That comment is not to be taken as official. That's just my own personal view formulated from my observations while playing with other healers. I don't believe SE wants to punish their healers, but they also don't want other players to suffer due to the negligence of the game's healers. Healers are responsible for contributing to the DPS pool, but they are not DPS jobs and SE cannot approach them the same way. They have a primary responsibility to cleanse, heal, and raise fallen players, and it is no doubt a challenging task to design healing in a way that allows them to do damage, but also be paying attention to their comrades. The decision to simplify DPS skills for healers was not to cause them misery, and we need to stop thinking that way. For that, I would like to withdraw that statement. It was not meant to make you feel punished.Quote:
Originally Posted by GrimGale
Optional, yet better solution for Healing roles
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10-01-2021, 10:00 PMGemina
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10-01-2021, 10:32 PMRaikai
It would be nice if we had options to begin with... For example, I don't mind AST's dps rotation because the cards "minigame" is already fulfilling in regards something else to do, and it adds to the dps by buffing others. So, I'd love if they had, let's say, WHM and SGE reaching that "healer dps quota" by just having more complex dps rotations. AST and SCH reaching that quota by buffing its allies and debuffing the enemy respectively while keeping simple dps buttons... Of course the latter would need to have some kind of makeover to make this debuffing process as interesting as Cards.
And paying attention to the encounter mechanics which is already a huge deal, especially on Savage and above. Healers have the most difficult job there because they need to complete the encounter mechanics for everyone's survival, not just their own (like DPS and Tanks by some extent). On top of that, keep up with the healing, rezzing and optimizing their dps.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gemina
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10-01-2021, 10:38 PMIrenia
Yeah, I don't think they wanted to punish good play either, it's just the natural consequence of them following all their other goals.
I just wish more consideration was given to healer gameplay for those who aim high and those in groups who aim high. But perhaps making sure that the player base perceiving healers as 'healing' is more important... -
10-02-2021, 12:36 AMty_taurusIt's hard to express in words how much I hate bringing up tunnel-visioning healers as an arguement in any capacity when talking about design. With how much people bring up anecdotal stories of this one time 4 months ago when a healer didn't heal the tank in time and they wiped once during an expert roulette, one might start thinking that this was a serious issue that was destroying the FFXIV experience, yet it's not. I've dropped healing as of Shadowbringers and I can count the amount of times I've wiped in a dungeon because the healer forgot to heal on one hand in the last 2 years. And you know what happened in each of those experiences? They said "my bad" and we finished the dungeon like any other afterward. People make mistakes sometimes, and that's going to happen whether healers have greater depth in their DPS tools or not. It's not because we have DPS and balancing to prevent those rare and anecdotal scenarios is a one-way ticket to destroying any game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gemina
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10-02-2021, 01:49 AMQooErTanks and DPS also have party dependent skills that require some sort of situational awareness (tbn, aetherial manip, verraise, even addle/feint) and yet theyre allowed to have a rotation that consists of more than one button.Quote:
Originally Posted by Raikai
There are any mechanics in savage and above where anyone's failure = wipe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Raikai
"Keeping up with healing/rezzing" stops being an issue past prog. And theres not much room for optimizing dps if all you have is one spam button. its literally just keeping the gcd rollingQuote:
Originally Posted by Raikai
Healers dont have the most difficult job, if anything its the easiest by far because most fights do so little damage so sporadically that you can get by simply throwing an aoe heal as soon as a mechanic happens -
10-02-2021, 03:52 AMGeminaIt's not just one time in a random dungeon, 4 months ago. One player's experience can't dictate job design for the entire player base. I can easily counter your argument with my own experience because I see healers doing damage when they should be healing all the time. Its not a reason to tar and feather those healers. It's an honest mistake, but a mistake nonetheless. Furthermore, most healers will admit to tunnel visioning from time to time, and attribute it to boredom, so it's far from a strawman argument.Quote:
Originally Posted by ty_taurus
So is boredom reason enough to change things up? No, it's not. Because healing isn't the only thing healers have to pay attention to. They also have mechanics to deal with. But if mechanics are keeping you engaged, then you shouldn't be getting bored. And if you're so good at the game that you're bored in current EX, savage, and finally ultimate then I honestly don't know what to tell you. Thats pretty exceptional, and once again cannot dictate how all content is designed.
In short, boredom isn't a strong enough or a compelling counter argument to tunnel-vision reasoning by the devs. There are no numbers that represent bored healers, but there are numbers the devs see when players are not getting healed, cleansed, and resurrected. It's self-defeating, unfortunately.
I find that it is more rational to use fairness when it comes to creating engaging kits for healers. If players feel like they are not receiving equal treatment when it comes to their design and making things more fun as other jobs and roles, I believe that makes a far more compelling case for the devs to look at. -
10-02-2021, 04:50 AMAveraxTBH, i really don't understand the people who's idea of enthralling healer dps is simply to add more dots to it. Applying and maintaining dots has never been engaging gameplay for me. It's different if they proc something more exciting to use.Quote:
Originally Posted by Garnix
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10-02-2021, 04:57 AMAcece
I'm really not one for giving buffs to all healers because I feel like that cuts into astro's identity a little too much, and if it's buffs that isn't just straight dps then I feel like we would be taking physical ranged dps thing. I think every healer should have it's own offensive style. ast it's buffs, whm it would be self buffs and burst, sch would be debuffs and dots, and sage it should be it's interaction between its heals and dps. I also hate relying on other people for my damage.
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10-02-2021, 04:58 AMMelorieThis. I'm so tired of this. Every time I come into this forum it's the same "BUT WHAT IF HEALERS ARE DPSING INSTEAD OF HEALING AAA??"... There are DPS out there not doing their rotation, or tanks that don't use their cooldowns, it sometimes happens, some people play the game badly, or sometimes they do mistakes and forget to do something they should - doesn't really mean that it's a good excuse to keep pushing us into a AoE heal > burst heal > glare&dia forever and forever till the keycap 1 in your keyboard breaks. The mental gymnastics people do to defend this is amusing.Quote:
Originally Posted by ty_taurus
Besides, everyone has to do mechanics. If anything, I would say that most fights aren't that mechanic heavy on healers? I'm not saying that healing doesn't have its own sort of pressure - but acting like it deserves to be treated as a three-button class just because you have to do the stuff that everyone else does... *sigh*. -
10-02-2021, 07:05 AMBooPooThis so much this. Instead of degrading this game into Wow, let's just give healers their own, unique, offensive playstyles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Acece