[Guide] Paladin Tanking Compendium 2.0.1

Oh most definitely more testing certainly doesn't hurt. Best of luck ^^b

Are you Griever from AA from Aion?

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Originally Posted by IskarJarak

Are you Griever from AA from Aion?

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Sorry no, I have played neither of those.

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Originally Posted by DCILuther

Hello,

I was reading the guide and I wanted some help with the Macros.

For example the Fast Blade Macro outlined in the guide. It seems I have to hit the button 3 times so everything goes off. Is this how it's supposed to work? I'm somewhat new to macros. I was told to put /wait somewhere in between.

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Yes, you have to press the button as many times as abilities you have in that macro. In that case, you have to hit it 3 times, so you are correct.

You can put /wait in between, that is what I do, if you don't want to press the button many times.

/wait 0.5 will be enough to trigger the next ability automatically.

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Originally Posted by Maraf

Yes, you have to press the button as many times as abilities you have in that macro. In that case, you have to hit it 3 times, so you are correct.

You can put /wait in between, that is what I do, if you don't want to press the button many times.

/wait 0.5 will be enough to trigger the next ability automatically.

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Very good answer. The only thing I would like to add is the why to this. For each skill that you perform your character is put into an animation lock that must finish before you can take the next action.

Thanks. Would .5 round up to 1 second though?

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Originally Posted by DCILuther

Thanks. Would .5 round up to 1 second though?

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From everything I have read, I was not able to find an official answer. The general consensus is that you can set the /wait command in .5 second intervals.

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Originally Posted by Griever2003

From everything I have read, I was not able to find an official answer. The general consensus is that you can set the /wait command in .5 second intervals.

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Did my own personal test. For what I observed there looks to be rounding. /wait .5 and wait 1.4 look to return in the same amount of time.

@Griever2003 Thanks for the compliment and for the nice addition to my answer.;)

BTW, great job keeping the Guide alive.

7,100 HP as a Hyur Highlander. Such a nice number. Think there's one more Vit to be had if you're a Roegadyn but really... the sacrifice just isn't worth it (^_^)v

Thanks for taking this over. Liked everything and watching.

So im curious why was it changed from mostly myth or like full Allegan armor?

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Originally Posted by SerDakota

So im curious why was it changed from mostly myth or like full Allegan armor?

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I am actually looking at all of the stats right now and switching each piece out to see the difference in stats. The changes come about because some of the allagan gear changed stats (legs give is a tier of priority. So, I am actually going to be updating this again soon.

So still a WiP? Ok just curuous great guide still very helpful thanks for doing it

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Originally Posted by SerDakota

So still a WiP? Ok just curuous great guide still very helpful thanks for doing it

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I had actually noticed the differences earlier and am still trying to figure out hard numbers as to what all is changing and why. I will post a comparison chart and leave it unlocked so anyone can mess with it; but we are looking at very small percents... but it matters

So Tested out the gear quite a bit to try and get a 100% Definitive BiS but I don't think without some real world, in-depth testing that I could make that determination.

A little explanation of what you will see in the document. The middle is the comparison (obviously) the Acc stat has a stop light icon to make note if you stay above, below or close enough 475. The color format will change depending on what value for which set is better. They will both be green if they are the same.

The formula are taken from Jahaudant's original sheet and modified just slightly. Dex is calculated into mitigation. With BiS equipment you will not have any modifiers on Dex, so the constant 181 was used as it is the average Dex for all races.

The two different sets are at odds with each other because one or the other will give you slightly, and do I mean slightly, better enmity generation. The original gear set (top) will give you a .05% better mitigation statistic. The contending set (bottom) on the other hand allows you to have more Emnity per Second generation (through Halone Combo).

There are some other differences, but that is what I was looking at. I am not sure if this is the deciding factor but the original BiS set have 17 better Det. Which as you all should be away is also tied to how much health a cure spell will effect you. So i dont know. This is where step back, display the numbers, and let the conversations commence.

I can confirm that both of these items drop in Copperbell Mines HM.

So you used 181 Dex, but i have 191 ? I was naked and without any buffs..i dont get it. Where do i get 10 Dex ?

Chizu

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Originally Posted by Chizukeki

So you used 181 Dex, but i have 191 ? I was naked and without any buffs..i dont get it. Where do i get 10 Dex ?

Chizu

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If you look on the equipment page in the PLD Equipment Planner from Jahaudant's post at the end he has base stats for all the races. But i think that you are correct and they are not accurate. because my nekkid Dex is at 193.

Determination is an interesting stat to theorycraft; the variable being the healer and thier gear ilvl or gear choice in stats. The way I look at the stat: Increased Damage and incoming heals is an interesting mix of shortening the length of the fight while adding more to the effective health style tanking. I do not have the time to parse the logs; if you were to do this I would be interested in seeing what's the percentage increase in healing recieved.

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Originally Posted by Griever2003

There are some other differences, but that is what I was looking at. I am not sure if this is the deciding factor but the original BiS set have 17 better Det. Which as you all should be away is also tied to how much health a cure spell will effect you. So i dont know. This is where step back, display the numbers, and let the conversations commence.

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Are you sure that Determination affects the healing in? Because everything that I have read and tested states the opposite. For reference, you should check out this reddit post: Determination Does Not Affect Healing In

According to XIVDB.com, Onion shield is a primal extreme turn in with 1 token. (2 tokens for the break blade)

http://xivdb.com/?item/7004/Rowena%27s-Token

Unsure if these are mistakes, but I noticed that the following items in the gear have accuracy listed as a stat yet none of them give accuracy in the pages they link to. Also you list Ultima Choker of Fending as iLvl 70 instead of 80.

90AM - Vortex Ring of Fending - Garuda Extreme
70MA - Ultima Choker of Fending - Ultima Weapon Hard
80MA - Ultima Band of Fending - Ultima Weapon Hard

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Originally Posted by Rasabox

Are you sure that Determination affects the healing in? Because everything that I have read and tested states the opposite. For reference, you should check out this reddit post: Determination Does Not Affect Healing In

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Funny enough, after I made a post about determination I read that reddit article an hour or two later. I have been gearing for Determination until I get the proper mitigation drops from Coil T1-4. If they ever made healing potency scale with Vitality or Attack Power I believe Determination would be a great stat. Right now, it's just additional damage and enmity. I wish it did work the way I thought it did.

Heads up: there are the "tombstone" typos all over the guide. They are tomestones.

Can anybody give me a good buff rotation for heavy damage single mob (BOSS) encounters.

When he has >= 2 stacks I've just been using Rampart ---> Convalescence --> Foresight .[note i wait until the buffs go out before using the next one] and save Sentinel/Bulwark for 3+ stacks/desperate situations.

I'm not sure if i am using my cooldowns effectively, i know the above strategy works pretty well for Ultima but I am new to tanking in Coil (as DRG is my main)

can anybody offer any advice?

Has anyone thought about how the Gryphonskin accessories fit into BiS? There's a lot of discussion going around about getting full Gryphonskin accessory sets and then socketing the tank stats in so that you get something like 5 maxed stats. I can get a link from Reddit once it's not down for maintenance, but what I was reading was that it allows you to get ~3% more chance to block/parry for 1% more damage. You lose about 360 HP as a tradeoff, but you gain 45 strength for more damage/threat. It seems to be that a lot of tanks are going this route for Twintania but I don't feel like the 3% chance to block/parry for only 1% damage is really worth it. There has been a lot of discussion about it within my FC and I'm curious what everyone thinks about it.

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Originally Posted by AugustusSB

Can anybody give me a good buff rotation for heavy damage single mob (BOSS) encounters.

When he has >= 2 stacks I've just been using Rampart ---> Convalescence --> Foresight .[note i wait until the buffs go out before using the next one] and save Sentinel/Bulwark for 3+ stacks/desperate situations.

I'm not sure if i am using my cooldowns effectively, i know the above strategy works pretty well for Ultima but I am new to tanking in Coil (as DRG is my main)

can anybody offer any advice?

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I assume you're talking about Caduceaus, so I typically start with Bulwark as it's the most RNG-based cooldown and, thus, less reliable than the other flat mitigation cooldowns and then move to Rampart -> Foresight+Convalescence -> Sentinel+Awareness -> Hallowed Ground -> Awareness. I typically end with Awareness as it seems to be the least effective cooldown available and, hopefully, Cad should be dead by then. But, if it's not, the damage he's putting out at 4-5 stacks is such that a wayward crit will almost definitely drop you at that point.
Only other time I really use cooldowns on full rotation is the two Juggernauts on Turn 4, which should really start with Hallowed Ground so your party can get themselves situated during the phase change and then run the Cad rotation in reverse 'cause if the first Juggernaut isn't down by the time your cooldown rotation ends then you don't have the DPS for Turn 4 and you don't need cooldowns for one Jug.

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Originally Posted by Serneum

Has anyone thought about how the Gryphonskin accessories fit into BiS? There's a lot of discussion going around about getting full Gryphonskin accessory sets and then socketing the tank stats in so that you get something like 5 maxed stats. I can get a link from Reddit once it's not down for maintenance, but what I was reading was that it allows you to get ~3% more chance to block/parry for 1% more damage. You lose about 360 HP as a tradeoff, but you gain 45 strength for more damage/threat. It seems to be that a lot of tanks are going this route for Twintania but I don't feel like the 3% chance to block/parry for only 1% damage is really worth it. There has been a lot of discussion about it within my FC and I'm curious what everyone thinks about it.

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I think the jury's still out on the Gryphonskin vs. Allagan/Hero's debate. There's a lot of different data going around ranging from new discoveries to downright herp-derp misinformation, so I'm personally withholding judgment on that until there's some more clear data out there. Honestly, though, it really doesn't seem like it makes enough of a difference for me to care one way or the other. I don't think the difference would even be noticeable. Go with Allagan/Hero's if you end up with enough myth and an Allagan ring drop or go with the Gryphonskin melds if you have the absurd quantity of gil required for such an endeavor. I, personally, don't think the damage is worth it. It won't even be noticeable and it's not our job, anyway.

Especially with how cheap most everything is. Getting Gryphonskin is incredibly efficient. There's no guarantee how quickly you'll get Allagan accessories so why not? I just Made and melded my ring with max stats in under 300k When the same ring that my tank buddy made himself cost him like 3milion.

Materia is DIRT CHEAP so is the ring itself.

PLD is my 3rd or 4th job; I just use my penta-melded Gryphonskin Choker / Ring from BRD. I think they're a great intermediate piece until something better comes your way. Ring is +10 VIT, +12 CRIT, +4 DTR. Choker is funny because I accidentally melded the wrong materia for #5, but it actually works alright for PLD: VIT +10, CRIT +9, PARRY +4. The ring cost much more to make; the choker was really cheap with the quest giving materia slashing the Savage Aim prices. Savage Aim IV 50k, VIT III and II ~4k, Parry don't remember, but really low. Yeah it's not BiS, but you're not BiSing a 3rd or 4th job for a while with the lockout restrictions.

Wall of crags is now slightly better than relic sheild (not zenith) Has determination (and lol earth resist) buff in addition to same stats

300k is about the total amount of Gil I have at the moment, and I never buy things aside from the occasional mats to help level an alt crafter, so I think "cheap" may be a bit of a subjective term here, especially depending on server.

Quick question then: If neither the Break Blade nor the Onion Shield have any Parry, should I even consider them over the Curtana/Holy Shield? Or would one or the other be an upgrade over the Relic weapon/Shield?

Also, the Titan EX earrings are not listed here, just as an FYI.

Suggestion for alternate BIS.

http://www.ffxivguild.com/ffxiv-pala...ame-gear-guide

Allagan Blade
Onion Shield
Allagan Helm
Valor Shirt
Valor Glove
Allagan Belt
Valor Pant
Valor Boot
Allagan Earring
Allagan Necklack
Hero's Bracer
Hero's Ring
Allagan Ring

Result: Same STR/VIT/DEX

Current BIS:
Parry 621 ACC 480 Crit 356 DET 230 SPD 352
-Average Block mitigation = 6.79% (24.74% Block Rate with 27.45% MIT)
-Average Parry mitigation = 3.80% (25.12% Parry Rate with 15.14% MIT)
-Total Mitigation = 10.59%

Alternate BIS:
Parry 616 ACC 478 Crit 378 DET 219 SPD 352
-Average Block mitigation = 6.83% (34.72% Block Rate with 19.66% MIT)
-Average Parry mitigation = 3.79% (25.05% Parry Rate with 15.14% MIT)
-Total Mitigation = 10.62%

Basically, earn MIT0.03% + 22CRIT in exchange of 2ACC/11DET

Bump.

Great thread!

As a PS3 player, I'll need to look into adding some of those macros. Space on my hotbar is rapidly filling up as I gain all of my cross-class abilities.

At the very least, I will macro Bloodbath and Fight or Flight with Cross Slash. Ditto with Convalescence/Rampart.

I'll also macro Stoneskin (when I get it)... as one of my biggest gripes with the PS3 is switching from targeting the enemy to targeting myself (for a cure... which I generally only need when solo'ing a FATE).



Side-question... has anyone tinkered with macro'ing Sentinel with Bulwark? I very rarely use Bulwark on it's own... and both skills are on a 180 second cool-down. Would there be any disadvantage that I'm not taking into account?

Ditto with Foresight (which I constantly use) and Awareness (which I rarely use)... both are on a 120 second cooldown, any disadvantage that I'm not thinking about?



I'm asking this more towards people who have Coil/EX experience, since I'm not up to that point yet. I know that a lot of mechanics change and more skills need to be utilized during Coil and the EX fights. I want to make sure that I'm not doing something that I'm going to regret in a few weeks when I get to that end-end content.

Thanks in advance!

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Originally Posted by OSUBuckeye4

Bump.

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Side-question... has anyone tinkered with macro'ing Sentinel with Bulwark? I very rarely use Bulwark on it's own... and both skills are on a 180 second cool-down. Would there be any disadvantage that I'm not taking into account?


Ditto with Foresight (which I constantly use) and Awareness (which I rarely use)... both are on a 120 second cooldown, any disadvantage that I'm not thinking about?

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In My opinion I think that the Foresight+Awareness Macro is a good idea. Since they fixed the Awareness bug I have been finding it difficult to get back in the groove of using the skill. But because foresight is a lower mitigation CD (possibly wort in game) the added effect of no possibility of a Critical Hit is a great benefit.

With Sentinel and Bulwark I am not so sure that would be a very beneficial all around. Generally you would want to spread out your 2 strongest mitigation CDs. I think it would have a great place in in T5 when tanking the first set of snakes, but there are few places where I can think that i would use both of them at the same time. You get the most bang for the buck on Bulwark when you have multiple mobs hitting relatively fast (more chances to block more often).

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Originally Posted by Griever2003

In My opinion I think that the Foresight+Awareness Macro is a good idea. Since they fixed the Awareness bug I have been finding it difficult to get back in the groove of using the skill. But because foresight is a lower mitigation CD (possibly wort in game) the added effect of no possibility of a Critical Hit is a great benefit.

With Sentinel and Bulwark I am not so sure that would be a very beneficial all around. Generally you would want to spread out your 2 strongest mitigation CDs. I think it would have a great place in in T5 when tanking the first set of snakes, but there are few places where I can think that i would use both of them at the same time. You get the most bang for the buck on Bulwark when you have multiple mobs hitting relatively fast (more chances to block more often).

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Thank you for the feedback, I took your suggestions and am very pleased with the way my macro'ing ended up.

I can fit all needed battle skills on one bar and put things like my oath's, chocobo, sprinting, meals, return/teleport on my second bar.

Now... I just need to level up and get Stoneskin and I'll be all set.

To Griever2003

Firstly, thank you for taking over this thread! It has now become my place of reference for anything PLD related [just like the "Dragoons: A Rotation Reborn" thread by Ayvar for my DRG]

The reason I am writing is that there are a few things that I believe need changes, esp info in the "Gear" section.

Now, all [Hoplite] do not drop from Amdapor Keep anymore, but from the "new" HM dungeons. I do not have all the details from which chests specifically, but I am sure you can find the info somewhere pretty easily.

Additionally, you've listed new accessories from 2.1, but you've missed 1: Tremor Earrings of Fending. This specific one is worth mentioning thanks to the Accuracy it offers. I am not too sure if your BiS list takes in consideration the new accessories, or they just do not even make it there.

What I would suggest to add to the thread, if possible, would be a BiS PLD Solver if you can manage to find one. I've managed to find solvers for DRG, MNK, and BRD that helps me calculate the most optimal upgrade at any given time taking into account the gears I currently have or planning to acquire.

Not sure if there are other adjustments to be done, but that is all I have to say.

Wish you the best! and thanks again Griever2003

I was doing Garuda EX last night, and subbed in one of my myth drops, which made my accuracy go down from 475is to around 463.

I noticed I was doing a significant amount less damage. I had some trouble keeping hate and this has never happened to me before. What is weird is that I actually went up in STR and DET with my upgrade.

Has anybody else ever experienced something like this?

I mean i understand if im missing a few hits and have trouble keeping hate in that regard, but the thing that bothers me is that I was not missing, I was just hitting for less damage... :(

That... doesn't sound possible. Try going to a test dummy and swinging away at it with your myth drop and then again with Darklight - if you're doing more damage with the myth then it's likely a difference between what your DPS/Healers were doing and what they normally do.