After over a year of playing FF14 you gain some... wisdom of sorts...

i was actually always against the idea of "multiroling" in this game. i prefer content, where tanks are tanking, healers are healing, and damage dealers kill. instead, we get tank and healer downtimes, so they can switch to offensive and push DPS, which in the end, results in stupid out-of-design ideas of melding your SCH into Direct Hit, and PLD with STR\Crit\DH\insert offensive stat
but i guess people are used to this, some feel very accomplished for "breaking" the boundries of game design, it has been throughout the years in this game, even though devs still "try" to make things work the other way around. unfortunately, they suck at it...

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Originally Posted by SoulSkyheart

Can't be done and won't be done. If this was Heavensward, then I'd say there is a chance, however due to them changing the death penalty system to affect all main stats except vit, to help reduce punishments to surviving mechanics such as boss aoes' or tanks who's health aren't enough to take on tankbusters.

I say it has a chance with Heavensward because the death penalty in HW reduced VIT too and in order to implement VIT scaling into SB, they'll have to rework a penalty and tank stat, which goes into alot of coding and rewriting which the devs don't have time for because of their already planned out schedule.

I'd like VIT to scale with AP once more but we can't have nice things without making other nice things worse.

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"Reduces damage and healing output."

It wouldn't even be that hard a change.

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

"Reduces damage and healing output."

It wouldn't even be that hard a change.

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I'm sure they're competent enough to be able to change that death penalty to a damage down. But have we thought to consider why it hasn't been done so far? I'd like for this change but they see something we don't which is why they haven't implemented it so far. Either that, or they already have an plan to release it this Friday during the live letter. I know ever tank wants to see VIT scale with AP again, but until we get an exact reason as to why we can't have it, then we're just getting upset and arguing in the forums about it for no reason at all, upsetting our mood and getting upset about the game.

As of tank main stats right now, adding STR materia into our accessories has ceased the arguing, but only for now. It would be a huge QoL to bring back VIT but until they change that system, we have to deal with this okay-ish system.

To SoulSkyheart: I'm not saying I'm perfect nor do I want to be... Just saying that opinions change over time... and instead of me deleting older posts that I made like some other people would because of some reason I can't think off of the top of my head, I would much rather leave these posts for self-reflection...

To SilentVoice: kinda ironic name for posts like this but at least you are breaking the mold... joking aside, I was also kinda like that during Heavensward, where everyone should just stick to their designated role, but tanks always do damage and I have accepted this, healers have damage options, but it kinda doesn't work, hence why I said tanks should be doing as much DPS as an actual DPS to make up for Healer damage... but if we get bosses that require you to heal the boss to death then that could work...

You can't be serious in your desire to be an actual DPS while being a tank, right?

If tanks were to deal the same amount of DPS as a dedicated DPS to, as you say, 'make up for healer damage', why would anyone play a DPS class anymore? There would be no point. Tanks will do the same DPS as you while having a lot more health and defense. 6 tanks 2 healers would be the new party composition.

As they are now tanks deal a lot of damage when played correctly, they're doing more than their share for to make up for the healers in comparison to dedicated DPS.

Personally I’ve always liked the idea of tanks and healers doing the same damage as dps, but a difference appearing through cooldowns, so where dps have damage increasing cooldowns, tanks have defense increasing cooldowns and healers have heals.

But in a game so dependant on rotations as this one it wouldn’t work, it wouldn’t be fair for mnk to have to meet all those positionals and manage greased lightning just to pull off the same damage as a pld spamming royal authority and only making a difference through CDs.

That would kind of defeat the purpose of having 3 different roles. If tanks are going to also be just as good at dps as actual dps then there would literally be zero reason to actually play a dps, so at that point why not just get rid of dps AND healers and make every job capable of everything. A tank is a tank for a reason; to tank.

Plus I thought it was said that healer dps isn’t even factored in for dps checks, so things should be clearable even without healer dpsing, it’s just obviously quicker and easier when healers do dps (note: I’m not saying healers shouldn’t dps). So anyway, I feel like if they were to make tanks dps/tanks not only would it defeat the purpose of the three roles, but they would just even up rebalancing the content so it would be just as challenging/take you just as much time and effort to clear with that additional dps as it is now, so it’s not like you’d actually be getting anywhere in giving teams a bump in dps to clear things faster/you wouldn’t be “making up for healer dps” bc the content would be balance to assume all that extra tank damage.

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Originally Posted by Visanis

6 tanks 2 healers would be the new party composition.

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Mechanics in general make that a really bad idea.

Even if you decide that you don't need BRD/MCH's ability to recuperate TP/MP, or the melee/mage limit breaks, there's plenty of savage fight mechanics that would become extremely unpleasant purely from the fact that you're expected to have 4 DPS.

*Catastrophe's tentacles, purple debuff, and -100gs are suddenly not getting applied predictably.
*Hallicanarsus will destroy you in her first board game, and likely kill the healers on her thorny board waltz.
*Flare is applied erratically by Exdeath.

There's enough gameplay mechanics in place that even if tanks were equal to DPS, they wouldn't flat out replace them.

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Originally Posted by Ekimmak

Mechanics in general make that a really bad idea.

Even if you decide that you don't need BRD/MCH's ability to recuperate TP/MP, or the melee/mage limit breaks, there's plenty of savage fight mechanics that would become extremely unpleasant purely from the fact that you're expected to have 4 DPS.

*Catastrophe's tentacles, purple debuff, and -100gs are suddenly not getting applied predictably.
*Hallicanarsus will destroy you in her first board game, and likely kill the healers on her thorny board waltz.
*Flare is applied erratically by Exdeath.

There's enough gameplay mechanics in place that even if tanks were equal to DPS, they wouldn't flat out replace them.

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Basically what you said.... (even though I have yet to clear O2S-O4S but still)

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Originally Posted by Ekimmak

There's enough gameplay mechanics in place that even if tanks were equal to DPS, they wouldn't flat out replace them.

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The vulnerability on O2S is just easier to handle. A little extra effort but no notable loss.
Bring two dps.
A little less simple to deal with, but then 6/8 of your party members can practically stack with a cooldown and not die, so it's hardly a relevant point. Just get away from the healer.