1.22 - 1.22a - 1.22b changes

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Originally Posted by 1clou

Im completely fine with the mechanics of gettng behind a mob. its very easy to do without pointing a mob at the party. you just run throuh mob activate ws on other side whike you have your char run back as soon as ability is.proc'd and thus you got your combo. there isn't anything wrong with how the combos work for pld/gla as far as comboing from the back its all about timing. hopefully they keep combo direction qualifications as they are as they do add to skill requirements for a "good tank"

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Works both ways Iclou

Your back is also to the enemy something every tank shouldn't do :P.

but if all glads WS combos were from the front glad could also increase its damage protential ever so slightly so its worth considering.

P.S

Still in the middle of shield testing.

But so far looks like the Block Stat does nothing

Aye it seems like SE might be getting rid of the Block stat or maybe adjusting it in 1.22b to where additional damage is reduced off the initial reduction.

I actually had a chance to fight Ifrit last night and it was very nice to block his 600+ attacks/swipes for 300ish, so it is a flat rate across the board. However the shield type and level of the shield might affect it as well, I'll grab some random high/low level shields of similar types and do more testing later.

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Originally Posted by 1clou

Im completely fine with the mechanics of gettng behind a mob. its very easy to do without pointing a mob at the party. you just run throuh mob activate ws on other side whike you have your char run back as soon as ability is.proc'd and thus you got your combo. there isn't anything wrong with how the combos work for pld/gla as far as comboing from the back its all about timing. hopefully they keep combo direction qualifications as they are as they do add to skill requirements for a "good tank"

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I agree with 1clou, the positional requirements for weaponskills (for all classes) make fights more dynamic imo. And it comes down to timing. (i.e. Garuda does Slipstream, which is conal, so the perfect time to dodge behind her and use Riot Blade. Ifrit goes into animation locks for plenty of his moves, when Coincounter is sitting on the floor after a swipe/swing, there's another opportunity. Miser... probably not lol)

Also, making all the skills frontal would make it a lot harder for the gld/pld role to vary. I still see some potential in a DD gld that is back up heal on DD, could have a Pld tank for the divine veil proc of divine regen, and a gld AoE cure and SS the DD when they get hurt so that whm can focus purely on tank (this would also hit the tank :D). This would be w/o a ranged DD strat obviously, which I know isn't all that common but doesn't mean there isn't potential there. If all these skills were frontal a gld in that situation would run huge risks by having to run in front of the boss every time they had tp.

My only issue with the weaponskills is tp -_- Dunno if it's just my build or not... but I rarely have tp for anything more than Phalanx + Spirits Within and War Drums. Due to missing, so Tp cost reduction would be nice or acc boost.

they should do the shield size thing like they did in XI where there were i think 6? sizes of shields, the smaller the size the more you blocked but the less damage it mitigated. so a size 1 shield might block 90% of the time but only mitigate 15% of the damage while a size 6 shield would block only 20% of the time but reduce damage by 75% or something like that

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I agree with 1clou, the positional requirements for weaponskills (for all classes) make fights more dynamic imo. And it comes down to timing. (i.e. Garuda does Slipstream, which is conal, so the perfect time to dodge behind her and use Riot Blade. Ifrit goes into animation locks for plenty of his moves, when Coincounter is sitting on the floor after a swipe/swing, there's another opportunity. Miser... probably not lol)

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I also agree.

If positional requirements are holding back melees from dealing the damage that they are supposed to relative to other classes/jobs, then that's more so a problem with content.

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they should do the shield size thing like they did in XI where there were i think 6? sizes of shields, the smaller the size the more you blocked but the less damage it mitigated. so a size 1 shield might block 90% of the time but only mitigate 15% of the damage while a size 6 shield would block only 20% of the time but reduce damage by 75% or something like that

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Something like that, and I liked it.

DD glad two swords no shield or less damage mitigation fair enough

But DD PLD no thanks

PLD are stalwarts of the defense ONLY jin my opinion

They should get rid of the Block stat and replace it with pure Defense.
This way, we can at last have a far better defense than other classes.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

They should get rid of the Block stat and replace it with pure Defense.
This way, we can at last have a far better defense than other classes.

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I agree with ya on that, atm block appears to be disabled in shields damage calculation formula, although they may make it where it will take off additional damage off set mitigation for blocking (which would be great knocking a 600 DMG move to 300 with another -120 reduced off the top.) And of course extra defense from a shield would actually put us a league ahead of WAR without going balls out double/triple melding gear.

Just wanted to add something I noticed.

I was tanking Garuda last night again as a Warrior. I noticed partial parries were parrying for 500ish damage.

We decided to do a run with at least one of every class and of course I shined at the chance to use Paladin.

All of my blocks were never higher than 4XX damage.

This parry was a random parry that occured without the use of Foresight.

I am unsure if it was just a bad parry but I want to look into this a bit.

I also wanted to test out the new mitigation from a shield on a level 99 goblin headman. With a parry from foresight, my damage taken was reduced from 9999 to 5.7k.

Now this part made me laugh, I chucked Divine Veil on and ran straight to the goblin and partial blocked his attack for 9999 damage. lol.

Foresight gives a great parry for like 2 damage taken on Garuda, Aegis for 0. But for partial parry vs partial block. Block seems to be in favour as far as I have seen.

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Originally Posted by LCorvus

I agree with 1clou, the positional requirements for weaponskills (for all classes) make fights more dynamic imo. And it comes down to timing. (i.e. Garuda does Slipstream, which is conal, so the perfect time to dodge behind her and use Riot Blade. Ifrit goes into animation locks for plenty of his moves, when Coincounter is sitting on the floor after a swipe/swing, there's another opportunity. Miser... probably not lol)

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Miser's one of the easier bosses to get a rear WS on actually, haha. She doesn't turn unless she's doing a WS and those are fairly predictable. While Riot/Goring being rear required is fine on its own, combined with all their other failings (high TP cost on riot blade, 80s cooldowns on each of them, mediocre damage) they end up being really, really bad weaponskills.

Another problem with paladin WSes is that flat blade deals the same damage as an auto attack and doesn't combo into anything. Spirits Within needs to stay on phalanx but it'd be nice if there was something we could follow up flat blade with. Maybe shield bash with combo bonus: increased damage or Holy Succor with combo bonus: reduced cast time.