A detailed Reaction to Warrior in SB

Agreed.
Also, just the act of removing Bloodbath took away so much synergy from us. Like, why should I even care if Vengeance damages enemies? Enmity isn't the issue it was before, and it's not enough damage to matter over the course of the cooldown, so... I mean what's it for?

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Originally Posted by Tegernako

I don't have an issue with them liking the new WAR but I do take issue with how they justify their like oftentimes.

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Enjoying a class and understanding that a class is chock-full of bad design choices are two different things, and yet, many people are unable to differentiate the two. There are people that enjoy the new WAR playstyle, but that does not change the fact that the class has issues.

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Originally Posted by ovIm

a flood of WARs still claim that the job is viable

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It is viable though. 3.x Monk was viable. 4.0 Scholar is viable. Viable just means you can clear the content with it.

I agree with everything op said. I already lvled both PLD and WAR and tested it on current end game content most of the times as OT. PLD is just better in everything. WAR is clunky and boring now. I can't make myself to like it. From mitigation to DPS. They destroyed every aspect that made WAR a fun job.
I think SE need to rethink tanks jobs in general.

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Originally Posted by YitharV2

It is viable though. 3.x Monk was viable. 4.0 Scholar is viable. Viable just means you can clear the content with it.

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Hm, I give you that, perhaps viable is the wrong word. Less desireable or lacking might be more suiting. I admit that its perfectly possible to clear content with a WAR in your party.

You hit it on the nail for me, I have no idea why the FFXIV team decided to destroy the foundation of the 3.0 WAR class instead of building off it. It was as if they didn't understand why it worked to begin with or they intensionally crippled the class for x or y reason.

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Originally Posted by ovIm

Hm, I give you that, perhaps viable is the wrong word. Less desireable or lacking might be more suiting. I admit that its perfectly possible to clear content with a WAR in your party.

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This 100%. WAR can clear all the content and doesn't crumble into dust when fighting bosses or dungeon monsters but it needs some patching up. As much as I enjoy the changes they made, I'm surprised they didn't find a way to pack the buffs they took away into other skills and I'm surprised they didn't do something more fun with switching stances since it is so integral to the WAR.

Berserk with a trait could have had "Heals for a percentage of the damage dealt"
Storms path, if they want to get rid of its group utility, it could have been given a trait also "Additional effect: Does something nice"

As for the stance swapping, I always imagined gaining a temporary buff based on the amount of gauge consumed on switch but that's just me.

How much better would it be if they just got rid of the penalty? Or if it was, say... 20 gauge instead of half? Cause the warrior seems like the most fun when it's flipping back and forth, would that mitigate the loss of your filler DoT and the oGCD of mercy stroke?

I know there's no getting around the loss of Bloodbath. It was a marauder skill for a reason.

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Originally Posted by HeroIgnis

You hit it on the nail for me, I have no idea why the FFXIV team decided to destroy the foundation of the 3.0 WAR class instead of building off it. It was as if they didn't understand why it worked to begin with or they intensionally crippled the class for x or y reason.

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Someone mentioned to me that they felt like the class was incomplete. Like they ran out of time finishing it for SB.

Honestly it resonated with me because the class really does feel incomplete, like they didn't know where they wanted to go with it. It's super clunky to play as well, something that also comes from not being a complete product.

There has to be some logical reason they literally took away basically every single positive WITHOUT replacing them. There has to be a logical reason why they made us more stance oriented then ever yet punished us so badly for doing what the design of the class literally encourages us to do.

Them running out of time in tuning the class would explain it. And we basically have one chance with savage to get things fixed, if not we're PLD 2.0 for SB.

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Originally Posted by Verdan

How much better would it be if they just got rid of the penalty? Or if it was, say... 20 gauge instead of half? Cause the warrior seems like the most fun when it's flipping back and forth, would that mitigate the loss of your filler DoT and the oGCD of mercy stroke?

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Removing the penalty for stance changing entirely would be the biggest and imo, the most important fix for the entire class. Because being fluid increases the fun factor and being able to respond to situations as they occur would be a nice buff.

IB being on demand again would go a long way to helping the class stand out because remember, one of the primary reasons WAR could tank so well in dps stance is that our tank stance does not reduce damage taken. It only increases health/healing. So being in tank stance wasn't as beneficial to us as it was for other tanks that get a flat 20% damage reduction. (add in damage debuff and self healing too of course, which is either gone or nerfed now)

Flat 20 gauge isn't bad but it'd again, be punishing us for playing as the job encourages us to play, however you would be able to possibly stance switch and use IB if you aren't at 100 gauge so it's still better.

As for the rest, my issue isn't so much that they took away the skills. It's that they took them away and either allowed PLD to keep theirs, or modified PLD so they could keep theirs, while we simply just lost ours with no effort being given to change them to flow better or be more useful. They are gone with no replacement as well giving us fewer options for zero gain.

Sure no stance dance penalty would go a long way to helping fix the class but it doesn't replace having less options either. It simply adds some fun back into the class and makes it fluid again.

Admittedly I've been enjoying 4.X WAR, at least so far, rather than 3.X WAR. Though, that's largely due to my gripe that WAR was literally the perfect god tank that was untouchable by literally everyone else. While I won't tell people that they shouldn't like it, I tend to grow bored quickly of jobs that are essentially god tier, especially with a lack of cost on stance switching that meant you were never really trading one thing for something else. Course, that's just my opinion.

To clarify, one of the reasons I enjoyed PLD more than WAR in 3.X was because the act of switching stances had a cost to it, trading MP for more damage, MP that I might need for an Emergency Clemency if my healers derped at the wrong time, or to pick up a DPS that accidentally ate an AoE, or some such. Conversely, with Warrior, I could stance swap for free every ten seconds and I wouldn't be actually losing anything, except a couple seconds of damage, which really bored me.