Dragoon, under the shadow of Ninja

Comparing moves on paper directly isn't really meaningful in any way. A good 1/4th of the abilites you rolled off can be skipped over entirely for the purposes of productive discussion. PPM (potency per minute) for a structured rotation for both would be far more meaningful comparisons.

Dragoon just needs a few tweaks. Magic Defense balanced out would go along way. Then personally I think if Jump was on a 15s CD with a lower potency (comparable to Bloodletter) and the animation was cleaned up, Dragoon would be fine.

On that note the animation might already be fine. I tested it a bit, though nothing extensive and it seemed to be much better since 2.4.

Personally, in addition to lowering jump to about 15-20 secs, I'd also love to see Heavy Thrust be adjusted. Up the damage bonus to at least 20%, and remove the flank requirement for the damage boost. Can keep it on for the extra damage, just make it more like mnk's abilities. I think those two fixes would make all the difference.

Lol. Ever since nin comes out every idiots in the forum for some reasons and star making topics about how other jobs r n doom. Drg are not in trouble. Everything in this game have situations were other job perform better than the other, simple. Like last night just a primary example, sastsha hm final fight mnk and drg dps r garbage due to final boss location which only let u use flank moves where as nin can attack anywhere. Again situational. I should start a topic how ninja are doom because they have nothing like LS where you hp back.

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Originally Posted by Zophar

Personally, in addition to lowering jump to about 15-20 secs, I'd also love to see Heavy Thrust be adjusted. Up the damage bonus to at least 20%, and remove the flank requirement for the damage boost. Can keep it on for the extra damage, just make it more like mnk's abilities. I think those two fixes would make all the difference.

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I could see buffing the damage maybe. However removing the posistional requirement would be a bit much. Ninja has so few of them because of Ninjutsu.

I can easily get 420 DPS on MNK on last boss Sastascha and 390 on DRG and they aren't even my main. I have someone in the guild, probably one of the best Dragoons on the servers who went Ninja because Dragoon is no longer reliable. Monk does more DPS T10, 11 and 12, I don't know about 13. So does Ninja. Just to give you some perspective. On his Dragoon he would end up with 390-400 DPS on T10 (BiS) after being a DRG the whole game. On his Ninja he had like 410 DPS after playing Ninja a week with a i110 weapon. On MNK he would probably get around 440-450 DPS.
The thing that makes DRG such an unattractive class to play is the TP that is drained like a pool of water being found by a man dying of thirst in the desert. The class is so unforgiving as well and sometimes it's just not exactly in your controll. If your Heavy Thrust is not hit from the flank, it's a HUGE DPS loss whether you reapply it or just don't. MNK and NIN are more forgiving.
I do believe that Dragoons need a small buff.

Dragoons do need a big buff in damage. Why is it that a freaking spoony bard can out burst a super skillful i112 DRG with nexus weapon doing optimal rotation?

Simple put.

NIN uses DRG potency GCDs, with MNK TP Cost, then has GL3 on top.

Basically, NIN is overpowered, no matter how you look at it really.

DRG really needs Heavy Thrusts potency increasing to maybe 20-25%, then it'd be able to equalise the other DPS.

Also 150 magic defense we're missing would be great too.

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Originally Posted by Zophar

You are of course correct. This statement will always be correct. But of course, the point here is, you take a NIN and a DRG, with equal gear and equal skill at their job, and the winner will always be NIN.

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take a monk and a DRG, with equal gear and equal skill at their job, and the winner will always be monk.



On the other hand, you win hands down every AoE situation over a NIN with your DRG. Every job has its advantages.

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Originally Posted by Ihm

Simple put.

NIN uses DRG potency GCDs, with MNK TP Cost, then has GL3 on top.

Basically, NIN is overpowered, no matter how you look at it really.

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That is really a gross overstatement. Ninja's potency is to balance it against Monk's flat damage increases from Fists of Fire, Twin Snakes, and Greased Lightning, on top of the debuff from Dragon Kick. Ninja has lower TP cost because they get the Speed Bonus from Huton.