Oh I do have a issue with the instantustions in place and how they often take the path of least resistance when it comes to these issues.
That being said I still stand by people often given children far too much protection because their minds are not fully developed and lack the experience required to think of the long term. Cause that logic does not follow even for adults that meet the same criteria. Some adults for whatever reason may not have the social experience / intelligence to navigate or understand the signs that someone else may be able to see. Adults always get the wrap they should have know they child was the victim in all this.
In the end maybe it is because I am the spectrum or it was because my parents were older they had me in their 50's. I can say for certain when I did something I understood the potential long term consequences I often did not just care cause I knew more often then not I would either get away with it or I could just ask for forgiveness instead of permission depending on how I spinned it.
People straight up do not give children enough credit when it comes to their thought process into making decisions. I get we have juvy. Though I am sorry if a teenager or anyone falsely misleads someone or whatever and the sets out to ruin their life when things do not pan out the way they wanted are scum and action depending on the context it should hold the same weight as murder.
Though I get it protect the children, parents are busy cannot be around their kids 24 / 7, often parents give their kids the benefit of the doubt etc . . .
To me really comes down if someone wants to act like an adult in one moment bet. Just do not try and play the child card I did not know when things go south. Own up to your choices. Also the brain development thing I find issue since aren't are brains nor fully developed until 25 or something?
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03-09-2021, 03:51 AMAwha
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03-09-2021, 04:15 AMMilkieTeaYes, our brains aren't fully developed until 25. Males develop at a slower pace, and the last thing to develop is the frontal cortex, which is responsible for memory, emotions, impulse control, problem solving, social interaction, and motor function.Quote:
Originally Posted by Awha
I'm also on the spectrum, I also could reasonably think ahead of my actions, but I didn't think about my actions as they'd affect others, as they'd interact with actions in my far future, and how they'd interact with the actions and lives of others in the future. It is EXTREMELY HARD for teens and young adults to do so - though not entirely impossible.
Teens want to be adults, that's a fact. But they have no idea what being an adult is like. Things they do CAN HAVE IMPACTS MENTALLY they wouldn't have for us as adults.\
tl;dr: teen brain still young, teens are not adults, teens do not have same problem solving/social interaction/emotions/impulse control as adults. -
03-09-2021, 05:28 AMAwha
Still does not follow if we use the same criteria. End of the day the same protections are not in place for adults that meet the same social and emotional intelligence and experience as a teenager. So clearly the development of the brain is not the factor and more so has to deal with tge social normative connotation that is associated with being a child. Which in turns gives children the means to manipulate others without much worry for their actions.
Everything you stated can be just as plausible for some adults so why not give them also the benefit of the doubt? If we want to provide child the same protections due to lack of experience problem solving etc. . . then we should offer the same protections to adults though I do get people will say that leaves it open to exploitation and abuse.
Once again Which is possible for children to do the same thing with the current situation. In the end let us be real no matter the age most do not care to take the time to think how their actions will impact others. We had an entire year grown ass adults doing just that. Though children get a pass. Do not get me wrong certain things I can let slide, Though actions that have the potential to ruin the life of another should be weighted differently. We as a society need to show that such actions are excusable no matter the age or reason. -
03-09-2021, 06:12 AMLianaThorneWrong. I did a lot of fucked up stuff when I was younger because I genuinely didn't care and wanted to hurt my parents because I felt like I was being trapped by their rules. I was full blown dumpster fire bad. Like, it's literally a miracle I'm not dead from what I did to myself because I thought it was cool and would get me noticed by guys or whatever other reasons I had.Quote:
Originally Posted by Awha
Now that I am almost 10 years older than I was then, I'm able to look back on my actions and realize how incredibly selfish and horrific I was to the people I love. I have matured enough, learned enough and grew enough as a person to know that doing what I did was wrong and that I could never ever do that again because it makes me sick to think about.
There's a massive difference between doing something stupid as a teen and doing something stupid as an adult. I'm sorry but no matter what was you try to spin it, you can't compare minors to adults mentally. You can't psychologically and you can't medically. Saying they should know better is all well and good, but someone can't know better until they or someone around them makes the mistake first. That's how you learn. -
03-09-2021, 06:41 AMAwhaThat is the thing as you said you did not care how your actions impacted others, adults also do not care about how the actions impact others age is not really the only factor here. Sure mistakes are how we learn, but I am sorry if your mistake ends up running the life of someone else I do not care how sorry or how ignorant you are were. You should face a harsh punishment for said action. Somethings simply should not be waved away because of I am a child tho, I did not know tho, I did not understand how my actions would impact others tho, I did not care tho. Those are horrible excuses.Quote:
Originally Posted by LianaThorne
Certain actions we can move past and let them learn, but others DUI's, false allegations, murder etc . . . I do not care if you are a child you done messed up and you should pay a fitting price cause the person that life was negatively impacted by your actions may not get a second chance. I am sorry I do not get why should the child or teenager in question get the benefit of the doubt cause they do not have the social experience or social intellenge to the average adult to make proper choice and understand the lasting impact it will have on others.
Yet adults that also do not have the same understanding when it comes to social queues or understanding are still treated as if they should know better? Many factors can impact development not just age, so why is age the only factor that seems to matter to so many? Do not get me wrong I do not think either one is an excuse, but if we are going to draw a line I wish people would be more consistent with their view. I get the child protection aspect musters up a strong emotional response people generally want to protect and persevere children giving them room to grow and learn which is fine. Though actions should be inexcusable and pretending to be an adult then spinning it in your favor to get the adults in trouble cause they should have know is honestly silly. We should not protect people like that.
I will agree In certain situations doing something dumb as a kid differs from an adult. Though if that dumb action leads to lasting negative impact on the life on another I am sorry if you are a child you should not get lighter punishment or general understanding because of your age. I know many will not agree with it, but sometimes the action itself should overshadow the age.
Also I have issue with kids will be kids statement that some people have, cause I was made fun of due to my mannerisms and speech patterns due to degree of ASD. Always got the same excuse kids will be kids, suck it up you will grow out of it. Kids can be just as ruthless and cold as adults, yet because they are kids it kinda gets a pass. I am sorry it hurts either way no matter the age. Sometimes I want to drop kick a kid because they laugh at my tick in the store or stare at me just like others use to do when I was a their age. I do not cause I am older, and even when you kindly ask their parents if they could educate their children they look at you like you are the creep. This is a deep personal issue for me cause I think people should be held accountable for their actions no matter the age. Since I do think this aspect of protecting such behavior cares over to when the children become adults, then have children of their own. They use the same logic I was like that as a kid I grew up and understood how my actions were wrong years later. Thing is a person you may be able to go home forget about it and come to terms with it years later. The pain for the person in questions sometimes never goes away cause they are reminded of it daily. -
03-09-2021, 06:43 AMMilkieTeaTeens, on a whole, do not have the CAPACITY to care for how their interactions impact others, is the difference you're failing to realize. Adults have the capacity, teens don't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Awha
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03-09-2021, 06:59 AMAwhaIf an adult has the social intelligence of a child in terms of social norms that is their capacity. Many factors go into brain development and certain aspects cane be stunted by environmental or lack of certain social interactions without impacting other factors of development. Capacity is a weird standard to go based off since many factors go into capacity for an action.Quote:
Originally Posted by MilkieTea
Also some teens do have capacity to understand how their actions impact others, so clearly age is primary factor here. Now if you are trying to say it harder for teens to empathize with another persons situation and this leads to discontent between actions I can agree with that, though same could also be said for adults. Every criteria mentioned can be sad for adults minus age. Though age is clearly not 100% factor cause we have children that understand how their actions impact others. -
03-09-2021, 07:00 AMMilkieTeaAnd under the law there are exceptions for this, dependent on where you are. However, I don't see why you're bringing this up when that wasn't what you were talking about before.Quote:
Originally Posted by Awha
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03-09-2021, 07:15 AMLianaThorneI'm just gonna go out on a limb here and state the obvious that we aren't going to see eye to eye. Your bias is driven by specific circumstances and your choosing to fixate on those circumstances rather than the issue as a whole, which is what I'm arguing with because that's what is relevant with this situation. To be honest this has gotten pretty far off topic in the grand scheme of things. All I'm going to say is that (and this is probably a hard pill to swallow) the law (in cases with adults being accused of stuff with minors) only cares about age and will take the side of the child unless legitimate proof can be proven otherwise that it didn't happen. That is literally all that is relevant. Specific circumstances are all well and good and potentially can be treated differently depending on the case/judge/etc., but the biggest factor is going to be age and if the adult can prove without a doubt that they did not do it. Be pissed at it all you want, it literally does not matter and won't change.Quote:
Originally Posted by Awha
I'm calling it quits on this topic unless someone decides to quote me. I'm tired of beating my head against a brick wall. -
03-09-2021, 07:15 AMAwhaI am bringing it up cause by most peoples standards an adult is an adult. Which prob stems from the fact that most do not see a difference between emotional intelligence and general intelligence. Most laws offer protections for general intelligence deficiencies.Quote:
Originally Posted by MilkieTea
I am just showing every reason that you have offered as to why we should treat children differently can be attributed to an adult. Age and every correlated with age standardly seems to be primary factor as to why such protections are offered. Though age is not a consistent standard, so if you are willing to grant that adults that meet the same standard you listed above as to why children have protections then cool.
I still disagree I think no matter the context if someone does something that has a lasting negative impact on their life they should face an extremely harsh punishment.
Oh I agree 100% the law only cares about the age that is my problem since age is not a consistent factor yet it is treated as such due to the nature of it being easy to tie a number to something. Oh I also know nothing will change it is how we are but still makes for fun discussions. Given the text it may seem like I am pissed, I am not pissed. Annoyed how generally everyone takes the path of least resistance on such topics, but not pissed. I just enjoy talking with others who have differing views even if it will not change anything that is how I gain understanding to the general world around me.Quote:
Originally Posted by LianaThorne