I really didn't understand the issue.

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Originally Posted by TurnBased

Because people are spending $20 to make 6-10 million gil.

FFXIV is a Pay to Play game. If you want to be rich in-game, you need to do it with in-game effort. You craft, spiritbond, play the Market Board, desynth items, gather stuff on your botanist etc. All things achieved with in-game effort.

My wife and I have been saving up for a medium sized house. If sales are good, we can manage 2m a week. A slow process, but we'll get there. Now, someone in my server was able to buy a house with the money he made selling Platinum Bracelets.


Now, I see this and I think... What the f am I doing crafting? What took me weeks to do, someone was able to do overnight because of a cash shop item. F this, I'm not going to craft anymore. I'll jump on the bandwagon and just sell bracelets, and whatever cash shop item SE introduces in the future.

When this happens, and more people start to think like this, then no one will craft. No one will bother to gather materials. They'll just make money selling cash shop items. An integral part of FFXIV's content will be destroyed.

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That's the last nail to the coffin..... Is not about now people...... Is about the long term damage we doing to ourself

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Originally Posted by Eissels

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Because this potentially become a method to turn the game into a pay to win situation.

Now, if you think about it, what does gil can currently do?

You can buy crafted gears, food etc etc with them right?
Now let's say someone have a large amount of real world money, but they spend little efforts in this game, with this item can be bought from a cash shop and be sold to another players for gil, he now have a new way to gain a large amount of gil without putting in a lot of efforts, by spending real world money.

With these gil he earned, he can buy high level crafted gears, super rare materias with minimal efforts, as long as he have the real life money to spend.

This could potentially makes the in game economy affected by the real world's economy, and this leaves the players who is not willing to pay extra real life money yet put in a lot of in game efforts a bitter taste that people who are richer can always have the upper-hand in-game.

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Originally Posted by Bishop81

Games are in a sense self contained worlds.

"Where" you end up in a game should be based on how you play it not how much RL money you have.

Like the positions on a chess board should be based on how the players play, not how much money one player has over the other.

I'm not particularly articulate, I apologize in advance, if you don't understand what I'm talking about.

In the past with MMOs, you have a somewhat level playing field. Anyone can be the big hero with the shiny armour. I doesn't matter who you are in RL, you can be a billionaire CEO or some starving student, the outside world has no effect on what happens in the game. The only things that affect the game are what occurs in the game.

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Sadly this is already tainted by having a cash shop to begin with. We might as well go whole hog.


edit: in spite of the fact that i'm playing devil's advocate here i'd like to clarify my position just a little bit.

I think an extremely successful subscription game also having a cash shop is the dumbest thing in the world.

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Originally Posted by RinKaen

Why should I play exactly like you? Should everyone be an upstanding citizen in the game? Should SE take away freedom and make everyone drones? No. Play your own way, don't force it on others.

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You don't have to.

You can go and sell Platinum Bracelets all you want. It isn't against the TOS according to the SE. Go wild.

But don't deny that this is Pay to Win. When something that takes weeks to achieve can be done overnight with the help of real world money, then that is Pay to Win.

I don't like Pay to Win. That is what I am speaking out against as Yoshi-P clearly promised that FFXIV will not be Pay To Win.

The only thing that makes me irritated at band-selling is that in a way those people are buying gil with real money, and that way, RL-richer players can get in-game advantages over RL-poorer players. I'm poor IRL and I'm working hard to get a large house with my FC, but what if all these RL-richer players buy all the houses before we can thanks to their wedding bands exploit?

It's a form of pay-to-win, as much as gil buying.

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Originally Posted by Nephera

Sadly this is already tainted by having a cash shop to begin with. We might as well go whole hog.

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Yeah this is honestly the thing.

Like, I really do not agree with the ability to buy an in-game advantage - in this case, spending money on a cash-only item that can then be exchanged to obtain significant amounts of gil, allowing you to essentially pay for a leg up.

At the same time, if we're going to have a cash shop, I appreciate a system whereby you can obtain those things instead through in-game currency or effort.

A system whereby you are still paying real-world currency for an ingame advantage to be obtained isn't acceptable to me; but I'd genuinely like SE to allow players to purchase cash shop items using gil you've obtained yourself.

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Originally Posted by TurnBased

No one will bother to gather materials. They'll just make money selling cash shop items. An integral part of FFXIV's content will be destroyed.

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Once I red this, I stop caring. I'm feeling like every post about this CS thing is now a personal problem and not a game problem.

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Originally Posted by TurnBased

You don't have to.

You can go and sell Platinum Bracelets all you want. It isn't against the TOS according to the SE. Go wild.

But don't deny that this is Pay to Win. When something that takes weeks to achieve can be done overnight with the help of real world money, then that is Pay to Win.

I don't like Pay to Win. That is what I am speaking out against as Yoshi-P clearly promised that FFXIV will not be Pay To Win.

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Pay to win what? I just made 5m in about 10 minutes, bought me a house I probably wouldn't have gave two craps worth grinding for.I'm really breezing through content now.

^Pay to Win = any in-game advantage bought with real life money. The situation I described in previous posts.

Compare FFXIV, which is a Pay to Play game with any other Free to Play MMO out there.

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Originally Posted by Nephera

Sadly this is already tainted by having a cash shop to begin with. We might as well go whole hog.


edit: in spite of the fact that i'm playing devil's advocate here i'd like to clarify my position just a little bit.

I think an extremely successful subscription game also having a cash shop is the dumbest thing in the world.

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Actually it's already taint by the collector's edition. But that is a one-off thing, so most people subconsciously let it slide.