Just a thought on Elezen.

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Originally Posted by Faliandra

I dont really see how either side can be proven right or wrong..

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This, right here. This is the core problem with this entire issue. It cannot be proven right or wrong, because it's all preference on a person by person basis. An aesthetic choice cannot be right or wrong, that's simply not how it works.

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Originally Posted by Faliandra

and mine and their opinion is not of lesser value than yours.

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You're right, they aren't, but neither are ours of lesser value to yours. However we have something lose, you do not. This is why we are being so defensive about it.

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Originally Posted by Faliandra

HOW does adjusting the head size to the rest of the body to a NORMAL ratio

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A normal ratio to a standard human, once again, Elezen are not human, they are not supposed to be human, and are not the human analog. Stop holding them to the aesthetic balance of a different race.

Almost went back to Elezen because of this thread.

If i could look like alphinaud or alisaie, I would play an elezen, but instead they went with the terrible race design from FFXI.

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Originally Posted by Serilda

'Normal' for what? Miqo'te? Lalafell? Giraffes? Or adult humans, which don't exist in Eorzea. Given that the in-game female Elezens all have this specific head:body proportion, a version with a bigger head would be a big-headed Elezen and the current proportion is, for Elezen, 'normal'. The men have tiny heads too comparatively. My character's hat/facewear game is nowhere near as interesting as his thighboot collection.

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just because Hyur are called hyur, doesnt make them less human when it comes to APPEARANCE. So we can take that as a great example of a "normal" head to body ratio, yes.

I just dont see the male ones as having odd proportions. I mean, what some people said is correct: males are ok to have broader shoulders. But why would you make females the same? they ARE female after all.
Genders have different features.
Just look at female roes: they are quite chunky and have buff arms and legs...but they are nothing compared to their male hulk-like counterparts. If you were to say that its normal for both male and female elezen to have such broad shoulders,
then why do female roes differ so much from male roes? Or same goes for female aura and male aura. How does it make sense that female aura are so damn tiny when their male counterparts are friggin huuuuge (they couldve at least extended the possible max height on the fem au ra slider)?

As for "all in-game fem elezen" having this specific head: Alisaie would like to have a word with you.
(and no, it doesnt mean I want a carbon copy of Alisaie)

Alisaie is an adolescent. When she fills out a bit and grows up, her head will be as tiny as that of any other Elezen (presumably). There are lots of young Elezen in the game who haven't had their growth spurt yet so their heads look relatively large.

The answer to pretty much everything else is 'fantasy'. They didn't call us 'elezen' and 'hyur' because they couldn't spell the traditional words, they did it to allow them to deviate from established 'rules' and make their own twists on fantasy staples. I'm ok with the idea of a race without so many physically differences between the sexes; female Elezen are more graceful while male Elezen are more wiry, but both having broad shoulders, big hands, fierce expressions...? Why not? This is a world with a race where the hyper-feminine women are half the size of the hyper-masculine men, and with another race where the women and men look completely indistinguishable to outsiders. And if we must include real world examples, there are plenty of unusually tall women or unusually small men even though we only have one playable race IRL (humans). Diverse physiques are cool. Clinging to a narrow idea of 'normal' is less cool.

I would struggle to main a character of any race but Elezen because I love them so much the way they already are. There's really no good alternative on offer, so please don't change us.

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Originally Posted by Faliandra

I just dont see the male ones as having odd proportions. I mean, what some people said is correct: males are ok to have broader shoulders. But why would you make females the same? they ARE female after all.
Genders have different features.

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At least you admit it's just because you don't think female elezen are "feminine enough", unlike most others in this thread.

Some races have a lot of sexual dimorphism (in particular, au ra) others do not - elezen in this case. That doesn't make it wrong.

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Originally Posted by Vesper-Aureolin

I don't think anybody here was saying that the fem Elezen were ugly because they're not how women are 'supposed' to look.

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The reason I cannot agree with this, is no one is complaining about the men having small heads. The proportions are the same. But for some reason it's acceptable for male elezen, but not for female. Why is that, then, if not for gender reasons?

While I'm not a fan of how Elezen are proportioned either; it's not like they're the only race with flaws. I have no self control and fantasia all the time, I've been both a male and fem Elezen before and it's just not been to my liking. That being said; I do find male Elezen super attractive. (Not because I don't like fem Elezen-- I just find men attractive lol)

I feel like this has become a bit of an aggressive thread considering there's no actual danger of the Elezen being changed in any way. Not to mention the odd choice of bringing gender stereotypes into it. Elezen have comparatively small heads, I don't think anybody here was saying that the fem Elezen were ugly because they're not how women are 'supposed' to look.

At most-- people are saying that if there was an option to perhaps adjust the proportions of the character, they would absolutely play one. And I think that's a very positive thing to add to a particularly rarely played race compared to Miqo'te or Au Ra.

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Originally Posted by Serilda

Alisaie is an adolescent. When she fills out a bit and grows up, her head will be as tiny as that of any other Elezen (presumably). There are lots of young Elezen in the game who haven't had their growth spurt yet so their heads look relatively large.

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Um, no. Those young elezen have the same broad shoulder/small head issue like their grown-up version. So saying Alisaie is like that cos shes an adolescent is wrong.
Its not just her bigger head. She also has smaller, narrow shoulders. Her whole body ratio is completely different compared to other adolescent elezen npcs in the game.

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Originally Posted by Syfurion

This, right here. This is the core problem with this entire issue. It cannot be proven right or wrong, because it's all preference on a person by person basis. An aesthetic choice cannot be right or wrong, that's simply not how it works.

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...So here you acknowledge the problem....

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Originally Posted by Syfurion

A normal ratio to a standard human, once again, Elezen are not human, they are not supposed to be human, and are not the human analog. Stop holding them to the aesthetic balance of a different race.

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...and here you throw it all aboard and go back to making your own assumptions sound like facts. Apart from that, I never said "standard human", I said "normal".
Normal in terms of other races, or, if youd like to insist I'm refering to "standard human", Hyur.

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Originally Posted by Serilda

Alisaie is an adolescent. When she fills out a bit and grows up, her head will be as tiny as that of any other Elezen (presumably). There are lots of young Elezen in the game who haven't had their growth spurt yet so their heads look relatively large.

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Alphinaud and Alisaie both seem to be late teenagers, like 15-17, girls and boys are normally done with their growing by 15, and yet both are practically 2 heads shorter than "adult" elezen. I would not be surprised to learn they're half elezens, like Hilda.

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Originally Posted by storm

Alphinaud and Alisaie both seem to be late teenagers, like 15-17, girls and boys are normally done with their growing by 15, and yet both are practically 2 heads shorter than "adult" elezen. I would not be surprised to learn they're half elezens, like Hilda.

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It's been confirmed a few times that Elezen don't reach their full height until quite late into their teens (or maybe even very early twenties). As a race they're canonically late bloomers.

As for why they look different to other young Elezen, they're just lucky enough to get special models. I suspect the reason is 'marketability' rather than anything deep - ISTR they were both confirmed as being full Elezen already - but perhaps there are small differences between other as-yet-unseen variants of Elezen which will come into play much later on. I have nothing against them adding half-Elezen or more faces when technology and development time permit.