Counterpoint to all the Debbie Downers lately...

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Originally Posted by Thenightvortex

Magnai is by no means perfect, but he’s not that bad of a representation. He might be arrogant in some places(although he can back his talk up) and too focused with finding his nhama, but other than that, he’s a strong masculine warlord warrior who commands respect from his people. When it comes to women he’s both very confident and able to take no for an answer. And idk what’s so wrong about finding him attractive disregarding the whole “he’s a half-scalie” thing which never stopped anyone anyway.

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So to your mind, a petulant, egotistical, narcissistic, immature, delusional manchild with a God complex (who actually is often the butt of his people's jokes, if you probe into his backstory) who believes himself entitled to any woman who takes his fancy is not that bad a representation of the average man, and his pathological level of arrogance, veneer of toxic maculinity and that fact he grudgingly allows the women he corners to say no supposedly offsets these flaws?

If that's the case, society's in an even worse state than I thought.

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Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

I suspect some might argue that the same could be applied to Y'shtola

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And I'd agree. Unlike Thancred, Lyse, and Urianger, she's one of the surviving originals who's never really had much of a dramatic arc where we're allowed to know her more deeply or where she's allowed to evolve, and that's a shame.

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Originally Posted by Thenightvortex

Well, mine comes from the game, yours is apparently from some other source, because in no world repeating the word “little…” with an awkward face is a tantrum.

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Mine comes from his characterization in general of being extremely arrogant and powerhungry. Dude literally thinks himself the embodyment of the sun. If he really was as confident as you say he wouldnt have jumped at sadu's throat the second she said something. Magnai was ready to crush some skulls, Sadu simply took his attention away form us to herself because she both wanted to fight and knew how easy it would be to rile up someone so deeply insecure.

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Originally Posted by Lunaxia

So to your mind, a petulant, egotistical, narcissistic, immature, delusional manchild with a God complex (who actually is often the butt of his people's jokes, if you probe into his backstory) who believes himself entitled to any woman who takes his fancy is not that bad a representation of the average man, and his pathological level of arrogance, veneer of toxic maculinity and that fact he grudgingly allows the women he corners to say no supposedly offsets these flaws?

If that's the case, society's in an even worse state than I thought.

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Why are you derailing the topic? We’re talking about Magnai, not this unrelated dude you’re describing.

But on a serious note, yes, arrogance is indeed, a character flaw which is why I’m saying he’s not perfect, although you overplay it with the “god complex” accusations, it’s nowhere near those levels. And no, him searching for him nhama and asking women out in a confident way is not a flaw. He’s a tribal warlord, for God’s sake, and still acting rather gentlemanly for this status. If he truly believed himself entitled and didn’t care for what others think, he wouldn’t have asked those women at all. As for the “toxic masculinity”…I see this term used far too often to denigrate masculinity and masculine men in general, so I usually see it as a compliment when characters get accused of it. I’d take a man like Magnai over the likes of Alphinaud or post-5.3 G’raha any time of the day.

Well, Alphinaud isn't a man, first of all. I should hope no adult present would choose him.

But anyway, I pick Aymeric. (灬♥ω♥灬) Or maybe Hien...

My personal first pick would be someone garlean. Varis, Regula, Gaius, all good candidates.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Given how it's infected quite a lot of the franchises and media and I enjoy, yes. In any case if someone agrees or disagrees with my positions that is no one's business but theirs. People need to learn to write better stories and better characters.

I will continue advocating for stuff along the lines of Estinien/Ysayle or Jill/Clive dynamics while the little sun scene enjoyers are free to do the same. From my perspective its as if Lizzo was asked out by someone at Brad Pitt levels of conventional attractiveness and then she proceeded to pull a yas queen slay moment on him. Miss me with this.

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https://i.imgur.com/TVUpqPM.gif

"I dont know OP I feel we need about 3 more negative threads before we start labeling as such."



Unironically the people who criticized other media outlets for being echo chambers of toxic positivity has now turned the official forums into an echo chamber for toxic negativity. Theres never a healthy in-between with this community which is sad.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Certainly never stopped the people who apparently find Y'shtola attractive. They also have a bad habit of headcanoning personality traits onto her she doesn't seem to have in order to flesh out her nonexistent character.

I'd much rather see heroines that actually undergo growth and do more than just provide lore expositions.

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The irony of you complaining about poorly-written characters when your own perceived pinnacle of character development is hackneyed stereotypes of genteel, feminine princess types with flowing hair and pretty dresses and buff knights with beards who so enamour everyone with their raw masculinity that no one dares mock or criticism them. Effectively walking masses of tired and archaic tropes drenched in soft misogyny and more flat and underdeveloped than the paper they're written on.

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Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

I suspect some might argue that the same could be applied to Y'shtola

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The thing is, issues like Y'shtola's writing can never properly be discussed under such circumstances because they're not truly the matter at hand. While aforementioned posters may occasionally veil it in more respectable concerns like that of her being two dimensional or bland, the truth is, what they're actually complaining about is the crime of 1) a woman daring to be outspoken against a manly man man and 2) her not being perceived as hot enough to attempt to justify it. Sexist nonsense, but for some reason, others choose not to see it and steadfastly maintain he has some sort of genuine point to be made.

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Originally Posted by Thenightvortex

genuinely concerning

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O43CfuqryF0

"A god complex: An unshakable belief characterized by consistently inflated feelings of personal ability, privilege, or infallibility." It's the entire basis of his personality, and I'm a little flummoxed as to what you would consider a God complex, if not that.

And when "but he could force his attentions on them!" is your best line of defence for a character, and claim to find toxic masculinity and all the misery, violence and control it engenders a compliment, perhaps it's time to rethink your argument And possibly yourself. And your life. Preferably far away from me.

Oh are we discussing Magnai? The guy who essentially had women kidnapped in attempt to find his "soulmate" and then made one of them cry because she was terrified? Yes that's such a good representation of men /sarcasm.