"Just wait until *insert next patch*!"

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Originally Posted by raelgun

assuming you started in 2019, then you are a new player compared to me.

So listen, vast amount of types of players complained and complained, just like you are describing and they actually led to some consideration and changes to the game.

So of these complainers got the game to where it is - so we can agree complaining can lead to change in the game, to me a lot of of this was for the worse for the game.

Some of us or rather many are not happy so we are voicing a complaint to get things changed because its actually happened in the past.

If you are new to the game, then you would of entered into the game whilst the changes already happened and not felt them as much as me and a few others have done.

So tell me this, to those that complained years ago and got their wishes implemented in some way, what do you say to that?

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Sorry but thats not how that works. I'm not a new player compared to you at all. I was here when tp was still a thing. When stuff like aggro management was still a concern. When healers had more dps options (i miss my Whm Aero III). When not putting up protect at the start of content was a problem lol.
That card doesn't work on me. Sorry

I've been here for these changes n seen the shift personally so that whole point about not feeling it as much is null n void. And if you really payed attention to my post I'm referring to people who claim devs don't listen at all which is the view many folks here who complain take. Either those people are indeed wasting their time per their own statements OR they're lying n they know devs do listen and hope one day they'll be heard. If it's not the former then they outta kill that notion. That's not even taking into account those that complain n go "not my job to make suggestions on how to make things better". None of this actually helps. If you TRUELY feel the devs don't listen at all the rational decision is to leave n stop funding

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

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Can still be a vet and act like a newb. Especially with the takes you come up with. lol

Feedback provides contextual information in why they've quit. Just quitting provides nothing more than 'This person was generally unhappy'. If they didn't want feedback, then we wouldn't have this forum, and they wouldn't be sending us polls.

If you see a bunch of complaints on twitter and on forums, THEN a large dip in subs - You could probably correlate the 2. So yeah, you'll always see a rise in complaints, especially before unsub.

All very basic shit, come on.

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Originally Posted by R041

Can still be a vet and act like a newb. Especially with the takes you come up with. lol

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And there we go again with the personal shots for no reason. Stuff like this is part of why you guys aren't being listened to. And als part of why these thread get shut down so often. You don't share my view so you're a newb"...come on dude. Have at least SOME class. This immature playground crap is old and added nothing to the discussion.

End of the day you can clown me all you want. I'm happy with most of the game. You aren't n still paying. You need these threads to stay up far more than I do

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

And there we go again with the personal shots for no reason. Stuff like this is part of why you guys aren't being listened to. And als part of why these thread get shut down so often. You don't share my view so you're a newb"...come on dude. Have at least SOME class. This immature playground crap is old and added nothing to the discussion.

End of the day you can clown me all you want. I'm happy with most of the game. You aren't n still paying. You need these threads to stay up far more than I do

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Oh shit, I'm sorry - Yoshi, forgive me for taking potshots at some random white knight. You'll listen to my complaints still right? No? You throw all complaints away if I was a meanie head? Welp.

It's not beneath me. lol

I already cancelled 3 subs, dude's got my IP and Emails if he wants to reach out. Call me Yoshi. Love you. <3

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Originally Posted by R041

Oh shit, I'm sorry - Yoshi, forgive me for taking potshots at some random white knight. You'll listen to my complaints still right? No? You throw all complaints away if I was a meanie head? Welp.

It's not beneath me. lol

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Forgot...being happy with xiv makes you a white knight here. Neither you nor anyone else could quote n pinpoint me ever being a real whight knight. You simply dont like my views. I dont agree with you but id never call you a hater cause you arent. But youll call me a WK at the drop of a hat. And again, you wonder why devs don't listen to yall. You're part of your own problem.

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

Forgot...being happy with xiv makes you a white knight here. Neither you nor anyone else could quote n pinpoint me ever being a real whight knight. You simply dont like my views. I dont agree with you but id never call you a hater cause you arent. But youll call me a WK at the drop of a hat. And again, you wonder why devs don't listen to yall. You're part of your own problem.

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No, you can defend and even enjoy XIV. It's this comment that makes you a white knight with 0 empathy for legitimate grievance.

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

So let me get this right. People hate the state of xiv rn. They complain everyday to no avail (according to them). They claim the devs aren't listening yet they still continue to complain despite (according to them) being ignored. This means they are wasting their time per their own admittance. Others step in n try to explain the maybe it's best you leave if you're not getting what you want to send a message. These people are called gatekeepers n white knights (wrongfully mind you). They continue to complain and the cycle continues. They continue to pay to be upset n ignore the fact they are indeed funding what they don't like (which no sane human would do). Even going so far as to a pay for a game they aren't playing just to talk in the forums which as we said earlier amounts to a waste of time. So they're paying to waste their time once again...

Tell me...how tf do yall justify that? Cause that makes no sense to me and is why some people clown on you guys.

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You're just telling people to quit without sharing their complaints. You're asking for them to be silenced because you can't take the noise.

I do find the lack of an exploration zone to be very disappointing. I started playing in April 2021 and Bozja was great content once I had completed the MSQ. Likewise, Eureka was really fun to the point in which it was the majority of my play time for a good 5-6 months of 2022 while otherwise just treating XIV as a story game. I'm not interested in playing savage or ultimate content so Endwalker is really lacking in comparison to Shadowbringers... and Dragonflight in terms of a competing product I can play right now.

This definitely feels like a Warlords of Draenor moment. I know it's not as drastic as an expansion being abandoned to the point in which we missed several major content patches, but it certainly feels like Square Enix are cashing in their good boy points to underdeliver in several areas because the community hasn't yet grown tired of waiting for the next patch/expansion. Yoshi-P has openly admitted to researching other MMOs to see what they do right and wrong in order to build a baseline for the initial reboot that was A Realm Reborn... maybe he needs to revisit that to see how players react when they grow tired of the developers bullshit.

World of Warcraft, a game that's twice as old as XIV give or take a few years, is a prime example of players can loose faith in the developers and how difficult that is to rebuild and regain. Dragonflight is a great starting point and there's a lot of changes from Blizzard, in terms of content developed and how they interact with the player base, but any bullshit will soon get called out if the devs try it again.

As for Square Enix, I don't have faith that 7.0 will bring many major changes to the patch cycle and the content we'll see. We've not yet reached a breaking point although it's arguably much closer now. I look forward to several live letters in which Yoshi-P shoots himself in the foot with more "healers should play ultimate" tier comments before he issues a trademark crying apology two weeks later.

A word of advice though, if you're in the waiting for a patch/expansion boat, PLEAVE LEAVE! Take it from someone that's played World of Warcraft since December 27th 2009, it's not worth the time, money or copium. There's a plethora of other games out there to play and while Yoshi-P even encourages this, weaponise this against Square Enix. If enough people just quit, they'd soon feel it in their bottom line.. and this game carries their financial results anyway so they'd very quickly wake the fuck up.

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Originally Posted by R041

No, you can defend and even enjoy XIV. It's this comment that makes you a white knight with 0 empathy for legitimate grievance.





You're just telling people to quit without sharing their complaints. You're asking for them to be silenced because you can't take the noise.

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Again you aren't reading. I've EVEN TOLD people to make their grievances known. I'm not one of these people that tells folks to shut up n enjoy the game. I address specific individuals who say things like "the devs don't listen". How in the world do I have no empathy when I've said MANY times IF words aren't working try to get your point across with money. This is all to help those who feel they're being ignored. I say this because I care about possibly helping you be heard. That is the main goal and I've made that known numerous times. I don't go around labeling you all as haters, even people who do nothing but complain. Need proof check my post history. These labels don't solve anything, they create division. I've even said my suggestions arent surefire ways to change things but they're proven to work in other mediums, even 1.0. Don't fucking tell me I don't care cause that's a load of bs.

Where in any of what you quoted has me telling that specific group im talking about to quit? I asked how it's justified because adding all that up doesn't make sense. People see this from specific people and they chose to clown on them like Aveyond for example. I'm pointing it out and explaining why that response comes about. I'm not asking for anyone to be silenced. That has never come out of my mouth even once. That's bull you made up in your own head. Again check my post history I've always said make your grievances known first before anything and only IF thats not working go to other methods one being money.

This is not the logic of a white knight. And if you think so you're beyond convincing

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

Again you aren't reading. I've EVEN TOLD people to make their grievances known. I'm not one of these people that tells folks to shut up n enjoy the game. I address specific individuals who say things like "the devs don't listen". How in the world do I have no empathy when I've said MANY times IF words aren't working try to get your point across with money. This is all to help those who feel they're being ignored. I say this because I care about possibly helping you be heard. That is the main goal and I've made that known numerous times. I don't go around labeling you all as haters, even people who do nothing but complain. Need proof check my post history. These labels don't solve anything, they create division. I've even said my suggestions arent surefire ways to change things but they're proven to work in other mediums, even 1.0. Don't fucking tell me I don't care cause that's a load of bs.

Where in any of what you quoted has me telling that specific group im talking about to quit? I asked how it's justified because adding all that up doesn't make sense. People see this from specific people and they chose to clown on them like Aveyond for example. I'm pointing it out and explaining why that response comes about. I'm not asking for anyone to be silenced. That has never come out of my mouth even once. That's bull you made up in your own head. Again check my post history I've always said make your grievances known first before anything and only IF thats not working go to other methods one being money.

This is not the logic of a white knight. And if you think so you're beyond convincing

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It's because we know they listen in general, but often don't listen when it matters most. If they didn't listen at all, then we wouldn't have had the changes we've gotten the past decade and you know that.

The only way we can even provide any feedback on these forums is by being Subbed - So of course you're gonna call those people out. But you don't legitimately know if they are going to quit when the month sub is over, so don't make that assumption either way. Your scenario is a catch-22 for those of us that do give our grievances. I've told you that I just cancelled 3 subs. So I'm already proving to you that I'm not just crying to cry. I know that it needs feedback AND a sub drop.

A White Knight does not get to determine that they are not a White Knight. Sorry. You can't just say "Not it!". lol
You've done all but listen and understand. You just tell people to leave, even if you think the information is valuable - You provide it in a weird and toxic way.

Let's just end it at that, because we're not making any more progress, and it's a waste of both our time anyway.

Besides, I'm not the only one crying on these forums, you have a lot more to worry about. It'll be like trying to play whack-a-mole for a week.

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Originally Posted by R041

It's because we know they listen in general, but often don't listen when it matters most. If they didn't listen at all, then we wouldn't have had the changes we've gotten the past decade and you know that.

The only way we can even provide any feedback on these forums is by being Subbed - So of course you're gonna call those people out. But you don't legitimately know if they are going to quit when the month sub is over, so don't make that assumption either way. Your scenario is a catch-22 for those of us that do give our grievances. I've told you that I just cancelled 3 subs. So I'm already proving to you that I'm not just crying to cry. I know that it needs feedback AND a sub drop.

A White Knight does not get to determine that they are not a White Knight. Sorry. You can't just say "Not it!". lol
You've done all but listen and understand. You just tell people to leave, even if you think the information is valuable - You provide it in a weird and toxic way.

Let's just end it at that, because we're not making any more progress, and it's a waste of both our time anyway. Go play Variant, like you said you do.

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If I've done all but listen and understand you're no better than I am. But unlike you I won't throw false labels around and act righteous. Never once said you're "crying just to cry" so there's no proof needed there. I have no idea if you unsubbed or not nor would I ask for proof. Stuff like that is why I say you're perception of me is the issue. I'm not toxic at all, you perceive me to be. I've only ever advocated for dropping a sub so long as feedback was given prior. Your issue is you don't like me as a person n how I speak. Which oddly enough...in the end you've done what I suggested anyways. So what was the point of any of this?

But I digress