Middleground between normal/ hard content + coils of bahamut rework

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Though Hydaelyn is a bit of an outlier I'd say, as movement and timing is very specific.

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Titania was definitely like that too and a lot of people struggled with it compared to Innocence. I saw people struggle with the knockbacks, the DPS checks, the tethers and even just running to their spots.

The people who found Titania easy would also have found that one easy.

Wouldn't mind a Alliance CT and Coils rework either way, pulling them up to current standards.

They kind of feel too important for the story to be let on the side, especially since Cape Westwind, Castrum Meridianum and the Praetorium have gotten significant changes gameplay wise.

I agree that Extremes are a middle ground. And I consider BA, CLL and DR to be middle-ground too.
Extremes are basically crumbs however. And the other three while fun, have a long, long grind before you can access them. Meanwhile hardcore raiders get at least 4 fights every 2 patches, and ultimates.

I've seen other people comment this online and I'll echo their sentiments: Criterion non-savage was the perfect chance to add a middle-ground/"midcore" level endgame dungeon content and they blew it by making essentially 2 savage equivalents instead. Just ONE additional recurring series of content for the middle-ground would have been huge IMO. At least there is higher/lower floors of deep dungeons I guess...

A lot of people are fine with the content as-is and are perfectly happy with Extremes serving as the “middle ground”.

That is, until they leave the game to play something else because hardcore raiding doesn’t interest them.

Extremes don’t have a lot of rewards. We get one per patch. And once you’re done, you’re done. Farming is only needed for the mount. And there’s just ONE per patch. It’s not a proper game mode. It’s not a replacement for playing other games. As it stands, raiding in FFXIV is not a serious endeavor unless you are “hardcore”—and, even then, only for half the year. Extremes are a pittance. Sure, it’s content—technically. But it lasts for ten minutes and you’re paying $13 a month to do the same 10-minute fight and over again for no rewards. That’s not how gaming is supposed to be.

Suffice to say, FFXIV isn’t the most popular (or second or third-most popular) MMO for a reason. It’s not a good “easy” game—as the MSQ is basically a visual novel. It’s not a good “mid core” game, as extremes are as shallow as a puddle. And it’s not even a good “hardcore” game, as the annual cycle doesn’t keep people entertained all year long.

So what exactly are we good for?

https://files.catbox.moe/1yn1eo.jpg

extremes are good, but few and far between.

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Originally Posted by caffe_macchiato

It’s not a good “easy” game—as the MSQ is basically a visual novel. It’s not a good “mid core” game, as extremes are as shallow as a puddle. And it’s not even a good “hardcore” game, as the annual cycle doesn’t keep people entertained all year long.

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It's a good easy game for some people and not others.

It's a good hardcore game depending on what you define as hardcore. Hardcore in the sense of spending all your time playing often involves collecting (mounts, achievements, or something else) and most people I see doing that are busy all year grinding one thing or another.

Hardcore in the sense of doing the hardest content, sure, that doesn't last all year because no developer is really going to be able to make enough content that you aren't repeating the same thing a lot. It takes them months to make something that you play for 10 minutes. Imagine the resources it would take for them to make a fight that lasts 365 days.

But when I think of midcore, I'm blanking so you probably have a point about that.

I don't understand the point of talking about accessibility on ten year old content. It never is, and never will be sought out by players doing it while leveling to 90 with the exception of maybe 0.18% of people doing it. It's not realistic to ask for any changes to Coil, just like it's unrealistic to ask about Alexander, or Eden, or Omega. The most they did was throw things in there for Blue Mage, so that's the best option people have outside of unsynch'd. At least, until you have 7 people who are really, really bored and want to do it despite getting nothing out of it. I've only seen people doing it synched once, and that was since Heavensward where raiding was literally dead for all but the hardcore until A9.

And frankly, the options for growth are given to them via deep palace. Story just sets a bar below the ground, which is not acceptable if you want people to actually progress. I don't think Square remotely cares about it since people have fought for player growth for ten years now and nothing has been done. The bar was simply lowered instead because 'Not getting stepped on by a giant dragon lumbering forward is too hard'. Yes, that was a genuine complaint. You know what the answer to Steps of Faith complaints should have been? "Too bad". But instead it got nerfed into oblivion for no reason. I don't think it's a matter of SE being incompetent at this point. They simply don't want player progression to be a remote thought, and that's sad.

Extremes are not the middle ground. I really hate the one hit kills mechanics. At least they can do is make extremes have more forgiveness. Some of the dance moves we’re required to memorize have like 5 different things we have to look at and do (6.3 extreme).

The normal modes would show you the boss attack and the extreme mode will add 3 or 4 moves on top of that move. It would be nice if the devs trained players by making normal mode do the same moves as extreme but slower and more forgiving.

I can't tell for the difficulty part, since i'm actually fine with the current syste. For my wife a mid difficulty could help her since she lack of selfconfident for extrem, it might help her passing the gap and go in extrem fight.
For the bahamut coil i think a "normal" version should be had so people could enjoy both the fight and the story and the current version could be renamed as "savage" just as the other 8 man raid

I would really like to see more extreme level difficulty content. People that want difficult content have savage+ultimate, people that want casual content get dungeons/normal raids/alliance raids, whereas the middle ground players only get EX trials/unreal. (and unreal doesn't count when it's just the same old EX fights) The criterion dungeons were a step in the right direction in terms of giving those players more to do, but it'd still be nice to see more for the middle level players to do.