DEV attention: We request some change to open world!

Great, another thread that just wants to bring back crappy NM mechanics for the sake of "competition".

People want competition? Do PVP, that's real competition, not claim wars.

Best way to avoid claim wars? Make open world NMs poppable with items (like Treasure Hunt) or be spawned through quests (like leves).

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Originally Posted by Gilthas

Great, another thread that just wants to bring back crappy NM mechanics for the sake of "competition".

People want competition? Do PVP, that's real competition, not claim wars.

Best way to avoid claim wars? Make open world NMs poppable with items (like Treasure Hunt) or be spawned through quests (like leves).

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This isn't about competition, this is about fun content being in the game, that also allows everyone to do it and not felt left out.

Which reminds me, I think we do need some form of open world PVP, I thought they said they were bringing something like that to the game. Wasn't called frontlines or something like that?

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Originally Posted by Mikara

This isn't about competition, this is about fun content being in the game, that also allows everyone to do it and not felt left out.

Which reminds me, I think we do need some form of open world PVP, I thought they said they were bringing something like that to the game. Wasn't called frontlines or something like that?

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I believe it's to be introduced with the expansion that (finally) brings Ishgard.

Also, why do people have such a hair up their ass about camped NM's and the like? If you don't want to do it, don't do it. Let those that do want to have their fun.

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Originally Posted by Mikara

This isn't about competition, this is about fun content being in the game, that also allows everyone to do it and not felt left out.

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The old NM/HNM system that several people keep clamoring for is the poster child of not allowing everyone to do something and having players left out. Because that's what they really want, to be able to have exclusive shinies that others can't have. That's the real reason why they don't like that all the best gear comes from dungeons, because with the current system they can't lock out other players from getting the same gear that they have.

Having NMs using a pop system (similar to TH) or a quest system (leves) allows players to form groups and choose to tackle this content when they feel like it.

The camping/claiming system has players stuck in a zone waiting for an NM to pop with the chance of losing claim and having wasted their time.

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Originally Posted by Theplatter

Also, why do people have such a hair up their ass about camped NM's and the like? If you don't want to do it, don't do it. Let those that do want to have their fun.

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Ok, have these NMs not drop anything and SE can add as many NMs as you guys want and I won't give a damn.

Once you put desired items dropping from NMs, people are forced to do them to progress. People didn't camp Faf/Nid for years in FFXI because it was fun (because it wasn't), they camped him because for years he dropped the best gear in the game.

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Originally Posted by Gilthas

The old NM/HNM system that several people keep clamoring for is the poster child of not allowing everyone to do something and having players left out. Because that's what they really want, to be able to have exclusive shinies that others can't have. That's the real reason why they don't like that all the best gear comes from dungeons, because with the current system they can't lock out other players from getting the same gear that they have.

Having NMs using a pop system (similar to TH) or a quest system (leves) allows players to form groups and choose to tackle this content when they feel like it.

The camping/claiming system has players stuck in a zone waiting for an NM to pop with the chance of losing claim and having wasted their time.

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I hate to say it, but you've pretty much hit the nail on the head. I'd also like to add that a lot of these calls for so-called 'open world content' are actually not - people just want NMs which drop powerful/expensive gear that can be sold for an overinflated price on the Market Board.

Case in point - a lot of these threads use FFXI as an example, saying having tons of open-world NMs to hunt 'gave variety', when actually it didn't. Most NMs in FFXI were usually ignored by most players for this reason, players usually instead only overcamped a few particular ones they knew dropped decent gear (*cough cough* Valkurm Emperor, Mee Deggi the Punisher, Roc, Lord of Onzzozo etc), with the vast majority completely ignored simply because their items were just not considered decent enough to care - how many people used to camp Bigmouth Billy for instance? (at least until SE made him drop items related to Synergy that is). Virtually none.

Considering the economy is in meltdown at the moment due to players not spending money to instead save for their FC housing, even if gear dropping NMs were in the game, the gear would not sell for chicken feed and the same players would be endlessly whining why SE can't fix the economy. And then you have the RMT/botting problem which is a whole other barrel of moogles...

I like the idea of the NMs spawning in different areas. This would do a lot to remove the competition aspect since players wouldn't be actually camping a small area. In FFXI you might stumble upon an NM you knew nothing about. You would check it's strength and it would say "Bubbling Bernie's strength is impossible to gauge". This made it a lot of fun.

30 minute respawns would make NM hunting a lot less exciting and the gear drops a lot less rare. I also would only be interested in hunting for monsters who's drops are tradable. In FFXI I used to give rare items to friends on their birthdays. Sometimes I would need to spend an entire weekend hunting the same monster before I got the drop, but it made the gift that much more special.

SE probably will not have any interest in my approach to NMs. It seems the game designers are working very hard to make sure gil is of very little importance so sellable items from rare monsters would not be something they would want in their game.

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Originally Posted by Gilthas

The old NM/HNM system that several people keep clamoring for is the poster child of not allowing everyone to do something and having players left out. Because that's what they really want, to be able to have exclusive shinies that others can't have. That's the real reason why they don't like that all the best gear comes from dungeons, because with the current system they can't lock out other players from getting the same gear that they have.

Having NMs using a pop system (similar to TH) or a quest system (leves) allows players to form groups and choose to tackle this content when they feel like it.

The camping/claiming system has players stuck in a zone waiting for an NM to pop with the chance of losing claim and having wasted their time.

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If you honestly feel that way, I don't think anything I can say will change how you feel, however I have suggested some things that would remove the whole "exclusive" feel to the rewards from NMs, give it a quick read and let me know if you have any suggestions for roaming / open world NMs. Believe me though when I say I'm all ears for good ideas / suggestions that will grab peoples attention towards putting any content in the game that could / would be fun.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

I hate to say it, but you've pretty much hit the nail on the head. I'd also like to add that a lot of these calls for so-called 'open world content' are actually not - people just want NMs which drop powerful/expensive gear that can be sold for an overinflated price on the Market Board.

Considering the economy is in meltdown at the moment due to players not spending money to instead save for their FC housing, even if gear dropping NMs were in the game, the gear would not sell for chicken feed and the same players would be endlessly whining why SE can't fix the economy. And then you have the RMT/botting problem which is a whole other barrel of moogles...

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I have to say, if this is honestly how people feel about NMs (the whole I want it to be the best and have it sellable for huge sums of gil), I believe they are playing the wrong game. If they want that kind of content, FFXI is still live, and they can partake in that to their hearts content.

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Originally Posted by Mikara

If you honestly feel that way, I don't think anything I can say will change how you feel, however I have suggested some things that would remove the whole "exclusive" feel to the rewards from NMs, give it a quick read and let me know if you have any suggestions for roaming / open world NMs. Believe me though when I say I'm all ears for good ideas / suggestions that will grab peoples attention towards putting any content in the game that could / would be fun.

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That's just the thing though.

You already have NMs in the game in the form of FATEs (and these could easily be turned into roaming FATE NMs). But people don't like those because everyone can attack the mob so they say there's no strategy.

Of course to this I respond with "make NMs poppable and that way you can have a more strategic fight", but then they don't want that because they want the NMs roaming about.

They basically insist on the exact combination that would allow them to **** over other players.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Case in point - a lot of these threads use FFXI as an example, saying having tons of open-world NMs to hunt 'gave variety', when actually it didn't. Most NMs in FFXI were usually ignored by most players for this reason, players usually instead only overcamped a few particular ones they knew dropped decent gear (*cough cough* Valkurm Emperor, Mee Deggi the Punisher, Roc, Lord of Onzzozo etc), with the vast majority completely ignored simply because their items were just not considered decent enough to care - how many people used to camp Bigmouth Billy for instance? (at least until SE made him drop items related to Synergy that is). Virtually none.

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Oh I completely agree with this point. A lot of times you'll see people using arguments like "NM/HNMs were great because they were challenging" yet Jormungand and Hydra were always up on my server. Hell, Vrta had money drops yet linkshells never bothered to farm him because the fight was hard. So much for wanting a challenge.

Is there actually anything wrong with having both poppable and roaming NMs? I don't think so. I think if a game has more in it that you can do, the better it will be. Just because a game has content in it, doesn't mean you have to do it. Even so, I want to move the topic past more than just NMs. What other open world stuff could we introduce?

Ugh I don't get people like that guy. I hate crafting, I don't go into every crafting thread and be rude to them because it's a feature I don't like. Not everything in an mmo is for you or content you'd like doing.

I don't think OP or the OP of any of those other "open world" thread are asking for NM in particular or asking for them to drop the best gear there is. Plenty of people also gave loads of ideas on how to combat "claim wars" (honestly even if some people have fun with that, who you are to tell them its stupid?) If you don't like world bosses/nm whatever you want to call them don't do it. :D