There needs to be a kick button... Please! I beg of you!

Kick button will lead to abuse from elitist jerks they will all be item looking you and say your doing a lvl 20 dungon in lvl 22-17 gear they will just want to kick based on the 1 lvl 17 item this of cause will get worse the high the lvl

I thought what I'd do was, I'd pretend I was one of those deaf-mutes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NessaWyvern

So yeah, being a white mage nowdays mean 20+min cues, (:/ probably not as bad as poor dps, but still) so when I finally get into CM to get some much needed tomes, what do I see but 2 dps just sitting there afk.
Me? I have to wait another 20+ mins...

---

On the one hand, yes, my god do we ever need a Vote to Kick feature.
On the other hand, sorry, but no one wants to hear a sob story about Healer queue times. You're still far better off than every DPS player ever.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NoctisCaelus

there be a item level requirement which might make it.. a tiny bit better? And also a honor/point system with rewards for being a good player.

---

I'm optimistic that these features will do a lot of good, though it's still not a complete solution. There are always going to be people who enter a dungeon just to harass, intentionally wipe the group repeatedly, or go AFK. The entire reason they do this is because they know there is no Kick option and the DF group is stuck with them. No amount of incentives or gear checks will change this.
Expecting to stop trolls and DF abuse without a Vote to Kick feature is like expecting to stop crime without employing any police officers. I know people can come up with any number of anecdotes and rumours about police abusing their authority -- it's still better than no law enforcement at all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Austin

You leave... Simple; don't support those players who afk and use YOU.

---

I don't think you understood the OP. They aren't looking to "support" AFK players, they're calling for a Kick feature that would forcibly remove trolls like these so that legit players can actually play the game in peace.
Some AFK players are hoping to leech off the group and let them complete the run while they just stand there, but there are also many others who go AFK just to troll. As long as there is no kick, they win.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Extreme

There is a kick button for parties. Its in the party list thngy. I'm sorry if this doesnt help

---

This is about Duty Finder, not manually-formed parties. There is no Kick function in DF.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lexxuk

Boot the DPS you don't want (or healer)
Repeat until you get the set up you want
Well, that's one way to abuse a kick system, better hope you don't want to level a DPS that isn't optimal for dungeon X. Cue threads "remove the kick feature!".

---

With Vote-to-Kick: Nearly all the party would have to be assembled beforehand and have to agree to needlessly kick.
Without Vote-to-Kick: All it takes is a single person to absolutely ruin a dungeon run and waste massive amounts of time for many players.

Abuse happens in either system, but it's far harder and more rare to abuse a game with a Kick than a game without one. The sheer knowledge that there is no Vote to Kick is basically acting as an invitation for people to abuse the Duty Finder repeatedly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MysteriousRonin

I remember getting on to people about them using racial and homophobic slurs and then getting booted by them as they called me a fag.

---

Are you saying you would have rather stayed in that group and continued to play with them...? Doesn't sound like kicking was the real issue here...

Quote:

---

As it is now if someone acts like an ass in a group you can stop healing, tanking, or DPSing to grief them right back.

---

1) I don't think you understand the whole "griefing" thing. There are a lot of individuals right now who enter DF without any intention of completing the dungeon. They just go in because they get their kicks by wasting other peoples' time and feeding on the rage of others.
2) In the case of one player being a jerk, it would be far better to simply be able to remove that individual if the rest of the party agrees that he/she is a problem. Sinking to their level isn't going to solve anything, and while you are throwing a tantrum yourself you are doing so at the rest of the party's expense. The best you can hope for now is to simply leave, and since we all know there is a penalty for leaving it simply boils down to a game of chicken where basically the most adult of the group is punished because they simply don't have the patience for your stupid antics.

Quote:

---

The rare occasion where you get into a dungeon finder group with a couple of AFK people is not worth it.

---

Please spare us the personal anecdotes and your subjective assessment of how much forum hearsay you "feel" there was about abuse of Vote to Kick. The fact is, we don't have the statistics to measure one way or another which system causes the most problems (not to mention, "Kick" and "No Kick" are mutually exclusive states so they can't be compared in the same environment). If you really want to bring WoW into it, how about you consider the fact that Blizzard thought it necessary to install a Vote to Kick feature, and it has remained in the game to this day despite it being such a "problem" feature?

Just do the math, guys. You can either have a system where all it takes is one jerk player to ruin everybody else's game, or a system where it takes nearly all the party organizing and conspiring together against a single stranger. The first scenario is far more likely to happen, and the potential for toxic players to spread misery across a greater number of instances is many times higher. In Duty Finder, the amount of organization it takes for a troll to screw with people is zero -- and their success rate is 100%. Meanwhile, for a kick vote to go through in Duty Finder, a bunch of random strangers from different servers all have to agree on it. A lone troll has basically no power at all, and he knows if he acts up he could be removed. Is all of this not true?? I fail to see how anyone can argue with this.

hopefully they make a kick button to kick you off the forums and stop making a hundred of these same threads every day

There won't ever be a plain kick button in DF parties, because way too many parties would just end before they start. A voting system would be more acceptable but I cast doubt on if they'd actually do it.

get a Tank friend and queue with him/her, then the DPS can go fuck themself.

I thought what I'd do was, I'd pretend I was one of those deaf-mutes.

Just leave. WHMs don't need to wait so long.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MysteriousRonin

You'd rather have something that is going to be used to abuse other players way more than they are abused right now because you don't want to leave a re-queue? Talk about selfish.

---

A Vote to Kick feature will fix problems like AFK players, people who came in to troll or intentionally wipe, and overly obnoxious/rude people. That is a fact.

What is not a fact, and which has not been established or supported beyond a baseless hunch some players have, is your statement highlighted in red. If you are going to call Vote to Kick a bad idea, let alone start calling people "selfish" for wanting it, you had better demonstrate that the claim in red is founded on something other than your guess. I have yet to see anyone even attempt at doing so, besides insisting that they saw some angry forum posts about Kick abuse in other games.

I am not denying that Vote to Kick can't be abused, but as I have already stated, it takes a lot more effort -- not to mention blind luck -- to abuse the Kick feature in Duty Finder. Trolls can't just Kick anyone they please. They have to gain the approval and agreement of the majority. That makes it exceedingly difficult to Kick anyone, if there is no good reason for doing so.

The system we have in FFXIV now, without a Kick of any kind, allows a single player to completely ruin a dungeon run and waste the entire party's time, without fear of consequences of any kind -- and they do so knowing that the rest of the party is powerless to stop them. Not only that, but they know that if any of their victims leaves the party, they will suffer a lockout penalty and won't be able to requeue in Duty Finder for 15 minutes. Basically, the system we have in place right now is a paradise for trolls, bullies, jerks, and selfish idiots.

I already explained this at length, in what I believe are pretty rational and logical terms, and not the "QQ" whining you quoted me as saying. Vote to Kick is a pretty standard feature, found in a number of MMOs. If you think my points are invalid, or if you have actual evidence or a decent argument that shows Vote to Kick would be significantly worse than what we have right now, by all means please share it with us.