Summoners useless in 24mans?

Seriously, this oversight is impossible and people are freaking out for no reason. SE hasn't said anything, and everything everyone here is saying is just jumping the gun a bit too much. Try this, relax a bit and maybe not worry so much about a video game. Life will go on, you'll get your DoTs.

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Originally Posted by Rage89

psssst bards rely heavily on dots for dps to so your arguement is.... VALID lol. but ya mostly smn/bard/blm will be effected by a drop in dps if 30 debuffs on the foe. however this is a 24 man RAID. use organization to prioritize certain dots and count them out telling which classes can use which debuffs and just dont take all summoners for dps.

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Monks will generally have 3 dots and 1 debuff on the boss. Debuff increases their damage. War has a similar debuff... Drg has a similar Debuff.

This is an all classes problem.

Yep this is a pretty big problem. The vast majority of a SMNs damage comes from dots, without them its easily the worst dps class in the game, and probably worse than tank dps. Each summoner has quite a few dots aswell (Bio, Bio 2, Miasma, Miasma 2 [sometimes], thunder, and Ifrits DOT if you use him. Thats not to mention Virus (which takes 2 slots) and eye for an eye which are great utility. Unless they raise the cap for 24 mans SMNs wont be desired because theyll essentially be useless.

Oh well if they dont fix it at least my BLM is leveled and geared

Maybe the restriction will be lifted for Crystal Tower? Wishful thinking I know, and knowing SE they will probably drop the ball on this and say "Working as intended..."

Yes this is a raise for concern.

Each class has roughly 3 (some more, some less.. Average is 3) debuffs that should be on a boss as often as possible.

3x 24 = 72.

Nope, not enough of a cap currently.

Again, and I must stress this. I want to see evidence of the accusation that the 30 Debuff limit is not a display limitation. So far, I have seen none provided and this entire scare is done off of stipulation that's not even factually there.

In parties, when viewing the party list, it is possible to see that buffs/debuffs exist on the player that are not shown in the party list due to display limitations. Clicking on the character individually indicates that the buffs are actually there and simply not displayed due to prioritizing.

Once the adjustments in which the debuffs you provide are prioritized at the beginning of the list come into effect we can start factually verifying if this is actually a concern or not, as we will get a visiual indication on whether or not our particular debuffs are being prematurely canceled or outright prevented due to an actual cap of number of debuffs.

A more factual problem, which is more of a design issue, is the concept of monsters being mass damaged by too many spike damage sources for DoT skills to deal the full of their damage, which would effect SMN's usefulness due to not being a short-term burst class - however this has more to do with encounter design, not system mechanics.

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Originally Posted by Hyrist

Again, and I must stress this. I want to see evidence of the accusation that the 30 Debuff limit is not a display limitation. So far, I have seen none provided and this entire scare is done off of stipulation that's not even factually there.

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You want evidence? go fight Odin, even while playing Dragoon I have an immense amount of difficulty stacking my debuff effects, I know they are not applying because otherwise disembowel would be giving me extra damage on my attacks but the debuff gets cancelled from the 30 effect limit, you have a level 50 dragoon yourself by the looks of it so go try it out

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Originally Posted by BeserkFury

You want evidence? go fight Odin,-SNIP-

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Hm. There's a problem with this theory. Positioning in any major fate is a problem, and the explanation on your additional damage can be simply that you're out of position and your game has not caught up due to lag or simply not having him visible. Additionally, you are not the only Dragoon on the field. Disembowel could have been applied before you even engaged, meaning you were always operating at the additional damage and your personal disembowel has been overlapped by someone else's.

Testing this as it specifically applies to the argued concept, the effectiveness of a Summoner - in which case the update will properly apply any testing we may be concerned within the subject in question and a more controlled environment.

I did not know this I was wondering why my stuff wasn't doing anything on Svara from time to time the last two days during fates.

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Originally Posted by Eight

I did not know this I was wondering why my stuff wasn't doing anything on Svara from time to time the last two days during fates.

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Again, I'm disputing this as a display issue, not an actual cap issue. We have examples of display issues in the party system. So far the only attempted evidence provided on this concern was Disembowel - a debuff in which only one instance of it can exist on the monster at a time anyways and can be quickly and constantly overwritten by subsequent dragoons.

In the coming patch, they are organizing it so that your own debuffs will always be listed to the furthest left on the existing Debuff list. After this point, we can test it in a popular NM fate and properly affirm/debunk this speculated issue.