bozja release confirmed for october 13th

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

I wouldn't call it a win-win for both kinds of people. This expansion has been lacking in more than a few areas, though the story has been one of the best. Honestly, I just want some things to keep me logging in after a week or 2. I haven't had that for what seems like forever now. I'm not alone on this either. If the current pacing and quality is something you prefer, then great. Good for you. Certainly not the case for all of us. I get that there's a pandemic, so I understand why they are a little behind. A delay or 2 is to be expected. The delays aren't really bothering me quite as much as the quality of what they've been pushing out. I think I've spent more time playing other games this expansion than I have during any other. They seem to put a ton of effort into the story and Nier raids, and then the rest of the expansion's content suffers. If that's how it's going to be I would prefer that they go back to mediocre story telling.

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What kept you logging on at this point in prior expansions? Were there points you stopped bothering to log on because there wasn't anything you want to do?

We also know they decided to make this expansion about adding "lifestyle content". The push to get more players crafting and gathering has been part of that. There's also the player run farms they have mentioned on a few occasions as being a new feature this expansion but otherwise haven't been discussed.

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Originally Posted by linayar

I don't play much of the game. My interests lie strictly in leveling certain jobs (which I think I'm done with this expansion unless I get an "itch" to level another job), MSQ, trial series, raid series (both normal and alliance), roulettes, and trying out the relic. And I only do normal content, no extreme, savage, or ultimate. And I don't see how any of those content have suffered (no, I don't count having one dungeon per patch as a negative). The only thing that I can see as a negative is for people who wanted a new deep dungeon (and maybe people who wanted new Hildibrand story). As for people who like crafting/gathering, it's probably a positive unless you just don't like changes to the classes and other QoL.

So all of that with a good story really makes this expansion very good (2020 thing aside).

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While that may work for you as someone who only intends to play the game for a small portion of time. It isn't a win many others. Of everything you listed, I'll have it all done over a weekend. And that's if I opt to stretch it out. Hell, my BFF worked full time throughout the pandemic and we still did 5.3's entire content in less than two days—excluding the EX. Which I did on my own later. This is what frustrates a lot of people. The sheer lack of longevity. Even if 5.35 released on time, we're waiting six weeks because the little breadcrumb of content finally dropped lasted a grand total of two days.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

What kept you logging on at this point in prior expansions? Were there points you stopped bothering to log on because there wasn't anything you want to do?

We also know they decided to make this expansion about adding "lifestyle content". The push to get more players crafting and gathering has been part of that. There's also the player run farms they have mentioned on a few occasions as being a new feature this expansion but otherwise haven't been discussed.

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In my case? Nothing. I logged in to cap and essentially "quit" for three months. The only reason I bothered capping is I figured I'd eventually want to go back into Savage. So it kept my gear up-to-date. Besides, hunt trains get two hours, tops.

As a crafter, I detest the changes that came with Shadowbringers. They just made everything comically easy, which it turn destroys the market board prices. Not to mention, they don't do a single thing about bots. Yes, Expert recipes are a thing but outside of twelve days every four months, they're pointless.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

While that may work for you as someone who only intends to play the game for a small portion of time. It isn't a win many others. Of everything you listed, I'll have it all done over a weekend. And that's if I opt to stretch it out. Hell, my BFF worked full time throughout the pandemic and we still did 5.3's entire content in less than two days—excluding the EX. Which I did on my own later. This is what frustrates a lot of people. The sheer lack of longevity. Even if 5.35 released on time, we're waiting six weeks because the little breadcrumb of content finally dropped lasted a grand total of two days.

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But that's the same as with prior expansion, so I don't see that as this expansion has been lacking, as Vahlnir said. I guess the only other difference that I didn't mention is relic, but meh, it'll be here when it gets here. And considering the only relic I ever finished is SMN's HW relic during SB, it's not exactly a priority of mine.

Nonetheless, the context of my original win-win statement is for people who have other games to play. If you don't have other games to play or activities to do when not playing FFXIV, then I wasn't talking about you.

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Originally Posted by linayar

But that's the same as with prior expansion, so I don't see that as this expansion has been lacking, as Vahlnir said. I guess the only other difference that I didn't mention is relic, but meh, it'll be here when it gets here. And considering the only relic I ever finished is SMN's HW relic during SB, it's not exactly a priority of mine.

Nonetheless, the context of my original win-win statement is for people who have other games to play. If you don't have other games to play or activities to do when not playing FFXIV, then I wasn't talking about you.

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Which, to be fair, has been a major complaint for years now. One of the few serious criticisms FFXIV gets lobbied with the lack of longevity in much of the content. With that said, we used to have the relic release earlier. Had they at least opted for Bozja to come out in 5.25 or 5.1, we'd have all this time to farm additional relics. While the delay certainly cannot be blamed on SE. It does highlight how poorly structured their content cycles are. Patches shouldn't be crippled due to a delay yet they are because people are already looking for more to do a month into a new patch.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Which, to be fair, has been a major complaint for years now. One of the few serious criticisms FFXIV gets lobbied with the lack of longevity in much of the content. With that said, we used to have the relic release earlier. Had they at least opted for Bozja to come out in 5.25 or 5.1, we'd have all this time to farm additional relics. While the delay certainly cannot be blamed on SE. It does highlight how poorly structured their content cycles are. Patches shouldn't be crippled due to a delay yet they are because people are already looking for more to do a month into a new patch.

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Maybe, but I think that has more to do with them making new zones rather than simply add extra reward to the usual fate/dungeon/raid grind. The only other way that I can see them releasing relic earlier in the expansion is if they make it a requirement for character progression, like if you need to be caught up with the relic while still integrating savage rewards in order to be equipped to do ultimate. But that could have its own downside with people feeling forced to do content they don't want to do.

Also, if a delay doesn't "cripple" a patch's content, that tells me the grind in that patch is too much, and I personally do not like that.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Which, to be fair, has been a major complaint for years now. One of the few serious criticisms FFXIV gets lobbied with the lack of longevity in much of the content. With that said, we used to have the relic release earlier. Had they at least opted for Bozja to come out in 5.25 or 5.1, we'd have all this time to farm additional relics. While the delay certainly cannot be blamed on SE. It does highlight how poorly structured their content cycles are. Patches shouldn't be crippled due to a delay yet they are because people are already looking for more to do a month into a new patch.

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Yeah, I guess this might be my issue. I've been around awhile, and I think at this point it might be getting on my nerves a bit. I've probably played more WoW than I have FF XIV over the last 6 months, and I haven't been playing WoW very much either, though that is largely because BfA is a horrible expansion so my focus has largely been on old content collecting things. Thankfully it will be over in just under a month. I think if I had a reason to go back to old content and roflstomp my way through it for gear/mounts/etc like I can in WoW (Legacy mode) I would probably be a bit happier with the state of this game. But I can't, sadly, at least not to the extent I can in WoW. Even still, my opinion on Shadowbringers would probably remain unchanged even if I was able to do all of that. I got my dream job and a good story, but...that's basically it. I'm not saying I'm unhappy with those, because I'm not. Those are great! An expansion just needs more content, and SE has struggled with this for awhile.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Yeah, I guess this might be my issue. I've been around awhile, and I think at this point it might be getting on my nerves a bit. I've probably played more WoW than I have FF XIV over the last 6 months, and I haven't been playing WoW very much either, though that is largely because BfA is a horrible expansion so my focus has largely been on old content collecting things. Thankfully it will be over in just under a month. I think if I had a reason to go back to old content and roflstomp my way through it for gear/mounts/etc like I can in WoW (Legacy mode) I would probably be a bit happier with the state of this game. But I can't, sadly, at least not to the extent I can in WoW. Even still, my opinion on Shadowbringers would probably remain unchanged even if I was able to do all of that. I got my dream job and a good story, but...that's basically it. I'm not saying I'm unhappy with those, because I'm not. Those are great! An expansion just needs more content, and SE has struggled with this for awhile.

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I think WoW would generally take more of your time since you need a character for each class you want to play. But comparatively speaking, for the types of content that I do, it's generally less than FFXIV since WoW really only has one type of daily that I would actively do (world quest, though Shadowlands might change that). Normal/heroic dungeon dailies are not as fun, profitable (loot RNG), or necessary with scaling. So the only instance content that I look forward to doing is LFR which is more of a weekly thing and I spend a long time just queueing as a DPS or waiting on tanks when the tank inevitably leaves mid run. Interestingly enough, I can't find the motivation to run old raids as a recurring content to do. I recently did one wing of Legion LFR to get a leather chest for my rogue and got it the first clear and stopped. I was surprised too at how much money that one run gave me, and I heard it will be nerfed in Shadowlands, but still not worth the effort for me, especially for higher tiers where you have to manually go to the entrance.

That said, as I have been preparing for Shadowlands, I do have more things to do on my alts right now, but I don't even touch my main unless I'm just sending it some transmog appearance to add to the collection.

(I'll be so sad if WoW's prepatch will be on the same date as 5.35 because I want to focus on one game for like a week.)

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Originally Posted by linayar

I think WoW would generally take more of your time since you need a character for each class you want to play

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Correct. I'm an "altoholic" so to speak in that regard, which does help increase my overall playtime. They also give people plenty of reasons to level/play alts. I'm currently unsubbed from WoW while I wait for the pre-patch, otherwise I might be logging in a couple times a week to do something. Being able to do everything on one character in FF XIV is nice, but there's little reason to level an alt at all for most people.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Correct. I'm an "altoholic" so to speak in that regard, which does help increase my overall playtime. They also give people plenty of reasons to level/play alts. I'm currently unsubbed from WoW while I wait for the pre-patch, otherwise I might be logging in a couple times a week to do something. Being able to do everything on one character in FF XIV is nice, but there's little reason to level an alt at all for most people.

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Yeah, but if WoW ever allows me to use one character to play all classes, I'd take that option. It bothers me that I skip many things on my alts, but I just don't want to redo the same quests again unless I have no choice in order to unlock certain features. And so, it might be strange for some people, but I like that MSQ is required in FFXIV and that I have to pay if I don't want to do it up to the current expansion, because it means I don't have to redo the quests but also means my character did not skip them as they're not optional. It's psychologically satisfying.

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Originally Posted by linayar

Yeah, but if WoW ever allows me to use one character to play all classes, I'd take that option. It bothers me that I skip many things on my alts, but I just don't want to redo the same quests again unless I have no choice in order to unlock certain features. And so, it might be strange for some people, but I like that MSQ is required in FFXIV and that I have to pay if I want to do it up to the current expansion, because it means I don't have to redo the quests but also means my character did not skip them as they're not optional. It's psychologically satisfying.

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As far as quests and the main story goes, WoW and FF XIV are 2 completely different beasts. In WoW the story or stories are segmented and I'd argue that everything is optional eventually prior to the most current expansion, though most content is still there for those who want to unlock it. I like how FF XIV handles the MSQ and such so you aren't alone. But again, the 2 games handle it differently and I like both for different reasons.