Square Enix, Are we really just pretending that WoW isn't running laps around you?

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Originally Posted by Wired-Lain

WoW fell right to the brink of ruin before they started making sweeping changes and admitting fault. XIV has at least one more expansion before things get that bad. This isn't XIVs Shadowlands, but you can see it from here.

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I largely agree with this. We aren't there yet, but it's trending pretty heavily that way.

The frustrating thing is that apparently everyone but the devs can see it coming. Unfortunately that means they're going to have the learn the hard way instead of avoiding it.

So many people are upset for various reasons some logical and reasonable.

Others are more upset because of a perceived lack of living up to potential?

Who cares really if WoW is in a better or a good state now than it has been. Was WoW supposed to remain perpetually bad.
I'm sorry we didn't take the throne but WoW technically even at its lowest points was still a bigger game with more players and support than FF14.

I mean it took them a Bad expansion, one good expansion then two bad expansions a mediocre one and I slightly better expansion... Just to change course.

Yet we're supposed to pretend that FF14 is at a point similar to WoW's worst era?

Maybe they don't respond at the speed or capacity people would like but the Devs do try to change things. In this expansion alone there's been the graphics update, making dungeons a bit more challenging, and tiny incremental QoL changes on top of that... They do listen.

If WoW has shown anything it's that it takes time to course correct. You're commending WoW like they flipped a switch and made everything better overnight. They didn't.

So who's pretending here?

(Edit)
Are we going to pretend like FF14 will be this forever bad game always incapable of change?
WoW went on a long slump and FF14 stepped up with changes WoW needed to make.. It took time for them to change.
FF14 is a competitive game in the market this idea it won't react or make changes is absurd.
And if you're one of the people who have been complaining since Heavensward about the direction of the game you're seen and known.
FF14 isn't going anywhere. You got to lose to know how to win.
The ideas WoW has for player housing didn't just fall out of the sky, they copied their competitor and worked to remove the pain points... you think FF14 won't change? Absurd.

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Originally Posted by Arrius

A brief note here - Wait for the full picture of WoW's housing. Blizzard is notorious of taking a step forward and then taking two steps back. And right now they serve all the good things that it can offer on a spotlight without possible drawbacks or limitations that could come with it.

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This, a hundred times. nuBlizz is very good in making advertisements for features to come, and very bad in delivering afterwards. Source: I've been there for way too many years. And I will rather stop playing MMOs at all, then going back into this mess.

The biggest problem is that they continue to double down on every single bad decision they have made like it is a personal shame of honor against their family if they admit they made a mistake that needs to be fixed.

People hate Wuk? Give them more and more Wuk every .* patch!
The 2 minute meta has driven pve into the ground? Design an entirely new job around the 2 minute meta!
Jobs have no identity? Make them feel even more the same!

So on and so on for so many little things this would be three pages long at the end of it all.

Not to mention the absolute radio silence about how WoW just gave them a massive black eye with player housing.

"We can't do instanced housing, it's not feasible." Then the competition just outright does it, rendering that excuse impotent.

The endless excuses and the doubling down have gotten stale to the point where people no longer want to hear it. You can't claim something can't be fixed or can't be done only for your competition not only to do it, but to do it considerably better.


This game needs a new lead dev. It's blatantly obvious that Yoshi is creatively bankrupt.
Copying WOTLK only works for so long before you need new, fresh ideas.
We haven't had any.

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Originally Posted by Nadda

So many people are upset for various reasons some logical and reasonable.

Others are more upset because of a perceived lack of living up to potential?

Who cares really if WoW is in a better or a good state now than it has been. Was WoW supposed to remain perpetually bad.
I'm sorry we didn't take the throne but WoW technically even at its lowest points was still a bigger game with more players and support than FF14.

I mean it took them a Bad expansion, one good expansion then two bad expansions a mediocre one and I slightly better expansion... Just to change course.

Yet we're supposed to pretend that FF14 is at a point similar to WoW's worst era?

Maybe they don't respond at the speed or capacity people would like but the Devs do try to change things. In this expansion alone there's been the graphics update, making dungeons a bit more challenging, and tiny incremental QoL changes on top of that... They do listen.

If WoW has shown anything it's that it takes time to course correct. You're commending WoW like they flipped a switch and made everything better overnight. They didn't.

So who's pretending here?

(Edit)
Are we going to pretend like FF14 will be this forever bad game always incapable of change?
WoW went on a long slump and FF14 stepped up with changes WoW needed to make.. It took time for them to change.
FF14 is a competitive game in the market this idea it won't react or make changes is absurd.
And if you're one of the people who have been complaining since Heavensward about the direction of the game you're seen and known.
FF14 isn't going anywhere. You got to lose to know how to win.
The ideas WoW has for player housing didn't just fall out of the sky, they copied their competitor and worked to remove the pain points... you think FF14 won't change? Absurd.

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We are at a similar point.

The last bastion FF had was the story. Now, even that is garbage. You have one game that fell from greatness only to come back fighting to get back to the top and the other, who had it for a moment, pissed it away by making bad decision after bad decision, but instead of fighting back, they are sticking their chin out to take the hits.

I usually ride with FF, but this last year and a half has been an embarrassment. The turnaround for arr was historic. Now, it seems like they are intentionally trying to replicate that in reverse to see how fast they can destroy the game.

Thus far, they are doing an awesome job.

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Originally Posted by Gwenkatsu

This, a hundred times. nuBlizz is very good in making advertisements for features to come, and very bad in delivering afterwards. Source: I've been there for way too many years. And I will rather stop playing MMOs at all, then going back into this mess.

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I doubt waiting for Blizzard to do its customary shooting itself in the foot is going to improve FF14.

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Originally Posted by Arzalis

I largely agree with this. We aren't there yet, but it's trending pretty heavily that way.

The frustrating thing is that apparently everyone but the devs can see it coming. Unfortunately that means they're going to have the learn the hard way instead of avoiding it.

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It's hard not to see it. The game hasn't changed since 2013. Not one damn bit.

FF XIV's housing system is horrible.

But let's not perform lewd acts of appreciation for Blizzard just yet.

The only thing that modern Blizzard doesn't disappoint in is disappointment. If not right away, just give them a moment.

I really don't understand why people still throw rose petals and cash at their screens for Blizzard every time they speak when they haven't done anything to earn that loyalty for (at least) a decade, if not plain open contempt for their fans. It's something they've shown again, and again, and again, and again, and again.

Competition is great, and if Blizzard's housing can get FFXIV to budge even a bit on improving it's own housing system, I'm all for it. However, SqaureEnix as a whole tend to only rock the FFXIV boat when it's completely necessary. They're probably waiting for the other shoe to drop and see how modern Blizzard botches their housing before deciding if any moves are necessary. (My bet is severely limited amount of decorations, size of a player house is the size of a shoebox with no way to expand, and of course, everything but the absolute bare bones furniture is cash shop only).

Blizzard's housing promises sound like good marketing, but in a year or two the penny will drop as to why infinite and perpetual housing is too costly to maintain and they'll just do what FFXIV does.

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Originally Posted by Ardeth

It's hard not to see it. The game hasn't changed since 2013. Not one damn bit.

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Yes it has.
Back then the devs were highly dedicated to making the best experience possible with whatever they had to work with within the constrains of time they had.
Then after HW it changed and became checking off items on the list of the xpac/patch spreadsheet.
Then in changed again when covid came around and allowed them to do half the work in nearly twice the time.
The in EW they learned they could get away with putting minimal effort into the story and content and ppl would still verociously defend them.
And all those changes brought us to DT.