Lack of End Game Content

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Originally Posted by Hawklaser

Most get that the purpose of weekly caps is to slow down content consumption, but there is also a bit of irony to them. So many keep bringing up that the devs want us to take breaks and do other things, yet they keep using weekly caps. Weekly caps are one of the things that lead to people feeling like they can't take a prolonged break. Want to have more than one job geared up with current BiS? Better not miss hitting a single weekly cap. Thankfully there are not a lot of weekly caps yet. But if you rea

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Any meaningfull prolonged break would lead to come back next patch or around it, next patch implementing new gear on par with current token gear or totaly new token gear, uncapping the tome tier you were on meaning you can finish your set, get an upgrade if you so desire and start the new tier without being undergeared. And I dont' even mention the dungeon that will give correct gear you can do almost naked. At level 80, if you take your pause now, you'd have to come back in at least one years to be undergeared significantly enough to require any consequent farming.

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Originally Posted by Hawklaser

Most get that the purpose of weekly caps is to slow down content consumption, but there is also a bit of irony to them. So many keep bringing up that the devs want us to take breaks and do other things, yet they keep using weekly caps. Weekly caps are one of the things that lead to people feeling like they can't take a prolonged break. Want to have more than one job geared up with current BiS? Better not miss hitting a single weekly cap. Thankfully there are not a lot of weekly caps yet. But if you rea

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Thing is, the weekly caps are low enough that they do allow for at least shorter breaks while you're actively playing.

For example, the cap on Phantasmagoria is 450 tomestones/week. That's equivalent to:

• 5 Expert Roulette dungeons (and nothing else)
• Less than two days of all roulettes (other than Mentor) at lv80 (one day gives 265-281 tomestones [the higher amounts if you get a lv80 normal raid and/or the lv80 trial])
• 4.5 sets of just the MSQ roulette and Alliance Raid roulette (that's right, no lv80 content whatsoever!)

If you consider that the average Expert roulette takes 25-30m (less with a good group, worse with a particularly bad group)...that's 30m/day to cap, with two days not playing at all...and the option to fully cap in a weekend if that doesn't work out (or even in a day if you grind out lv80 dungeons, which give 50 tomestones/run outside of a roulette bonus)...it's a joke, really.

Further, every even patch all gear that was previously obtainable via the limited tomestone becomes available via the unlimited tomestone, so there's always a quick and easy catch-up.

Further still, every odd patch has a more casual type of raid (alliance raids) that drop gear equal to that from limited tomestones.

On top of that, the normal versions of even-patch raids drop gear that's almost as good as that from the limited tomestone.

Then there's crafted gear, etc. Basically there's nothing holding you back from being literally caught up to where you're capable of raiding the current savage tier within a couple hours of returning even after a prolonged break. (By comparison, I last raided WoW in Uldir, at the Mythic level, and then took a break for about 7 months. I went from, while not BiS, some of the best gear in the game...to worse than is available via world drops, and barely enough to even enter LFR...on top of being probably 30 levels behind on the neckpiece).

So, sure, you can't get BiS quickly without the caps, but you can get good enough...and let's be honest, that's all you need anyhow.

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Originally Posted by jameseoakes

The tome currency works though and there 's not really a need to change it, the cap is rather artificial but it does it's job to pad out the content

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I disagree. You can easily get Rokan's Goetia full set in a day - even in 5.0... that sure didn't feel like it was padding out content.

Phantasmagoria tomes are a different story with the cap and smaller gains - but it still feels lacklustre and too easy to obtain (lets remember that a lot of 470 gear BiS is Phantasmagoria).

I'd prefer if tomes were rewarded for greater achievements, rather than capped and hidden behind unchallenging content in an attempt to drag things out by nature.

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Originally Posted by Avraym

I disagree. You can easily get Rokan's Goetia full set in a day - even in 5.0... that sure didn't feel like it was padding out content.

Phantasmagoria tomes are a different story with the cap and smaller gains - but it still feels lacklustre and too easy to obtain.

I'd prefer if tomes were rewarded for greater achievements, rather than capped in an attempt to drag things out by nature.

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That's what the savage gear is for.

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Originally Posted by Avraym

I disagree. You can easily get Rokan's Goetia full set in a day - even in 5.0... that sure didn't feel like it was padding out content.

Phantasmagoria tomes are a different story with the cap and smaller gains - but it still feels lacklustre and too easy to obtain (lets remember that a lot of 470 gear BiS is Phantasmagoria).

I'd prefer if tomes were rewarded for greater achievements, rather than capped in an attempt to drag things out by nature.

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Meh, tomestones are the casual access to sub BiS gear, to get BiS you need to down savage or wait 3 to 4 month the release of the 24 man raid to get one pieces upgrade/week. And even like that you'll never get a BiS weapon or better sub-stat gear you may regard as BiS. I think raider/challenge-eater already have enough exclusive reward.

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Originally Posted by jameseoakes

That's what the savage gear is for.

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Savage gear is also behind a lockout - a system which punishes you for not doing it with a static by the way.

I've managed to pug most of it each week and still haven't gotten a single drop.

Another system I think needs some refining.

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Originally Posted by Xatsh

I would argue ultimate has flopped, the mass majority of raiders do not even try it.



Issue is they added a fight that takes 100s of hours to clear... and you are rewarded with nothing but a glamour.


If SE adds time killers... and they rewards you with literally nothing but bragging rights and a shinny lvl 1 weapon basically... Then besides the epeen elitest (Which are not the majority of hardcore players) who the hell if going to waste time on them. Would be like a quest line that takes 75hrs to complete and you get a minion as a reward.

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Believe it or not -that's why I prefer this game.

I like that rewards are cosmetic because it makes it feel un-mandatory. You do them for the challenge, bragging rights, and being able to look cool.

It's also quite difficult to appease a crowd that in one breath complains about the lack of end-game content and how quickly it is done, but then complain when a piece of end-game content takes too long.

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Originally Posted by Xatsh

Well think of it this way if they uncapped it and people could complete the entire games content in a week or 2..


That is the point of this thread... there is not enough to do.

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No. Incorrect.

The thread is about the lack of end-game content - content that can only be done on a max level toon, which in this case would be things you can only do at level 80.

There is plenty of content, there is plenty to do.

There isn't much end-game content, which is fine with me, and is something that attracts me to this game in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Avraym

Savage gear is also behind a lockout - a system which punishes you for not doing it with a static by the way.

I've managed to pug most of it each week and still haven't gotten a single drop.

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Which is why they also give tokens, I still don't see why you'd want to remove the tome currency. Currently the hardest content does reward the best gear.

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Originally Posted by Avraym

Savage gear is also behind a lockout - a system which punishes you for not doing it with a static by the way.

I've managed to pug most of it each week and still haven't gotten a single drop.

Another system I think needs some refining.

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It's a false rumor you're being punished for not being in a static. You can win all of the gear in a single run if you're lucky enough, just like everyone else.

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Originally Posted by Nariel

Meh, tomestones are the casual access to sub BiS gear, to get BiS you need to down savage or wait 3 to 4 month the release of the 24 man raid to get one pieces upgrade/week. And even like that you'll never get a BiS weapon or better sub-stat gear you may regard as BiS. I think raider/challenge-eater already have enough exclusive reward.

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You make it sound like Savage is difficult.

460 gear is really powerful considering how easily its handed to you.