Bard qq

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Originally Posted by Sylve

I giggle every time i see people complain "managing ogcd skills"

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I'll have a giggle, thank you. Let's count them:

1. Bloodletter/RoD. (15 sec recast, random Rivers of Blood procs)
2. Blunt Arrow. (30 sec recast)
3. Repelling Shot. (30 sec recast)
4. Flaming Arrow. (1 min recast)
5. Empyreal Arrow. (15 sec recast, affected by SkS)
6. Sidewinder. (1 min recast)
7. Misery's End. (12 sec recast)

Not 3 off-GCD, eh? Let's add 5 more on top of that and a dex-pot.

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Bloodletter has been macro'd into Heavy Shot since level 15

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Oh, a troll, I see.

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If you cannot manage to fit 3 oGCDs around a 1.5 second cast with a 2.5 second recast, the problem certainly isn't Minuet.

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Sigh, opinion discarded.

http://i.imgur.com/RK5v7bA.gif

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Originally Posted by Sylve

I giggle every time i see people complain "managing ogcd skills"
We have 3.
Count them, THREE. One has a 1 minute cooldown, the other 2 are 15 seconds. (Bloodletter shares recast with RoD, so not 2 separate skills)

Bloodletter has been macro'd into Heavy Shot since level 15, Empy Arrow slots neatly between any cast and RoF can be thrown down whenever i want.

If you cannot manage to fit 3 oGCDs around a 1.5 second cast with a 2.5 second recast, the problem certainly isn't Minuet.

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I laughed at this one, counting BL as a 15 second cooldown tells me you either dont use dots or dont really understand bard. I just did the math and its 9.9 seconds on average at 25% critrate. Also its an rng proc ogcd so you can get "unlucky" and get a string of them that normally would be a blessing except you can be forced to not use them because it would fuck your rotation which is really really really frustraiting.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

http://i.imgur.com/RK5v7bA.gif

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This is how I feel.

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Originally Posted by MrYaah

I laughed at this one, counting BL as a 15 second cooldown tells me you either dont use dots or dont really understand bard. I just did the math and its 9.9 seconds on average at 25% critrate. Also its an rng proc ogcd so you can get "unlucky" and get a string of them that normally would be a blessing except you can be forced to not use them because it would fuck your rotation which is really really really frustraiting.

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Had this happen last night.. hit BL then SS, just as i hit SS, BL proc, then proc again during the cast bar. smh;fml

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Originally Posted by Aiselia

Bloodletter/RoD, Emp. Arrow, Repelling Shot, Blunt Arrow, Misery's End, Flaming Arrow, Sidewinder, plus buffs?

I haven't been in school for a while, so maybe my math is rusty, but I count more than 3.

Bloodletter also isn't necessarily a 15 second cooldown. It could be anywhere from 0 to 15 seconds depending on procs. And you can't use it while casting, but you could easily use it when dealing with instant shots.

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Blunt Arrow serves a purpose, Silence. Sometimes you can use it every cooldown due to no silence required mechanics, (to be fair most times) but is otherwise not exactly a main rotational skill. Thus conditional.
Misery's End is only usable for the last 20% of a fight. Again, not exactly rotational, Also conditional.
Repelling Shot is a defensive shot, especially with WM, you lose far more than gain from the 80 potency shot by trying to use it every time its up. Therefore conditional.

BL/RoD share recast, so it's effectively one skill, you simply decide whether you need AoE or not. Being macro'd to Heavy Shot, BL is going to fire off the split second it procs anyway.
Flaming Arrow is a 1 minute recast, easily slotted in anywhere after a weaponskill.
Empy Arrow is easily slotted after ANY weaponskill. Hell, most of the time I've got another shot casting before i even hit the ground during the animation.
Sidewinder i cannot comment on, as i don't yet have it.

So thats 7 total off global attacks you can use, 3 of which are heavily conditional and not part of our main rotations.
You use em when you can, not because they're essential in the way BL and Empy are.
Damage cooldowns are a whole other thing, but again, easily slotted in amongst weapon skill recast times. I don't count these towards "off global skills to manage" because you are not necessarily going to need to slam it the very instant it comes available. On a dummy, sure. In a real fight? Not so much.

You have an entire second in which to throw out an off global skill, be it Bloodletter or Raging Strikes. Minuet only changed our timings.

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Originally Posted by Sylve

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Blunt arrow has been unconditional unless it was T2 or T9. There are very little fights that a silence is needed that I'd consider blunt arrow an uncondition oGCD that should be used whenever possible for damage.

Misery's End, while it requires 20% hp, is still an oGCD and adds onto the problems of bards being able to only weave one during WM. That's still a heft damage loss even in context of bloodletter or repelling shot.

Repelling shot whether you use it for defensive purposes or not (being situational, such as T13 for earthshakers), it's still a damage oGCD. What seperated a good bard from a mediocre one was one that can use it off cooldown and not suffer any repercussions.

Also, you don't macro bloodletter to heavy shot, ever. Causes skill clipping and you'd be losing dps in a long fight.

Sidewinder is also oGCD. The matter of fact is, bard has a lot of oGCDs to work with, and unless they used a instant straight shot proc, you're only going to be able to weave one inbetween each cast. Every second that any of those skills are not on cooldown is wasted damage in the long run, especially if bloodletter resets twice in one oGCD (which has happened plenty of times for me).

Edit : I also noticed that you keep saying rotational. Bard is not a rotational class. They've always worked on a priority skill list, using oGCDs as they come off cooldown and specific skills if the situation demands it (do you have SS up, are Dots up, do you have a proc, so on and so fourth)

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Originally Posted by Sylve

Snip

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Repelling Shot was really easy to use when you had 100% mobility, and it was always a gain because you didn't need to stop shooting. Now you do, so that's harder to use.
Blunt Arrow has incredibly limited use as a silence, so I'd say your assertion that it's conditional is actually false. In a vast majority of encounters, you will use it whenever it's up.
Flaming Arrow is harder to use simply because you can't trigger the target circle while casting.

As for BL, you seem to keep ignoring that it isn't a guaranteed 15 second cooldown or a reliable proc rate. Without WM, you could really mash the button and get 100% of procs. With WM, you could end up missing several because it procs multiple times during a cast time.

I think this can really be summed up as: You never tried to maximize your DPS, and are trying to tell people who did why they're wrong.

Only solution I can see is allow ogcd ability use while casting.

Though if they allow it for bard they need to allow it for everyone and for some classes that'd be broke as shit.

Imo, they should have kept the MW/GB theme only to MCH. New class new mechanic while the bard getting its own thing. They could have just added in a fairly strict buff/debuff priority rotation and it would have been great.