This whole Meta Party thing is hurting me. x_x

Most concerns regarding the Meta will not affect most players in the game.

However, it really dampens the ability to enjoy a job knowing that another Job does its job just as well while bringing additional goodies.

I mean, I started complaining of BLM not because it wasn't meta. But because the job didn't have anything better than any other job, in any aspect. They had to not only buff them but also nerf SMN to make them POSSIBLY be better than SMN in damage.

It's kind of the community's fault too. Meta comps will only matter at the highest level of progression and speed kills, general raiding is better suited to playing what you play best. I played MNK through all of HW and SB up to now and raided just fine. If you're going for a midcore group and they can't accept you on the job you want to play (within reason, if they have two tanks and you wanna WAR that's not on them) then you're better off without.

I dont know about this meta talk stuff but, so far i never see someone (or me) getting kick outright at the start of run just because the class or build is not the “meta”. At least none so far in jp server, even the world/shout/say chat is empty when i hangout in social place like kogane, limsa etc

You probably overthinking it? Or just happen to stumble one.

Don't mind about not being meta, it's the whole "being the class that brings literally the least to a party unless said party is willing to go to extra lengths to ensure taking you is worth it" thing that I take umbrage with >.>

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Originally Posted by NoctusT

So TL;DR - remember that most of the people on forums have lower IQ's than baboons.

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Well at least they know (?) how to read and write so maybe they're slightly smarter than baboons?

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Originally Posted by Elix_Moarbase

It's not the community's fault. The devs have just lost all sense of balance in the classes.

People are going to do what is easiest. And, when you make the synergy of most of the classes better than the classes that can only provide DPS, or minimal utility, people aren't going to take the classes that don't have synergy. That's on the devs.

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Oh boy. The ones in authority are always at fault and never the bickering children, right?

Yes, certain party compositions will always be better than others and that's entirely the devs "fault" but the so called Meta doesn't mean shit for 99% of the community, or at least it shouldn't. That people are making such a big deal of out it is absolutely the community's fault; especially considering that it's simply impossible to bring all jobs to a through and through even playing field. No MMORPG has ever managed to do that and no MMORPG ever will.

So, TC, play whatever the hell you want and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. You can clear any content in this game regardless of the job you're playing, although I will admit that Unending Coil makes it almost impossible for some jobs at the moment (back to the 99%), and if people tell you otherwise, they're not the ones you want to be doing said content with anyway.

What I don't get is all this talk about META like it's this all new thing.

The concept of META is old, very very old. I can remember as far back as like 2000-2001 team fortress matches where people would be like man change your class shotguns suck. and anytime we lost a match it was apparantly because I was a weak class even if I had the most kills / flags on my team.

Thing is meta isn't always meta or even effective. something I remember from way back in EVE online. was a discussion that used an example along the lines of.

The meta to open a door is put the key in and unlock it.
however simply having "A" key doesn't mean you can unlock the door.

the problem is really that players try and copy each other to much. I remember back in XI when they added alexander to the end of the toau story line. my party went in there with a ninja tank and a lol summoner and everyone in nyzul isle was lolling because there was no way a ninja could tank that fight diagas and banishgas would strip shadows constantly. and a lol smn all that would do was feed alexander tp...

3rd attempt at it we came out victorious standing alive in a pile of dead bodies from every other group failing. and it didn't take lol before all those paladins started changing to ninja and lots of summoners started appearing. just because it was a strategy that worked for us everyone else decided to copy it. even though they had no idea what we actually did in there or how we used those jobs...

then a day or so later a guide went up on ffxiclopedia saying the setup we used was meta and thus everyone was trying it. and the next day some guys had posted up another setup and strategy that was much easier than the one we used and suddenly that was the one everyone was trying to use.

End of heavensward is another big example. Zurvan EX meta was 1 tank 5 dps. but even though groups were following that set up they still couldn't get through the fight or even skip the soar which was the sole purpose of taking that 5th dps.

Players tend to look at META and think it's the only way to get something done. and it's really not.

even in 1.2 the meta for ifrit for a long time was drop ya blm job crystal and slot sentinel... then they started seeing players go in as blms and come out alive and realised they didn't need sentinel if they smashed the nails quick enough so then the meta went blm. and it got to a point wehre if a monk wanted to come everyone said no. blm only. then one day my ls were smashing it with 5 monks and lots of players were like wtf?? how??? monk cant do that fight...

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Originally Posted by aeoncs

You can clear any content in this game regardless of the job you're playing, although I will admit that Unending Coil makes it almost impossible for some jobs at the moment (back to the 99%) [...]

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Actually, even ultimate coil has parses for every job. That means every job has been able to clear. The first clear was actually with a DRK, generally considered the weakest tank pick, with the person in question rationalizing this pick as:"I like DRK.". Does Meta, then, "really" matter even at the highest level of play?

Frankly, meta matters to everyone and noone. If you are able to make suboptimal things work for what you want to do, congrats, you can screw the meta. If you are unable to do that, meta might give you that little extra oomph you need.

And randoms will generally want that extra oomph anyway just in case, because they have no idea who they're dealing with. There's also a lot of confirmation bias going on - Dzian touches on that, people like to interpret information in a way to confirm pre-existing beliefs, i.e. a loss as the result of a suboptimal pick. That's human behavior, nothing to do about it. But it explains why meta is rather important to people in PF.

I would not concern yourself with the meta or what is strong. Metas change with time, buffs/nerfs and player viewpoints. Play what is fun to you primarily. If you find it fun, most players will naturally try to get better at the job.

With that said, certain character/jobs/etc. will tend to be slightly stronger or weaker than other jobs. Rather than just playing the flavour of the month overpowered job, play one that you really enjoy playing and maybe think about having a sub job in case stuff happens in the future. It is more important to try to be a master than just be mediocre at a strong meta job.

In fighting games, you will see players who are masters at a character overcome bad match-ups against other characters.