Option to unlock content without mandatory MSQ

For at least the optional dungeons, raids and trials that are the only real things locked behind the msq how would those taking this optional skip of the msq get the gear to be able to do those things? The only thing the msq keeps crafter and gathers from is expansion zones needed for quests. Otherwise most things unlock post the GC choice which is a lv 20 msq.

I doubt they'd do it, but I'd like it if they did. I've had friends quit playing for exactly this reason - because you can't separate group play from the story. You have to do one to do the other no matter what, and you can't even access nearly any expansion content without doing the msq.

Not something I recall really encountering in any other MMO... unless swtor locked planets with the story but I don't actually remember that being a thing except maybe for the start zones and newer zones needing certain quests to get there? Idk it's been years lol

This is a pretty tough one TBH.

On one side of the coin, the ARR MSQ is pretty bad and highly protracted. There's little denying that it's quite the wall to get through. IMHO things get much better once you move into the HW era and beyond though.

On the flip side though, simply allowing people to skip the MSQ strikes me as a bad idea. The MSQ Duties and in world fluff at least force you to get somewhat used to your job and hotkeys. Allowing a player to jump straight into the end game with literally no clue what they are doing isn't something I'd relish for the good of DF. Things can get pretty bad as they are.

I do think that an MSQ squish is in order at least though, I think this is something that's been touched on in a couple of live letters?

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

This is a pretty tough one TBH.

On one side of the coin, the ARR MSQ is pretty bad and highly protracted. There's little denying that it's quite the wall to get through. IMHO things get much better once you move into the HW era and beyond though.

On the flip side though, simply allowing people to skip the MSQ strikes me as a bad idea. The MSQ Duties and in world fluff at least force you to get somewhat used to your job and hotkeys. Allowing a player to jump straight into the end game with literally no clue what they are doing isn't something I'd relish for the good of DF. Things can get pretty bad as they are.

I do think that an MSQ squish is in order at least though, I think this is something that's been touched on in a couple of live letters?

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They're aiming for an ARR squish for like 5.3 i want to say as that'll come out for when they give us the ARR NG+ part. That and there are so many people who either don't realize there are optional things or just don't care about it. I remember a thread back during the patch that came out around when Hells Lid got added and someone complaining about the ilv jump for I want to say the Tsukiyomi fight and they hadn't even unlocked Hells Lid which gives gear because they didn't even realize it existed even though the story was all hey Tataru you n Soroban go have some fun looking into Hells Lid while we go searching for Gosetsu.

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Originally Posted by 347SPECTRE

Let me get the popcorn. Who wants butter?

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Why is this suggestion considered controversial to you? It seems fairly innocent to me, being a voluntary option (it's not like it's changing how players present themselves like the hide glamour thread). Feel free to make me aware of any considerations I may not be taking into account. Is there some kind of (ethical) principle that I'm overlooking?

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Originally Posted by SamRF

Why is this suggestion considered controversial to you? It seems fairly innocent to me, being a voluntary option (it's not like it's changing how players present themselves like the hide glamour thread). Feel free to make me aware of any considerations I may not be taking into account. Is there some kind of (ethical) principle that I'm overlooking?

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Ethics no. Floodgates of people in later instances who have no idea what they're doing? Yes.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

This is a pretty tough one TBH.

On one side of the coin, the ARR MSQ is pretty bad and highly protracted. There's little denying that it's quite the wall to get through. IMHO things get much better once you move into the HW era and beyond though.

On the flip side though, simply allowing people to skip the MSQ strikes me as a bad idea. The MSQ Duties and in world fluff at least force you to get somewhat used to your job and hotkeys. Allowing a player to jump straight into the end game with literally no clue what they are doing isn't something I'd relish for the good of DF. Things can get pretty bad as they are.

I do think that an MSQ squish is in order at least though, I think this is something that's been touched on in a couple of live letters?

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Could this be remedied by requiring a mandatory solo instance for each role at certain levels that could act like a barrier? In this case you'd have to first prove being capable at your role before being able to use this option.

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Originally Posted by SamRF

Are you kidding me? This is a troll bait? I've been considerate and asked genuine question in my OP, I'm not even complaining about anything and explicitely ask what should be taken into consideration and why this should or shouldn't be an option. It feels like I'm the one being baited by replying to this.

Is any thread that could spark discussion considered a troll bait to you?

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After seeing some of your posts where you ask for ridiculous things it is very easy to think so, also there is option to skip Msq it's called skip potion

This is a STORY-DRIVEN game, period. Regardless of being an MMO, it is based on a very prominent story and that won't change, period.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

Ethics no. Floodgates of people in later instances who have no idea what they're doing? Yes.

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Are you implying there isn't already a sea of people at max level who have absolutely no idea what they're doing? I mean, who exactly does the msq even actually gate? Maybe like, a small handful of people, considering we have the echo and very easy settings on solo duties now. I'm pretty sure the only thing msq scenarios have taught me as that SE has been improving their use of npcs in fights over the years (imo) and that I freaking hate pointlessly long drawn out fights where I only get to use three or four buttons (*cough*Ranjit*cough*) :p