Possible Ideas to Address Hrothgar/Viera Hat Disparity?

I see that the problem is not adding holes per se on some head items like wizard hats... Because in theory it would work the same way a Miqo ear.

The issue is that Viera ears are sitting on top of their heads and extremely close together, making a weird vertical clipping in headgear models that adding holes wouldn't help. But that's just a portion of those items, specifically the taller ones.

The way I would approach would be just adding the holes (or just let it clip through like Bozja's hoods) for headgear that is very close to the scalp, like bandanas, berets or very small helms. For big hats like the point ones, just hide the ears altogether, like the visual example a few posts above. There would be many helms still impossible to work around, but even if we got half of what's available, it still would be better than the current situation.

For viera, honestly just do what you do for au'ra and full helms... just have them clip though. Like seriously the giant horn types for the au'ra realistically should mean they can't use a helm since even if you had horn holes in the sides, how would you explain getting the rest of the horn through that small hole?

Only people who want to whine about something would care that hats or helms didn't physically show ear slots, everyone else would be 100% okay with them just clipping through cause they already do that for au'ra! And I haven't seen anyone myself complain about it.

Hrothgar? for helms I kinda get it like full on full knight like helms I mean you could make their helms look like they are made specially to show the beast like face... but I don't think anyone would mind if you just had the helm cover the head like any other race because if people didn't like that the helms didn't mold perfectly to match their beast face? They wouldn't use it anyway while the people who just want to use helms would, hats? Do the same thing for miqo'te, have the ears just clip through the hat.

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Originally Posted by NealSnow

For viera, honestly just do what you do for au'ra and full helms... just have them clip though. Like seriously the giant horn types for the au'ra realistically should mean they can't use a helm since even if you had horn holes in the sides, how would you explain getting the rest of the horn through that small hole?

Only people who want to whine about something would care that hats or helms didn't physically show ear slots, everyone else would be 100% okay with them just clipping through cause they already do that for au'ra! And I haven't seen anyone myself complain about it.

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SE obviously seems to think that not allowing any sort of clipping for viera is the preferred route. Something about ear clipping is so bad, that they won't do this. :( Adjustable ears, ear types? The reason?

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

SE obviously seems to think that not allowing any sort of clipping for viera is the preferred route. Something about ear clipping is so bad, that they won't do this. :( Adjustable ears, ear types? The reason?

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I don't think ear types are the reason though... because they are very similar, except to the lowered ones that would probably clip down into a bigger helm with ornaments. They all start at the same base.

The clipping problem is more that some hats (pointy hats for example) would "slice" the ears in half because they are very close on top of the head and go upwards, different from horns or miqo'te ears that go more in a diagonal or sideways.

But still, there are about a ton of items that could be used even if they just let the ears clip through like they do in some Bozjan headgear.

While I can't speak for Hrothgar as I haven't really looked too closely at them, another quick and dirty method for Viera could be to just have generic ears baked into the hat design similar to how some Miqo head gear like most of the metal helms just have generic ear guard bits. Of course, this wouldn't make many people happy as the ears would not be colour or style/type matched to the character using the headgear but at least it would allow for Viera headgear to have ears without requiring the work of allowing custom ears to show. Just pick a neutral colour and a style that fits the theme of the hat itself and go.

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Originally Posted by Raikai

The clipping problem is more that some hats (pointy hats for example) would "slice" the ears in half because they are very close on top of the head and go upwards, different from horns or miqo'te ears that go more in a diagonal or sideways.

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There's already a setting to turn ears completely off they could use for hats that are large enough to feasibly fit the ears inside them, they wouldn't need to worry about them coming out the sides or top of the hat.

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Originally Posted by Raikai

But still, there are about a ton of items that could be used even if they just let the ears clip through like they do in some Bozjan headgear.

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They can't just let the ears clip through more items because the ears aren't really the problem in most cases, it's the hair. The only reason the hood models work on us is because they make you bald underneath, a select few helmets that completely replace the head and hair also work, and small items that sit on top of the hair like a hairpin and don't require any further modification to the hair itself.

The bigger reason we don't have more (but definitely not all) working headgear isn't the ears clipping through or Hrothgar's face proportions at all, but the fact that they didn't make 2 models of the same hairstyle like they normally do that hide parts of the hair where the hat would sit when you equip it. Because this second, partially culled 'hat-hairstyle' doesn't exist for Viera and Hrothgar, if you were to force certain hats to show like in the image I posted earlier then the Hrothgar simply goes bald and Viera's ears and hair clips straight through it.

If they made partially culled 'hat-versions' of our hairstyles like they normally do then a lot more items would be able to be used while either hiding the ears or letting them clip through where appropriate.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

There's already a setting to turn ears completely off they could use for hats that are large enough to feasibly fit the ears inside them, they wouldn't need to worry about them coming out the sides or top of the hat.



They can't just let the ears clip through more items because the ears aren't really the problem in most cases, it's the hair. The only reason the hood models work on us is because they make you bald underneath, a select few helmets that completely replace the head and hair also work, and small items that sit on top of the hair like a hairpin and don't require any further modification to the hair itself.

The bigger reason we don't have more (but definitely not all) working headgear isn't the ears clipping through or Hrothgar's face proportions at all, but the fact that they didn't make 2 models of the same hairstyle like they normally do that hide parts of the hair where the hat would sit when you equip it. Because this second, partially culled 'hat-hairstyle' doesn't exist for Viera and Hrothgar, if you were to force certain hats to show like in the image I posted earlier then the Hrothgar simply goes bald and Viera's ears and hair clips straight through it.

If they made partially culled 'hat-versions' of our hairstyles like they normally do then a lot more items would be able to be used while either hiding the ears or letting them clip through where appropriate.

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Oh, here we go with the hair! Makes sense though. Never thought of their hair being the main reason. :(

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Oh, here we go with the hair! Makes sense though. Never thought of their hair being the main reason. :(

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Yep :( Which also makes me wonder if this is why Viera at least can't use any of the Modern Aesthetics.

Those hairstyles do have the second hat-compatible model, so then we'd either have a few hat-compatible hairstyles making it terribly inconsistent, or they'd have to go through every headgear item and force it to remain hidden when the character is a Viera in combination with that particular hairstyle.

But maybe that's tinfoil hat territory. :)

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Originally Posted by Lumivyory

You do realize that people wouldn't be "demanding more and more" if Viera and Hrothgar would be included in the "proper races"?
That is exactly the reason why you see so many threads about it. Why should we be happy about races that look like they were done in 5 minutes before the release of the expansion? Nobody asked for that and a lot of people would be fine with waiting until 6.0 if those races were done better by that time.
And now it's been over a year since ShB release and we got literally no updates for these races. People have all the rights to be unhappy, considering we were told that at least we'd get more hairstyles.

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I can only really speak for myself, but I'm fairly certain many people would've rather had Viera ears be tied to face like Au Ra, or just have a single ear model like Miqo, if it meant they could use all hairstyles and hats like the other races. Hrothgars....are quite a bit more complicated, though.

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Originally Posted by Allegor

I can only really speak for myself, but I'm fairly certain many people would've rather had Viera ears be tied to face like Au Ra, or just have a single ear model like Miqo, if it meant they could use all hairstyles and hats like the other races. Hrothgars....are quite a bit more complicated, though.

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I agree. I don't know why SE thought they needed to place the ears the way they are, I'd rather have them place them in a way that wouldn't prevent the use of hats and older hairstyles.
While I do understand that they simply made them the same way that Fran's ears work I just feel like it wasn't necessary. It's a different game so our Viera could have looked different, even if Fran made an appearance at some point.