Tank healing is to high

Did a streamer say this or something? Seems to be popular for people to complain about tank healing all of a sudden. No one batted an eye for the entirety of Shadowbringers, when Nascent Flash first started making Warrior a healing machine. No one batted an eye when a Chinese team cleared E4S with no healers, using a similar method (targeted tank heals + regen stacking + co-ordinated use of available mitigation and raidwide healing) to the EX1 clear posted a couple of pages ago. No one complained when Paladin got Clemency and started dragging bosses down solo once the healer died, and no one complained when DRK had this self-sustain back in Stormblood. I think DRK should have that back, actually, it made them my favourite tank in that expansion. None of these were problems worth making a 16-page qq thread when they actually popped up, so anyone complaining now is either a Cure 1 defender angry that a Warrior showed them how optional their "participation" was every 25 seconds or someone jumping on a bandwagon started by a streamer.

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Originally Posted by Naizakane

Did a streamer say this or something? Seems to be popular for people to complain about tank healing all of a sudden. No one batted an eye for the entirety of Shadowbringers, when Nascent Flash first started making Warrior a healing machine. No one batted an eye when a Chinese team cleared E4S with no healers, using a similar method (targeted tank heals + regen stacking + co-ordinated use of available mitigation and raidwide healing) to the EX1 clear posted a couple of pages ago. No one complained when Paladin got Clemency and started dragging bosses down solo once the healer died, and no one complained when DRK had this self-sustain back in Stormblood. I think DRK should have that back, actually, it made them my favourite tank in that expansion. None of these were problems worth making a 16-page qq thread when they actually popped up, so anyone complaining now is either a Cure 1 defender angry that a Warrior showed them how optional their "participation" was every 25 seconds or someone jumping on a bandwagon started by a streamer.

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Frankly at the moment Warrior healing objectively is overtuned as hell and needs to be scaled back a bit, and Dark Knight needs self-sustain more par with GNB.

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Originally Posted by Videra

Frankly at the moment Warrior healing objectively is overtuned as hell and needs to be scaled back a bit, and Dark Knight needs self-sustain more par with GNB.

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Bloodwhetting has been around for 2 years in the form of Nascent Flash, pulled very similar healing (though you did have to wait until you had something like Inner Release or Chaotic Cyclone to do the crazy stuff), and I don't remember anyone saying it was overtuned as hell during Shadowbringers. The only "new" thing they got for healing was the regen on Equilibrium. Why have people waited until now to complain so strongly about it, when they've had 2 years of Nascent Flash and Thrill of Battle's healing action boost?

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Originally Posted by Naizakane

Bloodwhetting has been around for 2 years in the form of Nascent Flash, pulled very similar healing (though you did have to wait until you had something like Inner Release or Chaotic Cyclone to do the crazy stuff), and I don't remember anyone saying it was overtuned as hell during Shadowbringers. The only "new" thing they got for healing was the regen on Equilibrium. Why have people waited until now to complain so strongly about it, when they've had 2 years of Nascent Flash and Thrill of Battle's healing action boost?

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You'd be surprised how many people didn't utilize it correctly, alot of casual WARs used RI over NF back in the days so it was not as noticable as it is now.
I personaly love the changes right now.

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Originally Posted by Naizakane

Bloodwhetting has been around for 2 years in the form of Nascent Flash, pulled very similar healing (though you did have to wait until you had something like Inner Release or Chaotic Cyclone to do the crazy stuff), and I don't remember anyone saying it was overtuned as hell during Shadowbringers. The only "new" thing they got for healing was the regen on Equilibrium. Why have people waited until now to complain so strongly about it, when they've had 2 years of Nascent Flash and Thrill of Battle's healing action boost?

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At the time it was half the duration and required banked resources in order to get nearly the same results per GCD as Bloodwhetting does in AoE now.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

At the time it was half the duration and required banked resources in order to get nearly the same results per GCD as Bloodwhetting does in AoE now.

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That's hyperbole and if you don't already know it, you should. Nascent in ShB could easily heal you to full off of Overpower or Mythril Tempest, provided you had at minimum somewhere around 6-10 enemies on you. Bloodwhetting is not really an increase in AoE, and compared to what you could do with Chaotic Cyclone+Nascent in ShB, it's actually weaker in AoE(on paper; in practice it's the same). This also wasn't even new in ShB as WAR was doing the same stuff in SB with IR and Steel Cyclone; and likely before that with Bloodbath.

Where Bloodwhetting has actually increased WAR's self healing is in single target, not AoE. The increase in single target though, is greatly appreciated with the sudden(albeit expected) influx of new and inexperienced healers in dungeons.

And lastly Nascent was a 6s duration in ShB and Bloodwhetting is 8s. That's not doubling the duration.

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Originally Posted by TheOperator3712

That's hyperbole and if you don't already know it, you should. Nascent in ShB could easily heal you to full off of Overpower or Mythril Tempest, provided you had at minimum somewhere around 6-10 enemies on you. Bloodwhetting is not really an increase in AoE, and compared to what you could do with Chaotic Cyclone+Nascent in ShB, it's actually weaker in AoE(on paper; in practice it's the same). This also wasn't even new in ShB as WAR was doing the same stuff in SB with IR and Steel Cyclone; and likely before that with Bloodbath.

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Nascent was a 50% self-heal. It could full-heal you only if you dealt twice your HP in damage in that GCD. And you certainly didn't do n times as much as your ST damage in AoE, whereas current Bloodletter will simply heal for 400 per target.

Note also that any inherent crit skill will auto-crit its heal, too. Chaotic Cyclone's relative contribution is nearly as strong as before. Against even just 8 mobs, it makes for a 4800-potency heal. The difference is that the base is so much higher and it doesn't actually need damage; you don't have to hit for nearly as much to full-heal yourself, even in a single GCD, now as you did then.

In multi-pack AoE pulls, you effectively self-Bene with each GCD even without banked resources. Old Nascent was strong, but not to that degree.

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Where Bloodwhetting has actually increased WAR's self healing is in single target, not AoE. The increase in single target though, is greatly appreciated with the sudden(albeit expected) influx of new and inexperienced healers in dungeons.

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This is only true if your ppgcd is under 800 (50% thereof being 400). But, IR Fell Cleaves are already worth a relative almost 950 potency, given its modifiers before accounting for crit chance value wasted. Primal Rush is a relative 1444 potency at a 1.5x Crit modifier.

Given that IR is now on a 1-minute cooldown, and you could certainly have an extra 100 gauge (or 50 + Infuriate, etc.) twice per minute, the new version is a decrease in sustain for single-target.

tl;dr: No. It's the opposite. Bloodwhetting's AoE healing floor increased greatly relative to old Nascent, as you'd not likely have been doing 800 relative potency per GCD per target. Its ST ceiling (and total throughput over time unless you utterly bungle it) decreased, as you easily could exceed 800 relative potency per GCD in ST.

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Originally Posted by Rhysati

FFS...Healers don't WANT to DPS. That's why they made a healer! The last thing I want to do when I roll a healing class in any game is to be DPSing all the time. If I wanted that I would have made a DPS class.

Sadly, FFXIV may have finally pushed me out of wanting to be a healer. It simply isn't fun anymore. Hitting a single button over and over to do our astounding DPS you seem to think we should do for some reason is NOT fun. I am a main healer in every MMO I touch, until now. I don't see myself working on a healer in this expansion. Nor do I plan to tank despite that being my secondary role for the life of this game and every other MMO.

FFXIV did the one thing I never thought an MMO could do. It pushed me out of Healing and Tanking(what I love to do) and I'm now a DPS main. Why? Because DPS feel more fun to play than the tanks or healers in FFXIV(And I'm saying that as someone who has been tanking/healing for over two decades of MMOs now.

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Best fights are when shit goes south and I have to actually utilize my entire toolkit to bring the party back. First run of Pand4 the other day oh lord that was fun when 6/8 died and I brought them back one by one slowly, tank used tank LB3 to handle a stack just as I was about to reach for it but I got everyone back and I was just smiling about how fun that was for. Instead of glareglareglarediaglareglaretetraglareglarebene. I was hoping for some damage this expansion since they keep pushing the "healers should be healing more" narrative but it ain't gonna happen. And when I run dungeons with a decent tank I am basically useless as a healer.
We need more damage, make both tanks and healers sweat and make dps stop taking vulns while dpsing because they can actually survive it anyway.

Each big pull should be a race against time, DPS should be as efficient as they can to kill the ennemies before they kill the tank, while and an healer do their best to keep the tank up while dishing damage themselves.
Tldr: we need hardmode dungeons with some neat mechanics.

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Originally Posted by LuciaMirain

Best fights are when shit goes south and I have to actually utilize my entire toolkit to bring the party back.

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Says enough about the gameplay, when everything have to go down the road, just to have some fun at the game and to force players to use more than 123 or 111.