The trouble with telling tanks W2W pulls are a mandatory norm.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

The first big pull after the second boss in Hells' Lid could be kinda spicy if you weren't ready for it.

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I'd add that I saw various parties stumble and wipe on the giant wall-to-wall between the second and final bosses of Anamnesis Anyder when it was the current level 80 dungeon, too.

This is why I liked Anamnesis Anyder.. made people slow down an appreciate the dungeon and the design.. with players having to wait for the single group mobs to come to them...

Plus it was funny seeing all the gotta go fast crowd screaming like little children because they had to wait in a dungeon instead of blitzing it

The dance-offs while waiting for Bismark to land at the beginning were always great.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

The dance-offs while waiting for Bismark to land at the beginning were always great.

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I still always quip "Thank you for choosing Uber; please remember to tip and review your whale." at that point on those rare occasions that level 80 roulette dumps me into there.

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Originally Posted by Flashock

As a new player,(ex wow) currently lvl 70 PLD, I was quite curious what the tanking meta would be.

My initial question was, how does the community react to kite tanking. Will they be upset if I pull mobs out of their ground aoe.

I then realized it’s not kiting per-say, it’s called Wall to Wall.

That being said, if it’s my first time in a dungeon, I simply don’t know when the next wall will be, where the packs are, or if any packs spawn randomly.

I do try to go as fast as the group allows though and pull multiple packs when I can.

Looking forward to learning the dungeons better so that I can start doing wall to wall.

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What is important to remember when coming from other MMOs is that FFXIV has:
* Long global cooldown - so doing chain pulling e.g. starting to move to next pack when current one is almost dead is bad, DPS will hate you as they will try to do skills only to get them interrupted
* Melee positionals - bosses should not be rotated if not needed. If you have to rotate for mechanics then best approach is keep the boss in new position if he will rotate himself soon for another mech otherwise face him north away from party again.
* Some player AoE skills are cones, so the more tightly packed the mobs the better and if possible they should not be dragged too much when dodging aoes.
* AoE skills are guaranted to reach optimal efficiency for all jobs at 5+ mobs which usually means at least two packs of trash

Honestly my main complaint with this really is tanks that can't make their minds up.
Like they're unsure if they're going to do a big pull or not, then I put down Doton or pop CD's and they start sprinting.

Tanks just jumping in and causing me to enter combat before I have a chance to do/ refresh Huiton and Hide is also annoying altho that's mainly a thing in raids and trials.
But yeah make up your minds.
Often times they'll pull then stand there for like 5-10 seconds and then decide that they want to pull another pack.

I have quite a lot of alts so of course I end up masquerading as a sprout because that tag is character based not account based.

Many times I have done a dungeon and right away the tank went insane with massive pulls. These tanks can be very difficult to keep alive but I can handle it because I am far from being a novice healer. However the tank does not know this. I have a sprout icon next to my name. I look like a new player. And yet they instantly pull as if I'm not a sprout and have my full job kit to work with. Worse again when both the dps are also sprouts and their dps isn't as good as someone more experienced with the game so mana can become an issue due to the length of combat.

I never commend these tanks because I know an actual sprout healer would have found them horrible to heal if not impossible due to their lack of experience. I'm not saying never chain pull, but if you have a sprout healer with you take it easy on the first pull, see how they play, and from there you can decide whether to pull more or not. A lot of players are turned off by healing because they end up with tanks who expect them to play like an experienced player when they're still new to the role.

One of the problems with healing is you can't smash a dummy to prepare yourself for content. The only way to learn how to heal is to be in a party that takes damage. So it's very discouraging for novice healers when the tank forces them into a very high pressure environment when they don't have enough experience to draw from to deal with it. And often even if they do successfully heal without any deaths they found it so stressful they are slow to heal again. I have seen this happen so many times in both WoW and FF. So many players who would be amazing healers drop the role because tanks demanded a level of performance far beyond their current experience. Sure players can only improve if they are challenged, but there comes a point in which the degree of difficulty they're faced with does more harm than good.

So again I say; if you're a tank and your healer is a sprout just take it easy on the first pull. See how well they handle it and from there decide how you should pull. If you want more healers in the game don't put the sprouts through hell.

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Originally Posted by EnigmaticDodo

So, with the exception of a handful of dungeons;

- Aurum Vale (just the first room)
- Brayflox Longstop (just a ton of adds here)
- Stone Vigil (You just get hit hard as hell)
- Dzemael Darkhold (After first boss)
- Bardams Mettle (First Pull, Bird Pull, but this can be done still)
- Doma Castle (First Pull if you wall to wall; if you wall to wall after the first boss)
- Holminster Switch (get hit hard as hell)
- Mount Gulg (if you do the champion pulls)

(I may have missed one or two situations/dungeons here. You also can overcome some of these situations if you have a competent team)

You can wall to wall pull in this game. Full stop. I don't really understand why folks wanna sit here and tell people otherwise. Oh man, 8 out of 77 dungeons you cant do this in! We might as well make everyone stop!

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[passive aggressive post that not-so-subtly insults you by pointing out your 'superiority' over the 'common' folk and shows the true face of the poster]

now that we have that out of the way:
you can w2w brayflox as well unless you try to pick the full room, while the dzemael and mt gulg pull are definitely possible but require a decent, somewhat coordinated group

I've been healing Wall-to-Wall pulls when the dungeons were both new and old since 2.4 when I joined. It's possible, even if the tank's gear is not great. As a tank, you're still pressing the same buttons, you're just doing more damage. You're just wasting time in a dungeon by not doing this.

This is pretty much of a case of needing to improve at your job, healer, tank and DPS.

Nice to see the forum superstars are still popping in to tell us all we need to get gud.

Meanwhile in the real world of DF.......