Scholar in Cleric Stance vs. Summoner

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Originally Posted by Forever_Learning

But Cleric Stance increases damage by 10%!

And they get Aero!

Isn't that enough to make up the difference?

(Devil's advocate, but the arguments I'm given)

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Borrowing aero as a SCH is a waste of a slot. :<

The misconception comes from the fact that the individual skills of a scholar in Cleric Stance, like-for-like, will do a tiny bit more damage than a summoner. Scholar Bio will tick a bit higher (a bit less than 10% because even though Cleric Stance gives an Int/Mind swap and 10% damage, the base Int of a Scholar is still higher than base Mind by about 15 or so depending on race).

If a Scholar and a Summoner both fire Bio 2 -> Miasma -> Bio on a target... the Scholar will do a tiiiiny bit more dps than the Summoner. But add in every other skill they have access to and the pet's damage, and it isnt even close.

nothing better to pick as a sch really so why not pick an instant cast dot for the Sh!ts and giggles

While they may not do as much dmg as a SMN, a SCH brings a whole lot more utility to a party than a SMN. Outside of coil (Because of acc issues), a SCH can simultaneously heal and dps at the same time. Lustrate / fairy healing, hop out of cleric stance for 2 sec, all while doing damage. This is the reason SCH is a much better overall, because they can do two simultaneous roles.

For me, a SMN is a gimped SCH, less utility in exchage for fester and a pet who's only purpose is to deal minor damage.

If SCH could use carbuncle, it would out DPS SMN easily.

Is there any reason people think this would be acceptable balance even if true?

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As far as I've read, Cleric Stance SCH using Selene and all Aetherflow stacks spent on Energy Drains is close

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Fester has twice the potency of Energy Drain. Twice. That's not "close".
Raging Strikes is a flat ~5% DPS increase assuming all other things equal and used on cooldown (which it frequently isn't - good SMNs time it with Contagion, other buffs, etc). Cleric Stance is 10%.
SCH do not have Rouse, Rouse is a 40% dps increase on 15% uptime. Assuming no tricks and gimmicks, overall, Rouse is a 6% pet DPS increase. This is aside from Garuda completely destroying Eos/Selene in DPS, not even including Contagion.
On that note:
No Bane.
No secondary pet DPS ability (Aerial Slash, etc)
No Enkindle.
You can make an argument for Selene, but a 30% spell speed buff on 50% uptime (15% spell speed worth of DPS if used on cooldown) doesn't make up for all of the above being missing, even with a group stacked to take the most advantage of it possible.
A (properly geared) SCH's far, far lower accuracy is also a (large) factor, easily meaning they hit at least 10% less - that makes up for cleric stance on its own.

And biggest of all: no Contagion.

You also give up having an AoE Bind in the form of Tri-Disaster, don't forget!

Each of these alone (with the exception of maybe Enkindle) should be enough for people to raise an eyebrow at this suggestion. Altogether? I can't even understand the logic.

To believe SCH outDPSes SMN or even comes close is simply false. Period. And even if it did, do you honestly think that's SE's design intent? Do you honestly think SE designed SCH to outDPS or even be competitive with its sister DPS JOB??

And what makes you think the utility of a SCH being able to off-DPS is any different from a SMN throwing up dots and spamming Physick? Eye for an Eye? Virus?

People who think pets do minor damage are so beyond wrong I don't even know where to begin. This is why addons need to be added and combat log (and therefore parsers) need to be fixed. People get THIS CONFUSED.

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Originally Posted by Borfin

No Bane.

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They get Bane.

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Originally Posted by T0rin

They get Bane.

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So they do. However.

Not with Contagion they don't.

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Originally Posted by Borfin

So they do. However.

Not with Contagion they don't.

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Nope, they don't.

There is really no reason to get emotional about the whole SCH vs SMN DPS debate. The only people that actually think SCH does more damage, are idiots, or trolls. No one with half a clue thinks that SCH is competitive with a DPS class.