PLD - Upgrade Sword or Shield to Relic +1 (Zenith) first?

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Originally Posted by Kitru

I've found that sacrificing a Lalafell before any coil run causes the Random Number Goddess to bless you with tank loots. Every time I've done it I've gotten at least half of the loot as tank loot.

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Might try this...I have terrible luck with tank loot as well, gotten more loot for my alts than my tank.

Upgrade your armor. Don't rely on RNG Coil drops or you will halt the progression of your group. +1 becomes more effective the better gear you have and is only ~sort of~ needed on t4, depending on what gear you have at that point.

Thanks for all the replies and advice/discussion guys. Off to work now, but will have a more thorough read when I get home. By the looks of it though, I'm still going to have some decisions to make. lol

Thanks

1-4 can be done without issue in DL, let alone done in DL + myth + CT gear. The wisest investments are those from the highest tiers of coil if you are not already regularly clearing t4/5. The person who says start with things that drops in T5 is the one to listen to, because better than DL makes a difference in there.

I'm a fan of the sword upgrade. For things like dreadnoughts, knights and soliders (who you'll need the extra emnity gain from flash on), and rooks you cannot have too much damage, even if its only a minor increase. If a dreadnought has 1% HP left, 1% that you could have done with an upgrade, and gets to eat some bugs, or has 1% left and gets off a lucky cleave while your mages are distracted with bugs. . . more damage is good, and the sword is a T5 drop as mentioned earlier.

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Originally Posted by Lucke

I got my +1 relic first to help me hold aggro against +1 DPS. Made a HUGE difference. This was before Shield Oath was buffed though. Armor doesn't mean jack when you can't hold aggro against +1 relic'd DPS.

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That was my main reason for getting the Zenith Curtana pre 2.1. Up to T4, 5800-6000 HP was fine. Anything to help with snap aggro between phases on Turn 4 was a great help. The extra WD is great for Flash Enmity for AOE tanking.

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Originally Posted by salty_plum

Thanks for all the replies and advice/discussion guys. Off to work now, but will have a more thorough read when I get home. By the looks of it though, I'm still going to have some decisions to make. lol

Thanks

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I'll just link this here again :)

If I was gearing my PLD up now from scratch, I'd skip the Sword because with the enmity buff in 2.1 you don't need it as long as you're compensating for the Shield Oath bug (Toggle OFF then ON Shield Oath after zoning into a new instance to properly refresh the enmity increase. And if you need more threat than usual, then toggle on Sword Oath and then swap straight to Shield Oath).

Ring > Body > Head is the most obvious one, since you can keep decent accuracy for Coil by using the Darklight Legs. Then Legs. Then Feet (if you already have the Allagan Feet you can skip this until later - Valor are only BIS after you have the Allagan head and Weapon from Turn 5). Hands are the next obvious ones. And the Myth Wrist accessory is technically BIS after Turn 5, so it's a good last choice. After that, you're pretty much done with the "Best in Slot" options and can spent any extra Myth upgrading your Weapon or filling-in for missing Allagan pieces.

Just going to weigh in my thoughts here, as I asked a similar question a few months back.

If your enmity rotation is good, I am of the belief that you do not need to upgrade your Curtana to +1. Even during 2.0, if your rotation is good, and you are rotating between targets to spread the enmity, you will hardly ever lose aggro to a +1 DPS, unless they are using AoE skills (ie. BLM Fire II) - if they do, you probably have to be more liberal with Flash. If there was a fight where DPS popped their cooldowns on the initial pull and do more damage than usual, you have a cooldown you can use too - Fight or Flight.

You should prioritize spending on your armor pieces. A tank is really measured by how much HP they have, any other stat is secondary, besides accuracy (missing any step in your enmity combo is bad), and parry (more survivability).

Shield is based on individual, but I did upgrade my shield because I was an excited fresh 50 Paladin who had just gotten my Relic set, and 300 Mythology tomestones seemed cheap at the time. However, compared to the sword, I felt it was a worthwhile upgrade, because more parry and block is always good. While you can get the Allagan Round Shield from T1, however the RNG gods generally do not favour me, and I only saw the Shield once (and won it) in my last 8 - 10 weeks of running Coil. While people also say that the chest piece drops from T1, and so you can potentially save Mythology stones on the Valor Surcoat, to this day I still have not seen the Armor once. If you plan to prioritize on getting your Accuracy up for Coil, the Valor Coronet and Valor Surcoat are a good set of first purchases, as you will not only get more health from that combo compared to the Darklight Armor, but you also gain a net +21 Accuracy, which is huge. You can get up to +40 if you are lucky enough to get the Allagan Chest from T1, as the Valor Surcoat does not have Accuracy in it.

If you do get the drop from Coil, then good on you, and you can save your Mythology tomestones on that part until you decide it needs to be replaced for BiS purposes. If you have the capabilities to upgrade your main gear with Mythology, you should consider doing so, unless you are waiting for an RNG drop from Coil for BiS purposes. I am currently looking for the Allagan Choker and Earrings of Fending, as they are part of the BiS I am following, and I feel that with 6.5k health in a party (6665 with HQ La Noscean Toast), I have plenty of HP to tackle the hardest contents in the game without spending them on Hero's Choker and Earrings of Fending.

I haven't read all the comments so excuse me if I repeat anything.

Saying "Such and such drops in this turn so don't get that" is pretty stupid. RNG is a bitch. I've done coil a ridiculous amount of times and I haven't seen a shield, boots or legs drop. But I know other people that have got it all. It's just luck.

I would upgrade your sword first. Some people are against it but it's the best thing till Allagan and you probably won't get that for quite a while. When you're on turn 4 and you've got DPS burning everything like mad (especially soldiers and knights) you'll be glad you upgraded that sword.

I've got full myth with belt of light (waiting for Allagan) and Allagan accs (+hero ring) with DL earring and Bracelet. Just away to upgrade my bracelet but holding out for Allagan earrings because holding for 2 pieces isn't gonna nerf me.

The first myth I upgraded was Body since it's BiS. Problem is you have to settle for Hoplite circlet or try for CT helm. I then went for my myth circlet to fill the gap (Allagan helm drops in T4 which is BiS but RNG is a bitch). Basically go for things to fill voids. Myth gloves are always a winner.

I went full Myth because my luck in coil sucks. You might get all the drops so just get what you need. Not what people tell you.

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Originally Posted by Maelwys

I'll just link this here again :)

If I was gearing my PLD up now from scratch, I'd skip the Sword because with the enmity buff in 2.1 you don't need it as long as you're compensating for the Shield Oath bug (Toggle OFF then ON Shield Oath after zoning into a new instance to properly refresh the enmity increase. And if you need more threat than usual, then toggle on Sword Oath and then swap straight to Shield Oath).

Ring > Body > Head is the most obvious one, since you can keep decent accuracy for Coil by using the Darklight Legs. Then Legs. Then Feet (if you already have the Allagan Feet you can skip this until later - Valor are only BIS after you have the Allagan head and Weapon from Turn 5). Hands are the next obvious ones. And the Myth Wrist accessory is technically BIS after Turn 5, so it's a good last choice. After that, you're pretty much done with the "Best in Slot" options and can spent any extra Myth upgrading your Weapon or filling-in for missing Allagan pieces.

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^ This.

Don't rely on RNG, you'll be disgruntled very quickly. Plus you can slowly earn up a Primal weapon these days until you get your armor. I held Aggroe with little problem on both PLD and WAR pre 2.1, yes even on T4 with +1 blms going crazy. Its a joke now after 2.1, so T4 isn't even an excuse for going weapon first. Armor all the way.

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Originally Posted by Kal-El

I would upgrade your sword first

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I hold agro with original Curtana fine. They buffed Shield Oath enmity generation in 2.1 and PRE 2.1 I held agro fine in T4 without weapon. Stuff dropping in T5 has nothing to do with which order you should get your gear.

You will progress faster IF you have more vit and defense and can survive that one extra attack that a healer had to ignore because he had to heal a dps.

If you aren't holding agro as a PLD,you seriously need to work on rotation,because the weapon has absolutely minimul effect on agro,unless you have Allagan weapon. Relic vs Relic +1, no big deal. You realize benediction/stoneskin and hp regeneration in combat scales with defense and hp, and shield oath scales with defense.

After I got my rotation down to a science,I never lost agro with full DL+non+1 Relic,unless a healer or a dps just does something dumb,like putting medica 2 and regen on you right before a dreadnaught drops in phase 6 of T4

sword and armor first, shield can wait and FYI DO NOT count on coil drop, just gear yourself up and replace them with better piece you get from EM or coil later

Been doing Turn 4 for weeks with normal curtana. If you need Zenith to hold aggro (2.0 included), you're doing something wrong frankly.

Remember- crystal tower is a joke- go there to get body and legs until they drop from coils turns 1 and 2.
Upgrade to zenith sword because u can't upgrade that until turn 5 and there is no ct stepping stone.
once you get a i80 or i90 body to drop, buy myth helm since that's also turn 5. If legs drop from either CT or coils, buy myth boots, if not, buy myth gloves. You do this because u need accuracy.
Accuracy is really important, and the only allagan parts that I can remember off hand that are pre-turn 5 come from turns 1&2. Body and shield, earring, ring and belt.
I know my allagan boots don't have acc so I'm replacing those next week, and I don't thik legs have acc either but I forgot. Valor body does not have acc but it does have DET... So depending on your acc you can consider buying this, but It's a lot of tomes for something that can easily be replaced.
Once again, sword is a lot harder to replace then the other stuff, so I'd upgrade sword first.

I didn't upgrade my sword till I was i86 there is no real reason to rush it, you can do all the content fine with you curtana, you can not do it fine if you are low hp and getting 1 shoted. Enmity control is a joke in this game, so armor first!

... It been prove soo many time that Relic+ DL can get you to T1-4 just fine. there not really an order of which gear to get first anymore (especially now that the myth cap ries to 450...) Just do coil and CT then buy whichever piece you missing.
Just make sure that you ACC is around 470 w/o food. Just becareful when you replacing Glove and pant combo these 2 have a ton of ACC tie to them.

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Originally Posted by Remn

... It been prove soo many time that Relic+ DL can get you to T1-4 just fine. there not really an order of which gear to get first anymore (especially now that the myth cap ries to 450...) Just do coil and CT then buy whichever piece you missing.
Just make sure that you ACC is around 470 w/o food. Just becareful when you replacing Glove and pant combo these 2 have a ton of ACC tie to them.

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^this is why basically why I like upgrading sword, and why I recommend focusing on accuracy i90 gear because accuracy is harder to get then it is with i70 gear. I found out the hard way when I put on my allagan boots. And when allagan gloves lost accuracy in 2.1 patch, I started to really hurt. I actually had to revert back to DL until I got myth gloves, and waiting until Monday for myth boots.

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Originally Posted by Yunnie

^this is why basically why I like upgrading sword, and why I recommend focusing on accuracy i90 gear because accuracy is harder to get then it is with i70 gear. I found out the hard way when I put on my allagan boots. And when allagan gloves lost accuracy in 2.1 patch, I started to really hurt. I actually had to revert back to DL until I got myth gloves, and waiting until Monday for myth boots.

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His reasoning is more reason to go with armor upgrades. Whether you can survive fights in a swimsuit with excellent healers is irrelevant. The best upgrade path for a tank capable of pressing 1 - 2 - 3, is going to be armor. You get more bang for your buck in myth, and more margin for error for your raid. I was sitting at i88 average before I got weapon upgrade finally to i90. Don't regret it at all, was never an issue.

*edit* Also.. Allagan gloves never lost accuracy, they lost parry.

Personally it's out of preference, what you can afford and be ars*d to save up for, now that they've made it incredibly easy to get gear you have more options to boot on what to buy first without any significant consequence.

Initially when playing before the cap increase and nerfs in the game the common trait was to upgrade to +1 (prior to the rename of Zenith) and to wait for the Allagan shield, purchase head (wait for boots / legs / chest as they all drop from the first 2 bosses), anything else such as accessories are easily purchased 1 per week etc, so there's really no need for a 6 page discussion as to whom is wrong or right, most server first FC's I know and have had the pleasure of being involved in some runs with back in the day when everyone was wiping on T1, all but a small minority upgraded their Swords first, it may not be the correct decision to the stat whores out there but it's still an upgrade and you'll look more appealing to a group than someone with the same gear bar 1 accessory upgrade , to your funky new glowy sword (whilst somewhat contradictive considering the Hero's ring will/should be your first myth purchase).

If you're running CT / Ultima / Coil it's best to wait till the end of the week till you spunk your myth to see what you get from the aforementioned instances.

I got AF+1 Chest first because I got Crown of Light my first week in CT and wasn't about to wear Hoplite when I had the tomes. Also, since I have no plans on going in to Coil until I have an FC Statis, which is still forming, and will be running CT for a long time and normally find myself on add duty, I upgraded my sword to give me the little bit of extra DPS.