The fairy deal (thoughts about future SCH fairy possibilities, incl. a third one)

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Originally Posted by Midaja

Who said a new fairy would have to have something to do with the old one. Basically the same class can summon carbuncle(s), egis and a fairy. Heck if it's not a fairy, just take Alphinaud's red carbuncle...

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Lore-wise ACNs can only summon Carbuncles (which aren't unique, just some geometric magic construct any standard ACN can summon). Lore-wise you simply inherited a fairy that once belonged to someone else. Different cases here.

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Lore can always be written accordingly, if they would want to do so.

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Yes, and SE have shown that they're not willing to rewrite existing/established lore 'just because'. If something as minor as Egi design won't be changed because of lore then an additional fairy is even more unlikely.

The future of SCHs should be focused on reducing the stranglehold they have on the healer spot. Right now its practically mandatory to have them in groups, and your ideas would only reinforce that concept.

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Originally Posted by Midaja

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There's already one fairy that can reliably increase the group-wide damage by 1.5%. The fairy you suggested can reliably increase raid-wide damage by 1.5% as well. Not only that, but also 3% mitigation. If you were to bring two scholars instead, both of these fairies would increase the group's damage by 3% - Let's forget about the multiplicative value for now. Not even an Astrologian can pull that off by pulling balances back to back with every draw. One fairy also has a resource stapler for the entire group. But the biggest one for the scholar themself - Not like Scholars already have the best resource tool among the healers anyway. If this "idea" was meant to make Energy Drain less important, where is the nerf idea for Energy Drain? As it is, especially for endgamers, they'll just use both. It's not a case of "choose this or that" with this idea, it's both.

The 3.0 abilities Scholars have gotten covered pretty much the very area they were weak in: AoE healing. In a sense, Scholars can already take over the White Mage's role as "main healer". The only drawback about this would be that it's not very resource efficient compared to White Mage. But with some extra resources available from a particular fairy and a permanent 3% mitigation, white mages will get pointed the door as well in favor for having the two fairies present. Simply due to how the content is designed: DPS is all that matters in the end.

So if they get tweaked down to an extend where they don't overpower the other healing jobs, why even have these? If the effects of the fairies are too underwhelming in the end for sake of not overpowering the other jobs, they're not appealing. Removing Embrace entirely would only make it harder for the other healer while you're doing damage.

These changes won't make it easier for other healing job, just makes the Scholar seem more valuable than it already is. If the numbers aren't appealing enough, all that will change is that Selene is being removed from the endgame throne and Eos takes over. After all; Selene can't help heal any more and the scholar will have to compensate.

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Originally Posted by Lyrica_Ashtine

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If the capability for dps-boosting would be all that matters, every group would be using AST / SCH or SCH / SCH already. Why are they not doing it? Cause shields don't stack and WHM still has its own benefits (MND-buff for example...).
As I said, numbers can be tweaked and also damage taken increased on one enemy is still something entirely different then damage done increased on all players. In A2S for example the first one is much inferior to the other.

There is no Energy Drain nerf because this is about fairy changes. If SE (the only ones who really know the math) would implement it, they should of course have those things in mind. And they do, as they have shown by the pre-release balance-card nerf.
Also you don't know what skills might come, where you want to spend your Aetherflows for, so it might get a "choose this or that".

If you say removing embrace would only make it harde for the other healer... Well, broil deals less damage than Stone III, so I'd rather take the healing duty, once my DoTs are up and let the WHM DPS then the other way around...

As long as DPS is the most crucial aspect of encounter designs, Selene will not disappear from endgame, even if she can't heal anymore. At least as long as she increases DPS more than Eos does, which is a must in my scenario.
Yes, the Scholar will have to compensate, but having Selene out should still do most damage.
Although in some fights Helios might be more of a DPS-increase because of the enhanced raid-wide MP- / TP-management & Radiance.
And thats what the point would be - all fairies would still be viable. Sometimes on par, letting the Scholar choose what fits their playstile, sometimes one might be stronger than the other.

I'm not really going to go into the abilities too much because lore quite clearly prevents a third fairy anyway. Each SCH soul stone holds a single fairy in which they contain the knowledge of their previous masters. Hence Eos and Selene are two aspects of one fairy 'Lily'. I don't think it's necessary to change the lore so much as to allow Lily to now turn into a male fairy too. It just gets messy, and we're not SMNs. (Even they didn't get more egis!)

I like that you don't like the way things work at the moment in regards to healing though. DPS checks being the main feature of any raid is quite one dimensional. But to solve this I would rather change the content than the classes. It would be nice if SE could create fights where tanks and healers need to undertake specific roles as opposed to dealing more DPS.

Edit: Also your comment about Stone 3 being stronger almost makes me wonder if you're contradicting yourself slightly. From the OP, your general idea was to change things in order to make Scholars more healing oriented, yet it seems like you would be fine with WHMs taking the DPS role because their Stone 3 does more damage. As healers in general we should be asking for more challenging content that involves tactics for healing to keep us more occupied. If you just want to be healing mainly, go level AST? xD

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Originally Posted by Midaja

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There's a reason why White Mages/astrologians are constantly in the main healer seat while the Scholar's are contributing damage: MP efficiency. Scholar's healing kit is very costly in comparison with the other healers. Even Lustrate's not as cost efficient compared to the potency-tied spells like Cure II and Benefic II. One Aetherflow stack spend on Energy Drain is 884 MP. When used on Lustrate that's 884 MP you won't get in your pocket. In contrast, Scholar's damage kit is more MP efficient. In particular compared to White Mage. There's also the thing where Scholars have three DoTs that cannot miss and neither can Bane. Accuracy will always be the bane for endgame White Mages.

MP cost aside, it's not even a case of shield stacking or not. Two capable scholars will make it work because one of them will be in Cleric's Stance for most of the time, making one scholar solo heal for most of it like what White Mages and Astrologians are doing with the current meta. It's even less of a case when both tanks are taking damage. A White Mage+Astrologian combo will never outperform in either healing or damage aspect compared to either + Scholar. Not only does it take more effort, but also far more resources. There's only one reason why bringing a scholar would make healing not only easier, but also more resource efficient: The fairy aid with Embraces. If you take that away from Selene, the Scholar will need to help out more or the other healer will have to spend more resources on healing as that free 300-500 HPS is suddenly gone. This will pretty much erase Selene from endgame existence. Eos right now at least serves as a pick for those still progressing on certain content.

Even if you wish for a "balance" of fairies, that will never happen. You even mentioned it yourself that "Selene should still do the most damage". If this is the case, Selene will be the number 1 pick as long DPS is the only thing that matters. If Helios would make enough difference resource-wide, it'll steal away a raid slot for bards and machinists in favor for another melee or caster, depending on content. This of course would mean an even bigger DPS increase, but also shows how overpowered such a fairy would be as it can completely nullify the USP of a bard, machinist and ninja; supportive DPS - Yes, even Ninja's. If it cannot do this at least, groups will still bring bards/machinists as a resource battery and Selene will be picked over "Helios". Even more so how nearly all endgame encounters has more than one target at times. Unless you're implying "Helios" should be able to apply that vulnerability debuff on all targets in range.

Lastly, choice is but an illusion. Especially for endgamers.

Any additional fairies would require change in lore. Scholars only can summon one fairy that they make a bond with, in our case its Lily. Eos is the dawn aspect of Lily and selene the dusk.

For the SCH LB3, we summon Lily whole and its awesome.

Why the hell would you make the only fairy able to heal Eos? That's a retarded idea even as someone that doesn't main Scholar. The reason Scholar can even dps so much is because the fairy is pushing out constant healing with embrace.

I really like these ideas, something to make game play more interesting.