNA FEEL COOL FOR A BIT LONGER AT LEAST UNTIL THE NEXT EXPANSION"

Thread

now everyone that posts will not have to read any earlier posts to catch up! your welcome!

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Originally Posted by Xayoc

I call your gil.

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First where is your sig from?

Second we need a PM function or at least someone tell me where it is.

Third and most important i like it myself(bees aside) i feel the Echo buff will work out well and with the 3 minute thing they are minimizing potential for abuse..In fact I'd say they are better prepared for troll mentalities and gaming systems then alot of companies(see the commendation system and vote kicks both designed to limit potential trolling......Guys who que and ALWAYS get your group aside...)

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Originally Posted by Niroken

I wonder about the future if a new player enters the game, plays up until 50 then plays the latest i55 dungeon that hands out i200/300/400+ tomes for the latest gear and pretty much skips a huge amount of content that was in the game previously, challenging or not. I fear that the future players might not even play older content, like asking someone decked out in the latest max ilevel gear a question about Wanderer's Palace and having them go "what's that?".

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The need to unlock via older content should counter this while if they ARE that OP then they can just breeze through it.

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Originally Posted by Blackcanary

I don't understand why can't bad players just learn how to play better. Instead of things being handed to you on a plate or having good players carry you. I hope things change after the First EXP pack.

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Point is not being ALLOWED to learn..Not that they don't want to.

I took a break for awhile and in 2.0 i was one of the few war who had NO problems in content. In fact i got complimented regularly....In 2.1 i relearned my rotation and am decent enough. But i still have to run fights to learn them videos actually impede my ability to learn the fight. Just how i am. A quick sumamry tell/show me where to go i'm good. Might take a few tries but yeah..

HOWEVER people don't WANT to help someone learn the fight doable or not. THAT is why this is a good thing.

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Originally Posted by Blackcanary

I don't understand why can't bad players just learn how to play better. Instead of things being handed to you on a plate or having good players carry you. I hope things change after the First EXP pack.

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Bad players?! Bad players?! Are you serious about this, there isnt Bad Players there are good players not willing to work with people with gear lower level than them. Your so called good players don't work with people they feel are beneath them. The Bad Players are the ones who quit a dungeon because they see gear the other players are wearing are beneath them, that quit dungeons after the first or second fail instead of trying to work something out. Bad Players are the high level players not willing to work with people, not willingly to give someone with an ilvl lower than 80 a chance.

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Originally Posted by LordSliver

Bad players?! Bad players?! Are you serious about this, there isnt Bad Players there are good players not willing to work with people with gear lower level than them. Your so called good players don't work with people they feel are beneath them. The Bad Players are the ones who quit a dungeon because they see gear the other players are wearing are beneath them, that quit dungeons after the first or second fail instead of trying to work something out. Bad Players are the high level players not willing to work with people, not willingly to give someone with an ilvl lower than 80 a chance.

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And here I thought bad players were the ones who fail to learn new mechanics or get out of the bad. TIL

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Originally Posted by LordSliver

blahblah.

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There are also bad players who don't know how to play their job and who clearly skated 1-50. And the game doesn't force them to learn how to play.. so whether they are bad because they don't wan to learn.. bad because they cant learn... or bad because they have bad attitudes.. people who suck at the game can also be considered bad players.. People should have to learn how to play the game before progressing and this game doesn't hardly teach you how to do that at all....

Because of the large amount of tears flowing from struggling players' eyes

I keep seeing comment saying the game is giving out hand outs, yet NOTHING HAS BEEN HANDED TO ME..

Why is every fight built on a new gearset to be obtained? How about just give us good story progression and leave it there. I really think the worn gear is getting too much attention now and it's overshadowing other aspects of the game.

How is this even remotely a surprise anyway? They announced this was going to happen even before 2.0 was released. Every time BCoB or CT gets a new turn the old turns will be nerfed.

This way SE can cater both the hardcore and casual players. We have to accept (I am counting myself as a more hardcore player here) that we can not have exclusive content in a MMORPG only because we pay more attention and time to a game. It would have been a different thing if they would make all the content easy. As long as the more skilled/hardcore players have hard content to tackle I couldn't care less what they do with the content I already cleared.

So suck it up, move on, enjoy turn 6 yo 9 or just stick to sulking and wasting your time here.

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Originally Posted by Versiroth

Best Post ever!

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I 100% agree with everything you stated this helps more then hurts because it does give more people the opportunity to do the content.

Most of the people that don't want the content to be nerfed, are the ones that already have beat everything and will move on to the new 2.2 content shortly after it's release...

I only have Turn 5 left, but that is going to take some time, seeing as I'm not in some elitist FC with that kind of static raid group. We try to gather up on Saturdays and do some Coil, but we don't have the coordination to really beat it any time soon, unless there is a nerf. Being stuck on one Turn for that time isn't really fun...

That doesn't make me a "bad" player, cause I could probably beat T5 a long time ago, IF I just joined a static raid group. My choice is to be in a more social FC though, and I don't want to change that....

Are you telling me that we have to get voice-com and start being more elitist to get to the new content in 2.2 ? Cause I would rather stop playing the game, than being forced to do that. If they have content like that in the game, then I expect them to nerf it at some point, so the players can move on.

I've been in the game just as long as the ones that have beat T5, and I'm just as tired and bored of the current content as they are. Trying to beat T5 won't be nearly enough of "new" content for me....

honestly it is way to early to nerf content at this rate people can just sub for 3.0 and in less then a week beat all the content from 2.1-3.0 considering the amount of nerfing they do. this game is not even challanaging enough to warrent a nerf. i haven't once used a guide on any fight. i haven't done t5 yet because my static quit because of boredum and easy gameplay. i feel its more about latancy then anything if after 5-10 wipes you haven't memorized something then you just make a macro. All ur playing is a game of memory why nerf that lol.

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Originally Posted by TornadoFury

honestly it is way to early to nerf content at this rate people can just sub for 3.0 and in less then a week beat all the content from 2.1-3.0 considering the amount of nerfing they do. this game is not even challanaging enough to warrent a nerf. i haven't once used a guide on any fight. i haven't done t5 yet because my static quit because of boredum and easy gameplay. i feel its more about latancy then anything if after 5-10 wipes you haven't memorized something then you just make a macro. All ur playing is a game of memory why nerf that lol.

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So you think people that are new in 3.0 should have to get gear from every patch and beat the content with almost no other players doing that content ? A new expansion would release before they could catch up to 3.0....

I don't think everything they are nerfing should be nerfed, but Turn 5 should be nerfed... Like I said in my earlier post, I shouldn't have to change the entire way I'm playing the game, just to be able to beat it.

The ones that have beat everything shouldn't really care about the nerf, cause they have experienced it at it's hardest level, and they are going to move on into to the new content and be ahead of everyone else anyways....

Who cares if people beat the primals easier now... It's old content anyways. There's no point in doing EX primals except for the mounts, and people wouldn't bother with it if they don't nerf them.

Everyone in my FC can gear up to ilvl90 and have a fair chance of trying out Turn 5 before they add the Echo buff in 2 weeks time, if we don't beat it by then without any lockout (which we won't), then I don't want to keep trying for months... I want to move on to the new content.