Culling and restructuring skills to make room for 5.0 abilities

I am not seeing anyone here suggesting we remove/merge all of the cross role skills. Since they aren't cross role anymore and we all get all of them I see no reason they couldn't just merge most of those back into the classes. All of those abilities that either interrupt or slow an enemy, merge that status effect into an ability in the class. Some abilities like True North or Esuna might need to stay. I could see this freeing up at least 5 buttons on everyone's bars, maybe more.

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Originally Posted by Neela

for smn pls combine trance with deathflare and Bahamut with Akh Morn... those „summon“-buttons are just waste of slots especially on controller <.<

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I thought so too but for the trance/deathflare I realized why it would be a TERRIBLE idea. Indeed, deathflare ends trance. Since deathflare has a cooldown anyway, I honestly don't understand why it wasn't changed with SB and still does so, but it does.

So picture yourself this exemple : in fight, you're mashing that button to enter trance (everyone is mashing let's be honest we watch PoV), and alas smash once too much : you just entered trance and immediately deathflared by mistake.

Sadness ensues.

SO yes to the switch IF they remove the "trance ending" effect, the cooldown preventing more than one use per trance anyway.

Totally ok for Akh Morn and summon Bahamut though. What I do meanwhile to compensate for their lack of thought in ergonomy, is this macro :

/micon "Enkindle Bahamut"
/macroerror off
/actionerror off
/ac "Enkindle Bahamut"
/ac "Summon Bahamut"


I use the icon of Akh morn to see the cooldown during Baha, cause we have to use it twice. The fact Bahamut is summonable is on the job UI so no need for the icon.
So what it does : if Bahamut is not here, it summons it. If he's here, it launches Akh Morn. The slight clipping for the macro on an oGCD is ok cause you normally just single weave in Bahamut. The too errors off is to avoid annoying messages.

And you can use it for some skills that only launch under a condition also. But not on deathflare cause of what I mentioned above.

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Originally Posted by Karshan

Snip.

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What SE should do in my opinion is merge Summon Bahamut and Rouse with DWT (DWT effectively upgrading Rouse and gaining its benefits/duration, while Bahamut replaces Rouse's effects but not DWT's during it), and Enkindle: Bahamut with Enkindle, including sharing cooldowns. Remove the Ruin IV proc and reduce Enkindle's cooldown, then remove the Aetherflow Lockouts. You'll get a lot less Bahamut windows (Since they come every three Aetherflow as opposed to every 2 beyond the opener), but that leaves room for the class to grow (and for their numbers to get adjusted to be fairer), and most importantly, get something to do outside of the Aetherflow/DWT window that isn't binary Ruin spam. Note that I'd expect that filler to involve the Ruin spell line in general. Hopefully not as combos, but through a resource you can plan around that lets you use Ruin III/IV outside of DWT in a limited but reliable fashion, while guaranteeing their use inside DWT. I could see SE adding traits to do that next expansion and simply upgrading Ruin I/II to Ruin III/IV during DWT/Bahamut at 70 and leaving it at that.

I also kinda hope they remove the Tri-Disaster reset as well. I don't mind managing SMN's dots at all under the new unified duration. It would balance them out too, letting them push Ruin III/IV more.

Not a fan of 'bringing classes in-line', as that just makes them all feel a bit more samey... Impulse Drive could definitely go though, and just make Heavy Thrust the start of the 2nd combo (then shift other abilities down and put Doom Spike around level 20; level 40 for the first AoE ability is just silly)

As for 1 button combos, why not, nothing hard about pressing 1-2-3 compared to 1-1-1... they should be optional though (manually configurable?) so if people still want separate buttons they can.

And as for BLM, no need to do anything crazy (they still have plenty of near useless abilities to cull), just please get rid of the punishment mechanics (i.e. SB Enochian) and add more movement / 'stack saving' utility (so they can always realise their high DPS potential regardless of fight mechanics, and without being near clairvoyant).

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Originally Posted by Legion88

And before the "but this will make the game dull end easy" crowd jumps in, we allready have them ingame outside of PvP.
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yeah that is a dumb excuse
but with how striking jobs work it just wouldn't end well
since SAM mekiyo shisui can bypass combo to fill up sen or reapply buffs
and Monk is all over the place

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Originally Posted by Duskane

yeah that is a dumb excuse
but with how striking jobs work it just wouldn't end well
since SAM mekiyo shisui can bypass combo to fill up sen or reapply buffs
and Monk is all over the place

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SAMs Mekiyo Shisui is really in an odd place for this and it has to be reworked for a transition into auto advancing buttons.
As an example for a possible solution:
Mekiyo Shisui
Execute up to 3 weaponskills without prerequisites.
Combos are advanced to their combo finishers.
Adds the effect of Shifu to Kasha.
Adds the effect of Jinpu to Gekko.
Does not affect Iaijutsu.
Duration: 10 seconds

Monk on the other hand has also just one problem: Perfect Balance.
His 6 main GCD weaponskills can easily be sorted into 2 combo strings and placed on 2 buttons which are advancing to the appopiate skill for its current form.
Button 1:

1. No form/Opo-opo form: Bootshine
2. Raptor form: True Strike
3. Coeurl form: Snap Punch

Button 2:

1. No form/opo-opo form: Dragon Kick
2. Raptor form: Twin Snakes
3. Coeurl form: Demolish

So both buttons will advance based on the form and the "combos" can be mixed like usual.
Perfect Balance is the only skill who needs a whole bunch of rework to fit into this changes, even more like my Mekiyo Shisui example, but it is possible.

Apparently SE has decided that having 4 buttons for each combo which is never pressed out of order means you need more skill... I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

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Originally Posted by Karshan

So picture yourself this exemple : in fight, you're mashing that button to enter trance (everyone is mashing let's be honest we watch PoV), and alas smash once too much : you just entered trance and immediately deathflared by mistake.

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They could also very simply add a 1-2s cd upon activation.


Anyway, what I'd like to see:
BLM, merging of leyline and between the line, fire/blizz IV into enochian (like in pvp basically).

I'd like them to also make freeze an option to go in umbral ice after doing Flare (can't remember the skill name, big aoe at lv 50).
Possibly making flare not only an Aoe skill would be nice too, it's a good looking spell and it's a shame it's only used in dungeon.

Merging Heavy Thrust into Impulse drive definitely makes more sense than the other way around. Less editing involved. What I'd like to see SE add in return is a dynamic finisher to DRG's combos. One that you could use as your 4th, 5th, or 6th skill without losing your average DPS, while being a true finisher. They'd likely implement a dynamic potency on it like they did with Fang and Claw/Wheeling Thrust, but make it close to Full Thrust's potency (lower on 4th, higher on 6th), to balance it overall regardless of where it was used. That way a DRG could end their combo when they need to. As long as it didn't have a positional it would be great. It would allow you to save True North for when you really need it once you got used to a fight.



Flare has been used in BLM openers before too. The reason it isn't now is because 1) Your MP doesn't allow for it under its minimum cost, and 2) You'd be giving up a Fire IV for it which thanks to the extra potency buffs just isn't worth it on single bosses anymore. It breaks ahead on 2 targets however so by all means use it to finish off a rotation if it lines up with somewhere you'd want to AoE, especially if you have a Foul ready to recover the MP tick. I don't think giving Freeze a trait to allow it to be used at 0 MP would really change that all too much. More likely what'll happen to facilitate new skills though is Blizzard II and Fire II will be replaced by Flare/Freeze entirely in that case, since they could bake that trait into Freeze itself as part of a few tweaks to it.



As for Machinist, it needs Gauss Barrel to be moved off of the hotbar, not Hot Shot. It could easily be reworked into a trait and lose nothing. Hot Shot however can be reworked to give Piercing and also act as a massive heat generator to counteract Cooldown, which would free up Barrel Stabilizer as a recovery tool, something that MCH needs badly. They also need Flamethrower, Overheat and Wildfire to be looked at. I don't know if widening the windows on the latter two would be the best idea. I think reworking them both into a stack-based buff and debuff each would be better overall, especially if they only affected weaponskills. Same with Flamethrower to be honest, just make it instantly max your heat instead of the ticks. If the overheat window was reworked into a stack buff, then using Flamethrower for AoE wouldn't feel bad at all either.

i don’t see a difference in using that macro for Bahamut but not for trance because u have to weave an ogcd while bahamuts summon-animation -> therefor u face the same problem by just smashing that macro in both cases.