Hopes for the 4.2 Glamour System Revisions

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Originally Posted by SokiYagami

Try glamouring a relevant relic onto your tome/raid weapon. You can always get a glamour version when you upgrade to the next stage- well, not if it got flush down the glamour toilet. Have fun re-farming your relic again. That or wait for months til the next stage's release before you can glamour place the current stage of the relic into the glamour toilet.

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Good thing you'll still be able to glamour it the old fashioned way, then.

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

Afaik the old glam system is still in place. You can use prisms to make your weapon look like the relic without flushing it, and then flush the glam version later.

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

Good thing you'll still be able to glamour it the old fashioned way, then.

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Which is why I strike through "glamour" and changed it to "place" before the both of you quoted me. Also, considering the old system will probably be phased out once the new system has matured and my reply was initially directed to krotoan, my point of "Items being consumed in order to be added into a glamour log has and will always be a ridiculously stupid idea." still stands.

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Originally Posted by SokiYagami

Try glamouring a relevant relic onto your tome/raid weapon. You can always get a glamour version when you upgrade to the next stage- well, not if it got flush down the glamour toilet. Have fun re-farming your relic again. That or wait for months til the next stage's release before you can glamour place the current stage of the relic into the glamour toilet.

I believe the current words on the street is that you can remove the glamour items out from the glamour toilet, and I hope they are right. Items being consumed in order to be added into a glamour log has and will always be a ridiculously stupid idea.

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I'm not sure what you mean here.. all stages of my relic weapon are available through simple purchases. and what do you mean "relevant?"
Like the current stage? the.. 320 stage? I don't even remember what the last item level was for LUX. Relics haven't been cutting edge for a while. If you mean the next step for the weapon just.. don't commode the weapon? 1 item, 15 items tops. stick it in your chocobo bags.

I'm guessing the item consumed thing may be some way of working around the back and forth data that equip-able items require.

All this poo-pooing of the new system and we haven't even touched it yet.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

I'm not sure what you mean here.. all stages of my relic weapon are available through simple purchases. and what do you mean "relevant?"
Like the current stage? the.. 320 stage? I don't even remember what the last item level was for LUX. Relics haven't been cutting edge for a while. If you mean the next step for the weapon just.. don't commode the weapon? 1 item, 15 items tops. stick it in your chocobo bags.

I'm guessing the item consumed thing may be some way of working around the back and forth data that equip-able items require.

All this poo-pooing of the new system and we haven't even touched it yet.

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By relevant I meant a new step of the relic, where the stats makes it worth using, in this case the SB relic on it's eventual release. You asked Sekkei for a case in which actual (I assume usable) gear is required again after you use it for glamour, hence I gave an example. I also mentioned why it's a bad idea, either you consumed the "actual" gear in the process and re-farm the thing (lol) if you don't wish to wait to glamour it, or you will need to be inconvenience by having to wait until the point where the gear become irrelevant (either by a glamour version ala relic replicate or new gear with higher ilvl).

Doesn't it sound silly to you that a QoL upgrade is actually making one's life inconvenient instead? Sounds pretty counter-productive to me. And this isn't limited to the relic weapon only either. Any two/multiple stages gear would be affected by it, which include the latest tome gear and the rumored relic gear as well.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not simply trying to put down the new system before it's even release, I even pointed out that from what some players are saying, the gear wouldn't be consumed when you put them into the glamour toilet, in which I hope that they are right. I missed the LL stream and the English resources are prone to miscommunication due to translation issues, so I can't tell what would actually happen.

All in all my concern is much more generalized in that we shouldn't be cutting corners and making compromises with regards to a QoL upgrade. Why should we take 3 steps forward and 2 steps back when we can just simply take 3 steps forward? What is this, we dancing in A11 now?

Update: before you even get to it, yes, I'm aware this is the first experimental step for the new system. I'll be content so long that in the end when the new system has matured, or by the time they decided to remove the old system, items doesn't get consume as they are added into the "glamour log". Which in the first place, we also don't know if that would actually happen until 4.2. I just hope they won't.

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Originally Posted by SokiYagami

By relevant I meant a new step of the relic, ...

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I gotcha and yes, perfectly valid example.Though I'd say that the situations in which this would be a huge disadvantage would be minimal since people really don't seem to like current tiers looks anyway and havent since AF.
I don't think this is going to be a case of "omg why was it done this way" but more of "holy crap they REALLY REALLY are asking for this feature, what can we do about this NOW!?". They're giving us a previously unmentioned system (though possibly experimentally implemented partially in the squadrons) within a 4 month period. That seems pretty reactionary to me at least in Dev time. Their biggest roadblock in the past has been declared as server data bandwidth and storage. Inventory (storage and retainer and player) needs to be transferred several times a minute back and forth. This may be the first attempt to get around that limitation with a glamour log that sees the items only as display values and not as stat linked, durability monitored, creator tracked, material granting through desynth, soulbind tracked gear.

I see this as the toe in the water for a further expansion. Now whether it's worth losing functionality of the item over the freedom to vary our appearance is something that will need to be discussed once we know the actual limitations of the system. If we CAN retrieve items I'm pretty sure they will be stripped of all flags and variables like soulbind, creator and special stats (e.g. relic set through quests).

however in the end we haven't gotten more than 2 paragraphs about what it is, so lets hold off till we get our taste of it... is what I'm encouraging.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

I gotcha and yes, perfectly valid example.Though I'd say that the situations in which this would be a huge disadvantage would be minimal since people really don't seem to like current tiers looks anyway and havent since AF.

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I disagree. Sure, majority of the players may not be in favor of the current design but this doesn't mean the minority who do should be simply screwed over when designing a new system because of it. This argument of yours is close to those who frown on the resources spent on ultimate coil simply because there's only a minority of players who will partake it and even lesser who can clear it.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

I see this as the toe in the water for a further expansion. Now whether it's worth losing functionality of the item over the freedom to vary our appearance is something that will need to be discussed once we know the actual limitations of the system. If we CAN retrieve items I'm pretty sure they will be stripped of all flags and variables like soulbind, creator and special stats (e.g. relic set through quests).

however in the end we haven't gotten more than 2 paragraphs about what it is, so lets hold off till we get our taste of it... is what I'm encouraging.

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Or they could you know, don't put the actual gear in at the first place? I believe there should be the option to simply copy the skin via registering the appearance of the gear, then let the players decide what to do with the gear themselves. If inventory space is that big an issue, the players will simply dispose of it after registering. If they threw away something they shouldn't then that is on them. Of course, this boils down to the back-end code and restriction that we have no idea of so I'll stop this topic here before falling into the armchair developer argument.

I agree with you that some of us might be over-reacting now but I'll also like to point out that there is a chance that once this system arrive it might be set in stone. SE has precedent cases of both changing and sticking to their views before so I think it's reasonable to say that some of the voices of concern mentioned here, myself included, is not without a valid cause.

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Originally Posted by SokiYagami

I disagree. Sure, majority of the players may not be in favor of the current design but this doesn't mean the minority who do should be simply screwed over when designing a new system because of it. This argument of yours is close to those who frown on the resources spent on ultimate coil simply because there's only a minority of players who will partake it and even lesser who can clear it.

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what ifs and maybe theys, yeah.. bad argument fodder. no solid evidence either way.

when you're talking of whether a feature should be implemented you are always going to have those against, you'll never make everyone happy. When you're talking about adding content, separate from everything else that's entirely different. Nothing has been taken from anyone, just added on the side. You don't HAVE to do ult, but it's there if you want it.We need a new glamour system, this much is obvious and if it wasn't you against deleting items, it'd be someone else about how the new system makes all their glamour prisms worthless, or someone else about how you have to dye everything twice now (both hypotheticals of course, making up problems from other possible implementations). I am not saying your concern is invalid, just in my view it's very minor in the face of getting SOMETHING started. So far nobody HAS to use the system AND we're getting more actual inventory slots. I'm not seeing anything to pitchfork over.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

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Pitchfork? Before this post, I didn't even bring up other limitations like the 200 slots, 10 sets, limited access to the system, etc. Because I know it's in "beta" stages and I plan to give it some time and test out the system before I "poo-pooing of the new system" which we haven't even touched yet. All I'm saying is that I think items being deleted is the only line which shouldn't be cross and gave a reason to explain why. Which I also like to add, you are kind of the point of entry for me in this conversation. I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings, Sir Krotoan, but let's just agree to disagree.

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Originally Posted by SokiYagami

Pitchfork? Before this post, I didn't even bring up other limitations like the 200 slots, 10 sets, limited access to the system, etc. Because I know it's in "beta" stages and I plan to give it some time and test out the system before I "poo-pooing of the new system" which we haven't even touched yet. All I'm saying is that I think items being deleted is the only line which shouldn't be cross and gave a reason to explain why. Which I also like to add, you are kind of the point of entry for me in this conversation. I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings, Sir Krotoan, but let's just agree to disagree.

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I took no hurt and meant none in return. You are of course, entitled to your opinion and it is as valid as anyone elses =] I guess that sounded more intense than I meant.

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Originally Posted by SokiYagami

Which is why I strike through "glamour" and changed it to "place" before the both of you quoted me. Also, considering the old system will probably be phased out once the new system has matured and my reply was initially directed to krotoan, my point of "Items being consumed in order to be added into a glamour log has and will always be a ridiculously stupid idea." still stands.

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I have to agree with this. There's no reason that should have to be a requirement. All it does is ensure that one cannot glamour something that they still have alternate use for, such as an equal item level piece for a different gear set.

Without the requirement, one would still be free to toss the item once it's in the log. The only difference would be that alternate items with remaining use would come with no more risk than those no longer of actual gear value.