Revelations from Patch 7.3: The Promise of Tomorrow

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

I can't help but feel that someone as pragmatic, and with such a meticulous mindset, as Calyx would just leave his former body to rot, particularly not when the technology to place a person in stasis existed.

---

Why would he, though? Calyx is a pragmatic guy, and a guy who clearly believes that a person's 'personhood' comes from their memories above all else. I could genuinely believe that, after he sustainably made the Endless happen, he'd consider his own body disposable; he's not the one ascribing importance to that relationship, we are.

That said, it is entirely possible he was essentially in the same position as Sphene, of being put on ice while they figured out Endless; after all, he didn't exactly have a long life expectancy. In that case, I could see him being kept alive simply out of nobody caring to turn the stasis off, and that somehow being a plot beat. I'm not sure I like that, because I actually prefer the idea that Calyx's view of 'memories are life' is kept respected, and using his body as some kind of macguffin would short-sell it.

I absolutely think he left his real body considering that ailing body was a major driving factor in his belief system and why he pioneered the endless. Chronic disease, let alone one that would absolutely kill a person when young, does weird things to your brain.

If it's still around, I would sooner assume the plot has us putting him back in it and letting nature run it's course. Brutal as it may be.

You think he's not dying in 7.4? This guy has underestimated us twice. He doesn't know who we are, otherwise he would be putting that in his calculations. He's trying to "see what we can do". He's been caught off guard twice now. No, I think Calyx is a bridge to a bigger reveal. And after that reveal THEN we fight him, knowing who he is. He doesn't know Y'shtola and G'raha and our knowledge of Ascians and how to deal with them. Once he inevitably transforms, we end him and the rest we deal with leading up to 8.0. I don't see us making the same mistakes that let Lahabrea, Emet, Elidibus, and Fandaniel get away with their schemes this time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dastan

You think he's not dying in 7.4? This guy has underestimated us twice. He doesn't know who we are, otherwise he would be putting that in his calculations. He's trying to "see what we can do". He's been caught off guard twice now. No, I think Calyx is a bridge to a bigger reveal. And after that reveal THEN we fight him, knowing who he is. He doesn't know Y'shtola and G'raha and our knowledge of Ascians and how to deal with them. Once he inevitably transforms, we end him and the rest we deal with leading up to 8.0. I don't see us making the same mistakes that let Lahabrea, Emet, Elidibus, and Fandaniel get away with their schemes this time.

---

Calyx would have to appear in 7.4 in order to die in 7.4. But the post-Dawntrail patches have returned to the pre-Endwalker format where x.1 through x.3 wraps up the lingering story while x.4 and x.5 set up the next expansion.

Calyx showed up at the end of 7.3 in a stinger, clearly meant to foreshadow something that's going to happen much later. Judging by similar setups in the past, I don't expect him to appear again until 8.4 at the earliest.

My theory is he's going to become the "brains" of this opposing group, and Calyx will likely be obsessively researching us now that we made him see what ever an Endless' version of Jesus is.

Now that I say that, I actually hope the Winterers actually work as a team verses the Ascians, who spread themselves very thin and rarely worked in tandem. If these Winterers actually relied and supported eachother as allies, they'd make for a vastly more dangerous force.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dastan

You think he's not dying in 7.4? This guy has underestimated us twice. He doesn't know who we are, otherwise he would be putting that in his calculations.

---

You can't fit 'reputation' into a calculation, especially when that reputation's from another goddamn planet. (Several of them, actually.) None of that's relevant to his calculations, because there's not usable data. He has to build from first principles, and frankly, he was doing a pretty good job given he was, by nature, never going to succeed. It's narratively impossible for him to kill us, so of course he was always failing.

And hell, he never really failed because of us. The Queen Eternal backfired just because Wuk Lamat was too cool for Endless Sphene not to be friends with, and Necron faltering was more of a Real Sphene victory than anything.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RedLolly

My theory is he's going to become the "brains" of this opposing group, and Calyx will likely be obsessively researching us now that we made him see what ever an Endless' version of Jesus is.

Now that I say that, I actually hope the Winterers actually work as a team verses the Ascians, who spread themselves very thin and rarely worked in tandem. If these Winterers actually relied and supported eachother as allies, they'd make for a vastly more dangerous force.

---

And yeah, this is sort of the 'best-case scenario' of how to use Calyx in the Winterers that I can imagine. That he's essentially the 'weaponsmith' for the group, so going up against them is as much a matter of figuring out the weaknesses in Calyx's methods than it is any tactical or moral weakness.

I'm not optimistic enough to say that will happen, but I think that's the best way to do it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dastan

All should be revealed soon, but I did suddenly have a suspicion that Calyx is one of our missing four Ascians. It is possible we will get a trio of them as the antagonists of 8.0. Yes, we saw Altima and Deudalaphon's masks in Gaius' possession, but that doesn't mean they are "dead". Calyx could possibly be Pashtarot's shard. This could explain his knowledge of primal summoning and his cold and calculating personality. That "ascian" we saw could be Altima, Deudalaphon, or even Halmarut.

But I still think Calyx is definitely dying in 7.4

---

Considering Gaius wasn't aware that an Ascian has to be imprisoned in an auracite to be "killed", it's honestly pretty safe to assume than any Ascian he fought with is still roaming somewhere out there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cleretic

I would consider Calyx dying-for-real in 7.4 a personal insult, he deserves better than that and as his apparent biggest defender I'll continue saying that! He's also smarter than that, he knows people think he's dead, you don't get to capitalize on that by just, like, waiting until the next day.

But also... when has this game dodged killing a significant character (especially a villain), only to kill them for real the literal very next chance they get? C'mon, even Yotsuyu and Nidhogg had a couple patches of runway, they just don't do that.

---

I wouldn't consider myself quite Calyx's defender, but I found him to be a very compelling character within the borders of his trope.

While he underestimated us (and that is hardly surprising, since he wouldn't even know that WoL is a God Slayer in all meanings possible), he still doesn't strike me as the type of a character who'd just storm ahead to be killed right after he encountered WoL head-on. Dude got an actual panic attack and maybe PTSD from that experience, judging by that last cut scene.

He should be smart enough to lie low for a while, consider his options and do research on us by possibly employing other parties to do the dirty job of fighting us.