Mental exercise: create/change mechanics

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Originally Posted by Lyth

I think the best way to create new mechanics is to experiment with arena design. We've been seeing one of these 'variable' arenas for one fight each tier lately, although it would be more interesting if tank positioning/movement played an active part.

Visual tells are another way to make fights more interesting, especially if you remove boss cast bars as well.

I personally really like creative mechanics around undeath. Forgall from Mhach had a nice Necropurge/Megadeath mechanic, and Neo Exdeath likewise had a Living Dead styled mechanic in Beyond Death. Speaking of Neo Exdeath, it's much more interesting to integrate tankbusters alongside other mechanics rather than to have them go out in isolation when everyone else is in downtime.

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Maybe tank busters trigger another mechanic once they go off and it is up to the tanks to play accordingly for best results!

Within what we currently know the combat system might accomodate:

- More fights with constant damaging raidwide auras. This gives the regen healers more of a spotlight.
- More fights with priority adds. Not the 'add phase' that we see mostly, which looks like more of an 'intermission mini enrage' rather than handling both boss and adds at the same time.
- Stuff that only a ranged unit can do, like killing a certain target that is off reach by everyone else before it explodes.
- Halfway throuh the encounter, the party needs to distribute in groups of [(main tank + main tank's healer) / (off tank + 1 melee) / (1 melee + 1 ranged) / (flex dps) ] over platforms surrounding the boss. The other healer is not assigned to a group specifically and needs to be on the run periodically across platforms to triage everyone's unavoidable damage, and keep in check which platform will be assaulted with aoe next.
- Boss always directs the tankbusters at healers or at the dpser with the highest damage output and the offtank needs to help soak them.
- Boss periodically heals or esuna themselves off people's dots, so the tanks and phys ranged interrupts are actually useful.
- 'Healerbuster' assaults on healer's MP bars (probably only if actual MP management becomes more of a thing).
- You need to beat the last 20% health of the boss FAST. The 'enrage' is just a periodic raidwide every 10s getting stronger and stronger until it becomes impossible to heal, that while doing the mechanics.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

I think the best way to create new mechanics is to experiment with arena design.

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E4S, definitely not the hardest but imo still the best savage fight in Shadowbringers.

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Originally Posted by Local_Custard

(bump :3)

a status in a raid that if a player receives it, they'll become contagious. If they get a vuln stack, a nearby party member gets the vuln stack. If they get doom, a nearby party member gets doom.
The contagious status can stack. An extra stack will mean another party member will become contagious or multiple if there are 3 stacks. At 3 stacks it becomes curable. If the entire party is contagious and one is cured, they aren't made contagious right away (given 5 seconds of immunity. The boss would need to apply contagious again). At 5 stacks status goes away and 3 incurable statuses take its place: disease that lasts 30 seconds, damage down that lasts 1 minute, and Misery that lasts 1 minute.

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I wanna say coils had a fight like this a long time ago but my memory sucks

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Originally Posted by MonteCristo

I wanna say coils had a fight like this a long time ago but my memory sucks

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is that so? :0
Can someone confirm this? I cannot check because my computer is out being repaired

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Originally Posted by Local_Custard

is that so? :0
Can someone confirm this? I cannot check because my computer is out being repaired

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I don't remember exactly how it works, however, Allagan Rot from T2 is the first thing that sprang to mind.

To add something else to the discussion, something I have mentioned in the past is stuns/interrupts being useful, but not in the way that they stop an attack, but they change properties of it. As an example, a raidwide does massive damage, but, if you stun it, 50% of the damage goes out as normal and the last 50% goes out as a DoT over, say, 15 seconds. Whether something like this could be coded in the current engine is unknown, but it would shake up the dynamics of a fight, especially if you had different effects based on stuns or interrupts.

Found it! It was turn 2 coils

https://youtu.be/mqP2ooPB9ys?si=II1Ni7B7uTFajXXy

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Originally Posted by Mikey_R

I don't remember exactly how it works, however, Allagan Rot from T2 is the first thing that sprang to mind.

To add something else to the discussion, something I have mentioned in the past is stuns/interrupts being useful, but not in the way that they stop an attack, but they change properties of it. As an example, a raidwide does massive damage, but, if you stun it, 50% of the damage goes out as normal and the last 50% goes out as a DoT over, say, 15 seconds. Whether something like this could be coded in the current engine is unknown, but it would shake up the dynamics of a fight, especially if you had different effects based on stuns or interrupts.

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For this hypothetical, let's say the mechanics aren't limited by code or at least the code can accommodate it-

I would love if stun had more uses- too often I find myself itching to use it and finding it does nothing. I love interrupt. It's a skill I miss having when not playing bard, machinist, or gunbreaker. Sometimes I think whenever I play redmage: "man I would love if redmage had interrupt" (disclaimer: I have no idea if interrupt would be good or bad for redmage)
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Originally Posted by MonteCristo

Found it! It was turn 2 coils

https://youtu.be/mqP2ooPB9ys?si=II1Ni7B7uTFajXXy

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watched into this video and yeah it is similar, though the version of debuff I wrote is less about juggling who does and does not get it and more about curing as soon it reaches a certain point. Though, in essence it is the same- a debuff that acts like a disease. Thanks for linking the video!

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Originally Posted by Mikey_R

I don't remember exactly how it works, however, Allagan Rot from T2 is the first thing that sprang to mind.

To add something else to the discussion, something I have mentioned in the past is stuns/interrupts being useful, but not in the way that they stop an attack, but they change properties of it. As an example, a raidwide does massive damage, but, if you stun it, 50% of the damage goes out as normal and the last 50% goes out as a DoT over, say, 15 seconds. Whether something like this could be coded in the current engine is unknown, but it would shake up the dynamics of a fight, especially if you had different effects based on stuns or interrupts.

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They might not be able to implement changing an effect on the fly, but they don't necessarily even have to.

Let's say we simply make the cast interruptable, but if it is interrupted then the boss will cast the other spell immediately afterwards.
This could have the additional side effect of changing fight timings depending on which spell you've interrupted and which additional casts the boss consequently performs, delaying other mechanics.