"In from the Cold" Scenario, any way to skip it?

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

That's won't be able to happen with the current player base. More complex dungeons sound good on paper, but roulette players get tired of having someone mess up a puzzle on their 2,000th run of the dungeon and new players don't want someone spiriting through the dungeon without letting them figure the puzzle out or explore the side rooms first.

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And this is why Trusts are going to be fleshed out and why they are putting so much effort into pushing that out. Gatekeeping isn't necessarily a bad thing, there is a reason why the clown sign says "you must be this tall to ride".

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Originally Posted by Izar_Chillen

It speaks volumes about you to when all you see, across all the discussions about said quest, is that its "waah tooo hard pls nerf" , and the opposite of "omg get good you looser" as you so ignorantly displayed
You cannot see the woods for the trees and have to interject an "at least with wow" like that has any clout here at all and were are supposed to value your input when across all the discussions many people have , on both sides , said their piece in clear and thoughtful ways regardless of the less than patient types you aimed for when making your judgment.

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Yes, people have said their piece.
And the people saying their piece are getting shat on by the epeen-strokers because of unmentioned levels of "git gud."
You can see it through the entire fucking thread. Don't try and tell me I'm less-than-patient when there's tangible proof of this in-fucking-thread.

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Originally Posted by Simple_Barghest

Yes, people have said their piece.
And the people saying their piece are getting shat on by the epeen-strokers because of unmentioned levels of "git gud."
You can see it through the entire fucking thread. Don't try and tell me I'm less-than-patient when there's tangible proof of this in-fucking-thread.

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As there are people saying how much they enjoyed, or didn't enjoy the quest without reducing themselves to insults and childish rants, just as been displayed across ALL the discussions this forum has had on the subject of In From The Cold.

Your fingers are bright red from all that cherry picking you've been doing.

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Originally Posted by Simple_Barghest

Yes, people have said their piece.
And the people saying their piece are getting shat on by the epeen-strokers because of unmentioned levels of "git gud."
You can see it through the entire fucking thread. Don't try and tell me I'm less-than-patient when there's tangible proof of this in-fucking-thread.

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Being decent at games is now considered "epeen-strokers" tier? Is this one of those "Small cups are now medium cups" things now?

Yeah, this duty had a cool idea, but terrible execution, and of course it is UNREASONABLY long for no reason at all. After a few minutes being completely clueless on where to go, I just suicided and restarted on very easy, just to power through any wrong path I took. Also sucks that you can open the map and see a straight line from where you are to your objective, but the duty locks you in a messy pathing.

Think it in one way is great, it calls for patience in stead of speed, which many lack and could learn something from.

I did it twice on two chars.
The first time I managed to clear on easy mode because I was totally lost ; the second time was cleared on normal mode - before nerf - at first try so I guess one can figure it out eventually (I was proud of my improvement!).

I liked this type of duty honesty, it was a nice change imo.
I just didn’t like at all the end of all of this struggle; the first time I did the duty, I was really worried about what Zenos could do to others with my wol appearance. All of this for… quite nothing.

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Originally Posted by LittleChickenNugget

"I cLeArEd It FiRsT tRy"
"It'S eAsY"
"I hAd No PrObLeMs, GiT gUd"

These comments literally do nothing to help anything, anyone. Regardless of the content or situation these comments are used in, and this GCBTW loves to pull these lines the MOMENT someone struggles with something. Trust me, the world is happy and very proud that you never had an issue with completing something, but don't try to invalidate the issues someone else has over something. Offer tips and tricks (which many have done in this situation) and understand it's okay for people to not like something you do. Doesn't mean you need to try to passive aggressively shame someone.

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Surprise! This is what happens whenever someone doesn't give actionable or debatable critique and just complains about something and says that it needs to be removed. Doubly so whenever responses like "Try X", "Do it on Very Easy", "Just take your time." "Here are where you can find things." are responded to with a childish "I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO! IT SHOULD JUST BE GIVEN TO ME!"

Discussion takes 2 people and if the person ostensibly "leading" the discussion is just bitching, then there's not much to discuss except proving the fact that they're in the minority by showing them that a majority of people had no problem with it.

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

That's won't be able to happen with the current player base. More complex dungeons sound good on paper, but roulette players get tired of having someone mess up a puzzle on their 2,000th run of the dungeon and new players don't want someone spiriting through the dungeon without letting them figure the puzzle out or explore the side rooms first.

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I think that it's more a problem that people make up these boogiemen who at best are the vast vast minority of players in FFXIV and at worst don't exist at all.

Let's hope we don't see anything like this quest this time.

I loved this quest; I hope there's more like it.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

Literally the only solo duty I've ever put on very easy.

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Reminder to always do that, since solo duties are at best "whack a million mobs or a mob with 15 million hp that takes forever" and at worst a cutscene cosplaying as interactive gameplay. Not to mention those where you play as another character

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

Let's hope we don't see anything like this quest this time.

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We're obviously getting PILES of them.

Why do you think they made a point of showing how they improved them?

Fair to say it'll probably be the primary quest mechanic for the entire expansion.

This was the easiest quest i have played in my life! xD

But this quest is a good example why some people find the game very dull and predictable. Because if the devs put somethin new into the game then many people do not like it because it is different and "too difficult" etc.





Cheers

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Originally Posted by ICountFrom0

We're obviously getting PILES of them.

Why do you think they made a point of showing how they improved them?

Fair to say it'll probably be the primary quest mechanic for the entire expansion.

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They improved the "tailing" missions - this quest didn't have any of that.

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Originally Posted by Andevom

I loved this quest; I hope there's more like it.

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It's honestly one of my favorite quests since I soloed HoH while waiting for Endwalker because of how cool I thought the "Lone Hero" title sounds.

Stealthily navigating a maze of monsters that could easily kill you and having to pick your fights smartly is literally what you do in higher levels of deep dungeons. Sure it's not for everyone, but I think it adds an interesting layer to the game beyond just "Tab target and spam skills until enemy dead" because you have to consider view cones, aggro type (Proximity, sound, vision) and how the monsters are grouped up as well as the monster's individual danger level.

Kinda hoping DT has a similar mission, but maybe from another character's PoV so it makes sense how we can't just unga bunga steamroll everything.

Might I make a suggestion?
Stealth missions should enable visual aids when people pick "very easy". That way whoever likes them without visual aids can play them normally and whoever doesn't like them can pick "very easy" and breeze through them. It would require failing the mission once to see the option but it would be very unobtrusive.

The visual aids added to the game in 7.0 do seem nice, but will they apply to the "This is Thancred" mission? Probably not. The enemies should at least get an yellow cone to show where to avoid being seen and a circle to avoid being smelled.

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

Let's hope we don't see anything like this quest this time.

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The fact that they made a dedicated NPC alert icon for stealth means you might be disappointed.

I guess while we're practicing thread necromancy,

I don't think the quest was too bad but under no circumstances do I want to do it a second time. If you fail at any point it's miserable trying to get back since it's slow. I also don't think this has anything to do with the NPC tailing update since it just uses the half-cooked normal enemy aggro system.

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

Let's hope we don't see anything like this quest this time.

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I will be sad if we don't get another like this. To me, it's the best RP duty we've had to date by far and an amazing piece of story telling.

I would love for them to get rid of the annoying follow quests instead but the patch notes imply there will be lots more of those to come.

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Originally Posted by ICountFrom0

We're obviously getting PILES of them.

Why do you think they made a point of showing how they improved them?

Fair to say it'll probably be the primary quest mechanic for the entire expansion.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

The fact that they made a dedicated NPC alert icon for stealth means you might be disappointed.

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I think you're thinking of Tracks in the Snow, not In from the Cold.

Tracks in the Snow is the follow quest. In from the Cold was the RP duty after dinner with Zenos.

i dont love in from the cold, but it makes for a nice change. hope for more. not sure about the new markers though, seems too fancy, too much

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Originally Posted by Skiros

LMAO they make a fun solo duty that is actually somewhat ""challenging"" (it is not challenging if you have any modicum of understanding of how enemy LoS works in this game) and people want to quit over it?

Quit, I say, quit! Better for the game that way!

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I forgot how based you are sometimes!!

It would be foolish to assume that players will enjoy doing what they are forced to do. Especially in dumb missions like this. Watching the guide on YouTube and mechanically not thinking about repeating it in the game is what you wanted to achieve, right?

I like it in theory. Where they went wrong was making it a puzzle.

This instance should be a desperate scramble to get back to Camp Broken Glass before Zenos. The puzzle aspect of it to find the magitek armor and then find the fuel for it kind of kills the pacing. And can get you killed or run out of time if you're still getting used to how the instance works which will kill any tension.

The ending sequence of it is pretty good. But they shouldn't have put a 'puzzle' in it and kept the pace and tension high throughout.

My other big complaint is that the whole thing amounts to a wet fart. I didn't want Zenos to slaughter half the named cast but all of that just to show up before anything interesting happens with Zenos in our body was very deflating imo.

Having replayed Endwalker during the cloud data center stress test, I became aware that (for me) most of this duty's "difficulty" came from its misleading objective. I hated it the first time, largely because I initially assumed "reach Camp Broken Glass" meant "walk towards Camp Broken Glass" not "wander around the ruined city and click on things, because there's a wall of magic red dots between you and Camp Broken Glass".

The second time around, I only hated it because it was functionally identical to (and about as engaging as) an unskippable cutscene.

The people in this thread saying this duty "makes you feel something" are right. In many cases, the "something" seems to be frustration and disappointment.

You will now witness an off-topic screenshot of my Cloudtest02 character.

https://i.imgur.com/erXRTje.png

I hated In From The Cold. Not because it was difficult. It wasn't. I hate it because it was frustratingly inconsistend. FFXIV is not an engine made for stealth games. Enemy aggro was all over the place where sometimes I could walk right under their nose and they didn't notice me while at other times they would tag me from half the area away. Though to me, the worst offender is that you have to do the goals exactly in sequence.

Smart move to avoid another quest like this.

'In from the Cold' was the only Solo duty I enjoyed and refused to put on very easy on subsequent playthroughs.

I liked the stark contrast between the WoL and your ordinary garlean foot soldier. One wrong move and you're in trouble or dead. It really put into perspective just how weak your average Garlean without magitek is.

who the fuck is necro-ing this

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Originally Posted by HighlanderClone

I forgot how based you are sometimes!!

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https://i.imgur.com/HFE0ZgMm.jpg

Now you know how it feels to be a trash mob

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Originally Posted by ConantSivrha

Snip

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Yeah, that's the one thing I dislike about this battle quest, the objective is "Reach Camp Broken Glass" yet there's a barrier preventing you from getting there and a time limit

I literally had to open an online guide to figure out what the hell I'm supposed to do because even though I've literally solo'd HoH before and have no problem whatsoever in sneaking past mobs and picking my fights, you can't just give us a quest objective but the actual objective is entirely unrelated to what's stated on screen because you're supposed to interact with a bunch of BS hidden in the middle of a ton of mobs to generate a hidden McGuffin and then team up with a bunch of NPCs to beat up the bad guys.

None of that is related to reaching camp broken glass, and it makes no sense why I can't simply run in that direction.

Hell if I ever replay through EW I'm probably gonna have to consult a guide again that shows me where the magical McGuffins I have to interact with are, assuming they didn't tweak the quest

Threads like this is why Dawntrail MSQ is an absolute borefest full of "talk to Wuk Lamat" quests and "Follow this person without getting caught". We had at least 2 BIG moments in the MSQ that should have been playable:

The TRAIN Scene, using the turrets or fighting enemies trying to board. And the first Tuliyolal Invasion, we should have been able to roam around the city fighting enemies and protecting the people

Instead we only got 144 "Speak to Wuk Lamat" quests because Visual Novel players cannot conceive pressing more than 2 buttons during the MSQ and cry every time the dev team creates something interesting like this solo duty, or the Thancread one.

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Originally Posted by royox

Threads like this is why Dawntrail MSQ is an absolute borefest full of "talk to Wuk Lamat" quests and "Follow this person without getting caught". We had at least 2 BIG moments in the MSQ that should have been playable:

The TRAIN Scene, using the turrets or fighting enemies trying to board. And the first Tuliyolal Invasion, we should have been able to roam around the city fighting enemies and protecting the people

Instead we only got 144 "Speak to Wuk Lamat" quests because Visual Novel players cannot conceive pressing more than 2 buttons during the MSQ and cry every time the dev team creates something interesting like this solo duty, or the Thancread one.

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Have to make any kind of effort to finish a solo duty? Nooo let the duty automatically finish itself please I hate it.

In from the Cold was my favorite solo duty but they gutted it apparently cause too hard, not enough handholding. Please Yoshi P.

I'm not surprised that DT has more of the sleeper objectives, EW had alot of 'escort this' 'walk there', truly putting the walk in Endwalker...

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Originally Posted by royox

Threads like this is why Dawntrail MSQ is an absolute borefest full of "talk to Wuk Lamat" quests and "Follow this person without getting caught". We had at least 2 BIG moments in the MSQ that should have been playable:

The TRAIN Scene, using the turrets or fighting enemies trying to board. And the first Tuliyolal Invasion, we should have been able to roam around the city fighting enemies and protecting the people

Instead we only got 144 "Speak to Wuk Lamat" quests because Visual Novel players cannot conceive pressing more than 2 buttons during the MSQ and cry every time the dev team creates something interesting like this solo duty, or the Thancread one.

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I’m with you that we should’ve had solo duties on those spoilered parts. Those are the kind I would have actually enjoyed! Of course, I’m sure if they had, someone would’ve complained that it wasn’t anything new or original, because:

with the exception of the turrets, we already had a train battle with the Phantom Train.

I still think it would’ve been really fun!

But I dislike being forced to play as someone else. It’s annoying, and if we’re talking about immersion, it definitely breaks it. At least the one this post is referring to, you’re playing as “yourself,” just in really bad circumstances. I give the Thancred one points for creativity, but I want to play as my own character.

And I hate stealth missions in general… we had at least 5 “follow without being seen” quests between the DT MSQ, role quests and side quests I’ve done so far. Just not the type of gameplay I enjoy, but beyond that, it’s just annoying. Even with them making the markers ridiculously large, I could still be standing behind a tree, totally not in line of sight, and still be caught and have to redo it all over again.

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Originally Posted by Khryseis_Astra

But I dislike being forced to play as someone else. It’s annoying, and if we’re talking about immersion, it definitely breaks it. At least the one this post is referring to, you’re playing as “yourself,” just in really bad circumstances. I give the Thancred one points for creativity, but I want to play as my own character.

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Personally I like those quests. It makes me feel more connected to other characters besides the WoL using gameplay and not only cinematics where everybody is standing in a circle emoting one by one (one of them usually closing the fist very very hard). I never understood this immersion breaking argument, this is a videogame and I prefer playing parts, even if I have to control other characters, than have Thancread calling using Linkshell "ey friend, I already infiltrated the Garlean camp". I love the gameplay part of playing games.

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Originally Posted by royox

Personally I like those quests. It makes me feel more connected to other characters besides the WoL using gameplay and not only cinematics where everybody is standing in a circle emoting one by one (one of them usually closing the fist very very hard). I never understood this immersion breaking argument, this is a videogame and I prefer playing parts, even if I have to control other characters, than have Thancread calling using Linkshell "ey friend, I already infiltrated the Garlean camp". I love the gameplay part of playing games.

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I guess I agree that action of some kind is better than just a cutscene or a linkshell call… Thancred is the stealth expert, but maybe our character could’ve gone along to create a diversion or few to make his objective easier.

It’s just a personal preference really… every other FF game you’re controlling someone else, but in the MMOs, you get to be your own custom character, and I’ve grown to prefer that.

Watch a YouTube video and switch difficulty after failing to easy and you will clear just fine no need to quit over something easy to figure out with some tweaks trust me this isn't bad it's prepping you for later gameplay lol plus they give you some tips to help and heal packs

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Originally Posted by royox

Threads like this is why Dawntrail MSQ is an absolute borefest full of "talk to Wuk Lamat" quests and "Follow this person without getting caught".

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I doubt that Dawntrail’s low number of solo duties is the result of this thread, especially since one of the four solo duties we did get was still one that didn’t let us play our character’s job. Endwalker’s MSQ without patch content has five solo duties—only one more than we got in Dawntrail—so this problem isn’t even new. To me, Dawntrail and Endwalker feel similarly dead in terms of gameplay. But Dawntrail is longer than Endwalker, so the combat segments have longer stretches of cutscene/dialogue/walking time in-between them, and Dawntrail’s story is less well-liked than Endwalker’s, so people are noticing the lackluster gameplay experience more because they’re not engrossed in the story.

In any case “almost all gameplay outside of walking and clicking through dialogue should be cut from future expansions’ MSQ” would not have been a reasonable takeaway from reading a thread in which people are saying “I didn’t enjoy this one specific solo duty (which has a misleading objective, three buttons for your character, no automatic HP regen, ‘stealth’ in a game that generally isn’t built with stealth gameplay in mind, and a very slow gameplay experience overall)”.