I disagree Rawrz, but not directly. They need to allow player to player sells, so that people ripping others off would no longer happen (or at least be easier to prevent). They should be able to absolve their transaction per an in game mechanic or system. We wouldn't need a demolish/reclaim option (which is even more tedious, imo) in such an instance. Simplification is the answer, not adding useless, backwards steps...
Under the current system, however...yeah, peeps who use it against others need to be punished. The problem is, that opens the door for what's happening to Gilgameshkun, getting reported for no reason whatsoever and having it taken seriously...
Selling Housing Plots
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03-12-2016, 04:48 PMBlatantPyre
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03-13-2016, 06:10 AMRawrz
Current system:
Agree to sell house at 20 mil
Buyer pays seller 20 mil
Seller demolishes house
Buyer buys from npc for 5 million
Buyer has house for 25 mil, Seller sells house for 20 mil.
Reclaim system:
Seller sells house to npc for 5 mil.
Buyer buys house from npc for 5 mil.
No interaction between buyer and seller.
I think it's a little simpler.
People should not be able to buy and resell land for profit. -
03-13-2016, 07:36 AMBacent
I have to agree with Rawrz, the amount of money people are overcharging for any sized house is getting ridiculous. I've seen people on Cerberus demand offers over 14m for a small house that they bought for only 3.2 originally. It's literally players with a lot of money using the housing system to make massive profits.
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03-13-2016, 12:59 PMGilgameshkun
I spoke to the SGM, and they stated that even tho the wording states "possibility of a transaction going wrong. Should that happen, there is the possibility the transaction will be deemed inappropriate behavior towards others, resulting in disciplinary action." ie if it goes wrong then action will be taken is actually incorrect. Anyone reported by a 3rd player, regardless of the outcome of the transaction will be hit with a warning. I expressed my confusion and frustrations toward the poor wording and how that is not the players fault that the transaction is "not readied by the system". The also told me that they get many reports of this, I asked them to keep pushing this concern to their bosses to hope change this policy.
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03-13-2016, 01:04 PMGilgameshkun
@Rawr and Bacent I am not arguing with you about the morality of the situation. If they wish to do punish people for selling then it needs to be clearly stated and outlined by rules/in-game systems. It is not, which is why I made this post because what ever "the powers that be" decide, it needs to be fixed. No rules were broken so no punishment should be given. Bots can hack and do whatever they want for months before getting even a warning, but selling a house, following the rules gets you one right away? That is ridiculous and needs to be changed.
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03-13-2016, 01:42 PMJudah_BrandtExcept here's what will happen: Seller still sells house for $20 million, then sells house back to the system for an additional $5 million, buyer will still have to pay $25 million, seller makes even more money thus creating even more of an abuse-able system. People find a way to swindle, it's what they do best. If anything they'd need to create a Market Board for it with capped and regulated housing prices. Only way to functionally eliminate the abuse is to take it out of player's hands, honestly. Otherwise with the system they have in place you will always have players hoarding properties to create a false scarcity in the economy, thus creating an extortion market and thus gouging other players.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rawrz
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03-13-2016, 04:07 PMRawrzThat player is seen and reported and then banned. The process is repeated until it stops being acceptable. Right now the ToS breach is in the gray. With a change like this, the ToS would be updated to include selling housing plots.Quote:
Originally Posted by Judah_Brandt
Why should any player be able to sell SERVER SPACE that belongs to square enix, just because they got their gil to it first? -
03-13-2016, 04:43 PMGilgameshkun
With that idea Rawr do you want crafters not to be able to sell HQ crafted gear ie Crafters were selling HQ sets of 220 gear for a hella alot of gil and 1M a craft if you provided mats because they were the first people to beable to make it. Are you against old content/primal sell groups as well? Both things are the same concept people working for something in 1 shape of another and others buy it directly which is not regulated by the systems in place where people can charge crazy amounts of money. Or are you just against people selling houses because it is property?
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03-14-2016, 05:17 AMRawrz
I am against people selling clears. Gil shouldn't buy you content clears. In most games selling a service like that is punishable. If SE wants to accept this them it's fine. You can clear content an infinite amount of times.
Crafters creating 220 gear and selling them high? More power to them. They are selling an infinite resource as intended by the games design.
Housing plots do not belong to players. They are given to a player for gil and expected to be returned when you're finished with them (reclaim.) Think of it as a player selling their account for gil. Players do not own their accounts. They pay SE to have the privilege of using them.
Imagine if players could hoard ceremony bonding times and sell them just because? Players are abusing an oversight and its become an accepted norm. -
03-14-2016, 12:39 PMGilgameshkun
For crafters I was talking about charging for the craft after you have mats and the melds, ie skill which would be the same as selling runs. Because with runs you are buying the skill of the players to carry you through content you can not do yourself. Personally I do care if people sell something they spent the time acquiring/gaining skill to do as long as the 2 parties agree and the verbal contract they had is maintained. The only issue should be if people do not deliver on the promises they made. If people don't wait to spend money on over priced plots then they don't have to, the new systems in place allow people to camp and obtain them or they can make friends and give each other plots. But again I did create this thread to argue the morality of the should players be allowed or not to sell property, and yes I know I asked Rawrz because I was curious.