Does anyone else miss coils raid design

For Normal? Yes
For Savage? No

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Now I’m saying this rather broadly and including most aspects of things people would generally consider aspects of coils raid design that fell away in Gordias and never really returned (just as a side note here I did coils on patch you don’t have to tell me that jobs are extremely different now and a lot of transition would be messy)

For me there are three things coils raids did that they did better than anything after it

1) pre fight mechanics- coils raids actually felt like what you would imagine when you think of raids, they had mini bosses, they had trash packs, they had hidden treasure chests, less so in final coil but the raids felt like they had a real sense of progression in physical space, in eden and omega specifically you just feel like you are being teleported around randomly but in coils you feel like you are making real descent into the depths of the coils; this is somewhat made both better and worse by T3 but I’m willing to overlook T3, however for most other fights it really adds to their scale. Think something like turn 11, the giant dalamud replica you have to traverse to get to the boss gives the boss a far larger scale than say just teleporting into shadowkeepers arena that looks like it’s in some random ruins in Lakeland

2) interesting and different mechanics- now you can make the argument that every mechanic is a new mechanic in the games first raid tier (I’m not counting original rivenroad here) but coils has a lot of mechanics we have never seen again and mechanics that do not fall into the traditional mechanical sense we know today, think mechanics like turn 11’s boss hitbox being a death field forcing you to rotate around him, or T6 leaf storm these mechanics are just so different to the dance we have today and they rarely felt like they got as boring as the raids we have now

3) adds phases- what is it about post HW design that means square cannot make good adds phases anymore, coils had fantastic adds phases and they were all Meaningful with unique mechanics that made them worth doing

So yeah coils just feels so different to anything after it and I feel like 14 is missing that kind of uniqueness in design, however I know coils completion on patch is rare these days so most people probably never experienced it and like our current system, I just think it could add some more diversity to 14 raiding to have more T1/2/6/7/8/11/12 style fights we really see nothing of these days

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Not really? Years of other MMO's making their raids just larger dungeons filled with trash mobs that you spend more time avoiding than fighting made me heavily appreciate 14's newer raids just using the trials format of jumping right to the boss. I do raids for the boss fights, I don't care about the filler crap.

Edit:
Maybe like the poster above me suggested and have something that is dungeon like with normal mode I can be ok with, but savage mode I like just jumping right into the boss fight.

I do miss the bit of exploration and mowing down mobs but it was expected that the design was gonna be streamlined. Just like how everything is with this game

I vastly prefer the current Raid design over the Coils design. I would never want to go back.

For an experience that's closer to the Coils: Alliance Raids.

I don't precisely know what i would love for normal raiding but i wish it was less formulated, it's really similar to trial when you think about it : One arena, one boss x 4, the only difference is the reward which is not really relevant gameplay wise.

I wanted more 'gimmicks' in normal dungeons like in ARR optional dungeons, but that's not the point of this thread...

So about raids, I do miss when they were more than just a series of Trials with a story. The mini-dungeon aspect before the final bosses were great, and even though people whine now about some of the Coils pre-boss mechanics I liked that aspect too, it made them stand out from trials, alliances and dungeons entirely by requiring something from the players besides just killing trash with AoEs.

It was neat but given the amount of times you need to pull over and over and over to get the Savage dance down, that would wear teams out a lot faster. Not to mention what would happen in Savage PF. I kind of like what they have now where they still have that feeling of progressing through something like oldschool MMO raiding with the alliance raids but keep the things you need to repeat more limited.

If they wanted to implement trash they'd probably need some sort of checkpoints because it would be a lot more difficult to get back to your prog point if you had to go through all the trash again. But checkpoints could make Savage PF a bit of a mess trying to coordinate those. So probably best to stick with the current design.

I think having trash mobs and traversing in the way of alliance raids would be pretty good for the normal modes to enrich the story, however for extremes and up I prefer getting straight to the boss.

More than the old raid design, I miss the varied Job design. It did have it's issues and duds but the current way they are pushing things is not very fun. DPS still have options, Tanks to lesser degree but Healers are starting to border abysmal.

Hopefully they revise the roles if they are keeping the current boss design, that has pretty clear burst windows, boss auto positioning and big hitbox etc.

More than anything, I miss an actual good story. None of the other 8-man raids had as good a story as Coils.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Trash is definitely a controversial subject (nobody likes turn 3) but I think it worked well in turn 1, the trash was dangerous and played into the fight (as did the mini boss) you could even elect to fight some extra trash for more chests which could hold interesting upgrade materials

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Wait hold up


I love Turn 3.

Just changing the jump arrows the last second sending someone the wrong way, laughing as they get flung to the wrong end of the area it great!