To the Devs: PvP Reward Ideas. [Feast Season Rewards]

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Originally Posted by Saru_Grey

I have read several pages, and I have read alot of what you have said - especially against Stefan. Your system is not fair. Fair Treatment I'm all for such as: First World, Server, Data Center - all PvE related - all deserve a title, an item, or unique mount for their accomplishment.
It is a reward, not a silver platter. I am against the "you participated so you deserve a medal exactly like the #1 champion has" that your system offers. I have offered my constructive feedback, but you do not recognize it, get some rest and read the last sentence of my last post very carefully about the "examples such as..."

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Exactly. We make valid points that can be applied across and consistent with all competitions, but they disregard it. They say it's not good/constructive enough, which is absurd. Grimmel is saying he provides counter arguments, which just refers BACK to his original post. But if we reply to the original post (because there is nothing new on their end), we're accused of not reading the thread. There's literally nothing to see here, just players who can't/won't win and propose another way of obtaining rewards meant solely for the winners of a competition. It's ludicrous. I'm just staying in the thread so it doesn't go unopposed.

Here's something constructive (which we've said before):

PVP gets awesome exclusive rewards. PVE doesn't. PVE should get awesome exclusive rewards.

That makes things even, doesn't dumb things down, doesn't take away from people who succeed in these hard challenges. It also doesn't appeal to the rampant "wants" of so-called "collectors" who feel entitled to everything released without working through the challenges and winning the rewards. IT DOES hype content, IT DOES add value to achievements based on merit.

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Originally Posted by Lone-wolfe-02

I understand you think PvP would die as a result of this but i disagree, the raiding scene has never died even knowing all that hard work meant nothing in 6 months, people would still PvP for the newer rewards and they would function the same with the top players getting the newer items first and the more casual players can grind or whatever for the old items.

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Lol. I agree with the OP we are talking in circles. What would motivate players to participate in the Feast NOW? The feast needs players. You don't have to sit around all day in que to Raid. PvP requires other players to que up to advance. Raid groups have a set group and tackle the Raid at their Raid time. You have to wait for other people to do pvp. If you take away the reward what is the incentive to do the feast now?

You want to take away the exclusive rewards? Fine. But tell me, if a mount isn't going to inspire you to compete, what will? You want to take away the ONLY reason new players would join the feast, not pvp, the feast. If you could come up with a way for more players to join the competition I would concede to everyone should get a prize. Your suggestion only takes, you want this prize and don't care if the pvp'ers get better que times. Funny enough, thats the only thing all pvp'ers can agree that they want. How does grinding whenever you want, in any pvp game mode, help this current season of the feast?

Plus Raiders raid for gear, new pve gear comes out every 6 months. That's why the raiding scene never dies. If you got a raid at the same rate we got a pvp map, the raid scene most certainly would die. You can't sit there and tell me that the raiders would be ok with still being on i205 gear AND still doing coils. That's about the same rate.

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Originally Posted by Gravton

I think a fair compromise would be to allow everyone in the diamond rank to get the mount/minion. Diamond rank isn't restricted to the number of players in it is it? Like only 100 people can be in diamond? This would still force players to participate in the feast (which is probably what SE wants in the first place) it also allows every player a chance to obtain the reward regardless of skill (some will take longer than others)

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This is a really good suggestion, something that'd keep both sides happy, as it removes the time constriction while keeping the competitive aspect. This makes it so if someone misses season 3 and 4, they'll still have a chance of obtaining the Hellhound in season 5.

I'm not sure how much the ranks fluctuate over the course of a season, but by current standards, diamond would be a bit too high. Platinum would probably be better for the mount, with gold rank getting the minion. This'll push more people to get higher ranks, meaning there's also gonna be more competition across the board, which is a good thing, right?

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Originally Posted by Nirokun

Exactly. We make valid points that can be applied across and consistent with all competitions, but they disregard it.

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Except your points can be summed up as "keep the system as it is, add stuff for non-PvP stuff", this is more along the lines of saying "No, I like it as it is.", and isn't really much of a counter argument.

I like that idea even more, buy things with marks, only certain items are unlocked per pvp rank. Make it work just like the Grand Companies except your rank still resets at the start of each season. I think that would make the most people happy. Winning the season gives you the right to display exclusively during the next season.

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

This is a really good suggestion, something that'd keep both sides happy, as it removes the time constriction while keeping the competitive aspect. This makes it so if someone misses season 3 and 4, they'll still have a chance of obtaining the Hellhound in season 5.

Except your points can be summed up as "keep the system as it is, add stuff for non-PvP stuff", this is more along the lines of saying "No, I like it as it is.", and isn't really much of a counter argument.

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Diamond is more restrictive than top 100 on Primal, but I think you figured that out. It does not, however, relieve the time restriction, because your rank is tied to the season. If you cant get top 100 in the season, you definitely wont be getting diamond. SE did, however, make ranking up easier by lowering the amount of rank points you lose when losing a match.

My point is more "keep the system as it is because it makes sense in a competition of winners and losers, add stuff for non-PvP stuff". This point is abundantly clear across most of the posters for keeping the rewards as they are. You just dont think it's justified because it doesn't allow you to obtain the rewards without placing in the top 100 AS DESIGNED.

The rewards are going to the people who are very skilled, so when you see them, you think "Oh, this person is very skilled at Feast PVP". Today I randomly encountered the person who had the same Top 100 rank as I did (I was in S1, he was in S2, surprisingly same server, given the leader board is for the top 100 on the data center). I knew this, because I saw him in Feast Season 2 gear, then looked him up on the leaderboard (because, to have the gear, you have to be on the leaderboard). As a PVP player, I can roughly gauge his skill level based on his ranking, and it just so happened that we had the same rank. There was a certain level of respect that was shared because we're on the same level.

If you had the gear, through some other proposed method, it would be meaningless. Because let me tell you, the top players (those that have the crowns) are very, very skilled. You know you're in for a rough ride with them on the other side of the battlefield. The top player in S1 was particularly frightening, he would do all the scary stuff regular MCH do, but he would bait you so hard. I'm not even going to tell you what he did, because it was so smart and so sneaky. I was blasting him with tells (he was on my server, at the time) about how sneaky he was right after the match. I had never seen anyone do what he did before, and it was really effective. He deserved the top spot imo.

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Originally Posted by Nirokun

Diamond is more restrictive than top 100 on Primal, but I think you figured that out. It does not, however, relieve the time restriction, because your rank is tied to the season. If you cant get top 100 in the season, you definitely wont be getting diamond. SE did, however, make ranking up easier by lowering the amount of rank points you lose when losing a match

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Nice job cutting out the part of my post where I say that diamond would be too high, and that platinum (mount) and gold (minion) would probably be better, but I guess you already started writing after you read the first paragraph of my post.
Also note the keyword "probably" indicating that a different rank requirement might be better, but that's up for debate.

Not to mention the fact that it would relieve the time restriction by keeping the mount and minion as possible rewards after season 4, but you'd only know that if you had actually read past the first paragraph of my post.

Also, I care little about your story in the last part of your post, since the exact same thing can be said about PvE, with players wearing the current best gear, having the raid mount, and their dps ranking. Both modes have famous players.

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

Nice job cutting out the part of my post where I say that diamond would be too high, and that platinum (mount) and gold (minion) would probably be better, but I guess you already started writing after you read the first paragraph of my post.
Also note the keyword "probably" indicating that a different rank requirement might be better, but that's up for debate.

Not to mention the fact that it would relieve the time restriction by keeping the mount and minion as possible rewards after season 4, but you'd only know that if you had actually read past the first paragraph of my post.

Also, I care little about your story in the last part of your post, since the exact same thing can be said about PvE, with players wearing the current best gear, having the raid mount, and their dps ranking. Both modes have famous players.

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I literally just read everything you wrote and responded. You can see that, because I acknowledged you by saying "but I think you figured that out". I don't need to keep the entirety of your post to respond to you, but look, here, it's copied for you. Feel better? I'm sorry if you get mad about summaries, but then also get mad about direct replies to specific points. Clearly you just like to be mad, so by all means, continue.

There's not a whole lot of meaning in your posts because you just say probably/maybe/possibly, then deny you made any actual points anytime anyone quotes you. lol

But sure, lets just ignore meaningful parts of my posts that outline WHY exclusive rewards are good (the entirety of the point I'm making), because it must be exactly the same as PVE. Last I checked, you aren't using that knowledge of someone's raid prowess to formulate strategies on how to somehow... out-raid them. There's no involvement with that person whatsoever. With PVP, how someone ranks should directly figure into your strategy to beat them.

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Originally Posted by Gravton

I should also state that I too will never see these rewards. I think a fair compromise would be to allow everyone in the diamond rank to get the mount/minion. Diamond rank isn't restricted to the number of players in it is it? Like only 100 people can be in diamond? This would still force players to participate in the feast (which is probably what SE wants in the first place) it also allows every player a chance to obtain the reward regardless of skill (some will take longer than others)

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Ok now that I've gotten enough sleep last night. I can read and comprehend things better instead of just squinting and my brain relaying things differently.

Looking at the ranks from previous PvP seasons; very few people obtained Diamond rank across all servers. While the idea to restrict the rewards behind a certain rank may be plausible, I'll need a little more convincing as I still rather like the idea I proposed because it brings PvP to all aspects of PvP content.

We'd still need a rewards or a token system, that limits the amount one can farm a day and that are consistently added onto each season to keep other PvP content relevant that isn't in the form of an achievement.

My suggestion I made to balance the exclusive rewards between all types of PvP content ensures that people are doing the type of content they're most comfortable with to be able to earn the same rewards. As I mentioned earlier some people may prefer close knit content with a light or full party while others prefer something a kin to a 24 man raid.

In all my proposal is a 2 aspect deal. Bringing the rewards eventually to everyone and reviving all forms of PvP content.

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Originally Posted by Nirokun

I literally just read everything you wrote and responded. You can see that, because I acknowledged you by saying "but I think you figured that out". I don't need to keep the entirety of your post to respond to you, but look, here, it's copied for you. Feel better? I'm sorry if you get mad about summaries, but then also get mad about direct replies to specific points. Clearly you just like to be mad, so by all means, continue.

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The fact that you insinuated that I'm mad, based on my written words to your written words, just makes me laugh. You might as well have typed "you mad bro?" (for clarity: I'm not).

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Originally Posted by Nirokun

There's not a whole lot of meaning in your posts because you just say probably/maybe/possibly, then deny you made any actual points anytime anyone quotes you. lol

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Says the guy who used "I think" which leaves room for doubt on if I did figure it out. Hypocrite much?

I agreed with Gravton's suggestion. No denying here.
I left the details up for debate, because that's what forums are for. In this case, that would be which ranks would be best suited for the mount/minion. No denying here either.

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Originally Posted by Nirokun

But sure, lets just ignore meaningful parts of my posts that outline WHY exclusive rewards are good (the entirety of the point I'm making), because it must be exactly the same as PVE. Last I checked, you aren't using that knowledge of someone's raid prowess to formulate strategies on how to somehow... out-raid them. There's no involvement with that person whatsoever. With PVP, how someone ranks should directly figure into your strategy to beat them.

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The world first race is a race between teams of players to find the right tactic to clear a raid. Sure, it's not a face-to-face direct competition like PvP, but it's still a competition.
One's raid prowess can be used to get better at clearing raids, by looking at how someone deals with situations in a fight, or by going over their rankings to see what they're doing differently. To some, getting to hit that #1 spot on a dps ranking site means a lot, and that's a type of competition as well.

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

The fact that you insinuated that I'm mad, based on my written words to your written words, just makes me laugh. You might as well have typed "you mad bro?" (for clarity: I'm not).

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After a period of time, arguing semantics is dull and interesting. I guess we shouldn't even try to understand each other, because text conversations are clearly inefficient. So here's a picture, it means something!

http://i.imgur.com/SKaaOpl.jpg?1

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

The world first race is a race between teams of players to find the right tactic to clear a raid. Sure, it's not a face-to-face direct competition like PvP, but it's still a competition.
One's raid prowess can be used to get better at clearing raids, by looking at how someone deals with situations in a fight, or by going over their rankings to see what they're doing differently. To some, getting to hit that #1 spot on a dps ranking site means a lot, and that's a type of competition as well.

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And again, I've suggested these people get rewarded for their efforts with exclusive rewards, for all the reasons I've stated repeatedly. The dps rankings require a lot of interpretation, because of dmg boosting. I'm sure you'll try to argue that there's cheating in PVP, and there are people(trash) that try and get banned. But that's a separate problem entirely, but not too dissimilar with this thread and people who are not deserving of the rewards trying to get them. :)