[6.0 - 6.4 Spoilers] An interesting video detailing Venat's polarizing reception

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Oh yes none of our in game screenshots support our side. Gee guess the videos with literal in game cutscenes supporting our points don’t exist or don’t count. It’s not just that they’ve said it and i believe them. I’ve seen the screenshots of evidence. I’ve seen the actual posts lol. It’s not hard to find whatsoever especially when said person literally uses our names in the posts itself.

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The hour long video is full of bias and was made in bad faith. Someone in this thread already explained to you why that was so I don't feel the need to repeat it. Again, when you twist and or leave out things that give a bigger context to what is being said is no different from lying. Elidabus as a character was fond of doing that. Kinda the reason he was my favorite among the three unsundered.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Many of those people have posted in this very thread. It's always been a very small number of them and they tend to show up every time the subject comes up saying the same things and round and round the circle goes. People saying you're wrong when you forget key moments is just how it is. Nothing to be hurt over Unless you believe one can have an opinion about a fact. You're perfectly allowed to believe that she didn't do enough, that's an opinion to have. However most of you don't voice it that way. They say she did nothing. Which just isn't true.

They are derailing threads you don't show up in a thread about say. what happened in Ultima Thule and go on and on about Venat. That's not on topic so no, probably keep to the topic of the thread and don't change it. This happens across multiple sites and it's always the Venat dislikers that do it From what I and many people in this thread can attest to. I've yet to see the side you claim there is.

Most people would use that word for a handful of people with a strong opinion about an event in a game millions have played. Call it polarizing on these specific forums, sure but in the wider community? Not at all.
Words have meaning, context does as well.

@above. I've been through the thread the some guy saying that the person said something along those lines in a completely different thread or where ever it was said isn't proof of anything. They just said it and you believe them I guess. From what I've seen none of your in game screenshots support your side and again, you leave out the other stuff that disproves your side. Hence why people say you make stuff up. Lies by omission they're called.

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This can be said to both side of the argument. Only a small portion of the player base even talk in the Lore forum and with reddit it the only place where you can have a serious public discussion about the topic. It hard to say ''Oh well the majority of people liked this'' when the majority of the player don't pay that much attention to the lore or just don't care that much.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Many of those people have posted in this very thread. It's always been a very small number of them and they tend to show up every time the subject comes up saying the same things and round and round the circle goes. People saying you're wrong when you forget key moments is just how it is. Nothing to be hurt over Unless you believe one can have an opinion about a fact. You're perfectly allowed to believe that she didn't do enough, that's an opinion to have. However most of you don't voice it that way. They say she did nothing. Which just isn't true.

They are derailing threads you don't show up in a thread about say. what happened in Ultima Thule and go on and on about Venat. That's not on topic so no, probably keep to the topic of the thread and don't change it. This happens across multiple sites and it's always the Venat dislikers that do it From what I and many people in this thread can attest to. I've yet to see the side you claim there is.

Most people would use that word for a handful of people with a strong opinion about an event in a game millions have played. Call it polarizing on these specific forums, sure but in the wider community? Not at all.
Words have meaning, context does as well.

@above. I've been through the thread the some guy saying that the person said something along those lines in a completely different thread or where ever it was said isn't proof of anything. They just said it and you believe them I guess. From what I've seen none of your in game screenshots support your side and again, you leave out the other stuff that disproves your side. Hence why people say you make stuff up. Lies by omission they're called.

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As someone who does check on stuff on social media for stuff like my Island Sanctuary workshops I will say the fandom in general is terrible about dragging ANY topic off course. Go post a fanart of Zenos/Emet/Hermes/Lyse/Minfillia on reddit and see how quickly "Cool art still a *insert negative descriptor here* character" happens on almost all of them. Let's not even start on if you pick something halfway meme-able as that descends quickly to whatever meme on any social media. That is just the way large fandoms are honestly. Again I am not trying to be in any way combative just making an observation as someone who has watched this community grow on the sidelines from HW onwards that as a community grows more discordance comes with it.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

The hour long video is full of bias and was made in bad faith. Someone in this thread already explained to you why that was so I don't feel the need to repeat it. Again, when you twist and or leave out things that give a bigger context to what is being said is no different from lying. Elidabus as a character was fond of doing that. Kinda the reason he was my favorite among the three unsundered.

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Bad faith. Quite a popular term you and others like to throw around when you merely disagree with something or someone that has you on the ropes. It's kind of sad imo that instead of being able to have an open debate about something you and your ilk just flail around screaming "bad faith bad faith bad faith!" Its a bit funny to me too because it stifles discussion to simply equate discussions to that, yet you're the ones who go around saying *we're* the ones doing it. Quite telling honestly.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Bad faith. Quite a popular term you and others like to throw around when you merely disagree with something or someone that has you on the ropes. It's kind of sad imo that instead of being able to have an open debate about something you and your ilk just flail around screaming "bad faith bad faith bad faith!" Its a bit funny to me too because it stifles discussion to simply equate discussions to that, yet you're the ones who go around saying *we're* the ones doing it. Quite telling honestly.

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Both sides throw the bad faith flag. Also why are you trying to start fights? Why the rude replies even? There's no reason for the use of "you and your ilk". Seriously the person this argument you've started over wasn't even commenting on the main topic. They might have muddied the waters as you call it and yet here you are doing the same and derailing the thread even more. I'm fairly certain we all know why another poster is sensitive about the person who posted the video. Or at least those who remember details they let slip in another thread a long time ago. Anyway I'm fairly certain people have used the same evidence to claim the opposite considering said topic. I also am fairly certain that if the point of the video was to change anyone here's mind said poster would have a better chance at winning the powerball than doing such.

I see constantly accusations of "bad faith" and "bias" getting thrown around when all I see being done is people stating things as they are and quoting the story/interviews.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

Both sides throw the bad faith flag. Also why are you trying to start fights? Why the rude replies even? There's no reason for the use of "you and your ilk". Seriously the person this argument you've started over wasn't even commenting on the main topic. They might have muddied the waters as you call it and yet here you are doing the same and derailing the thread even more. I'm fairly certain we all know why another poster is sensitive about the person who posted the video. Or at least those who remember details they let slip in another thread a long time ago. Anyway I'm fairly certain people have used the same evidence to claim the opposite considering said topic. I also am fairly certain that if the point of the video was to change anyone here's mind said poster would have a better chance at winning the powerball than doing such.

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Sanna, please. You always come to rush to the defense of these people time and time again purely because you agree with them despite them constantly insulting and talking down to others, i’m merely calling it out. The fact the poster i was speaking to tried to say the video was done in bad faith when it’s literally videos talking about in game events is beyond ridiculous.

Not only is it ridiculous but it also downplays the time and effort put into the video. Him and yes, his ilk aka the people who have insulted us nonstop here and on other platforms keep trying to accuse the videos viewers and subscribers of being “puppets.” I will say however all in all they have been successful. Countless people have come forward thanking the poster for the videos, giving them an actual sage space to speak(because it’s obviously not safe here) and for actually being willing to call out horrible writing.

Hundreds of subscribers,likes,and views based on something that supposedly isn’t “polarizing.” The fact of the matter is they’re scrambling to find inaccurate reasons as to why the videos are getting the traffic they are and why more and more people are coming out of the woodwork to question Venat’s actions and the actions of the writers. So i’d suggest you truly take some time to understand what’s been said or done on both sides before quickly coming to the defense of them, especially with the things they’ve said and done being associated with them isn’t it.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

I see constantly accusations of "bad faith" and "bias" getting thrown around when all I see being done is people stating things as they are and quoting the story/interviews.

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Till you watch the video and hear things like "I wish we got to see how Elidbus tried to mediate. But he has agency and you can't have anyone like that around Venat." I'm paraphrasing that as I'm not going back to watch the that section but it happens right near the beginning of the third sacrifice sections in the time stamps So yea the video isn't acting in good faith and I'm sure there are plenty more lines in it's hour long run time since this entire argument is basically boils down to like 3 cutscenes within the game.

Acting in bad faith is a pretty reasonable thing to do. There's a difference between not liking the direction something took and giving criticism about it and lines like that. Both sides throw it around but only one makes it really easy to tell.

@above I've not insulted you So maybe don't go trying to bite my head off for no reason, please? You claim this person is running to my defense and really that's kinda what you're doing. Pretty much anytime the topic of Venat comes up and you'll be there within minutes of the poster saying her name and talking about this stuff. Your nothing if not consistent. The video also has like 4k views and its about a topic that's going on 2 years old. I suppose this just makes your side's job easier somebody arranged all your points that were disproven, and argued to death already two years ago out into a nice little format that I'd imagine nobody on twitter or reddit is gonna watch when you derail another thread to talk about this stuff.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

@above I've not insulted you So maybe don't go trying to bite my head off for no reason, please? You claim this person is running to my defense and really that's kinda what you're doing. Pretty much anytime the topic of Venat comes up and you'll be there within minutes of the poster saying her name and talking about this stuff. Your nothing if not consistent. The video also has like 4k views and its about a topic that's going on 2 years old. I suppose this just makes your side's job easier somebody arranged all your points that were disproven, and argued to death already two years ago out into a nice little format that I'd imagine nobody on twitter or reddit is gonna watch when you derail another thread to talk about this stuff.

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Right, anytime ill be there. Wow its totally not like ive literally been unsubbed for the past year and a half and obviously havent been able to post on here. But sure yes ive immediately come rushing everytime someone posts something on here, i just circumvented the forum rules of not being able to post while unsubbed. Also funny how you act like im the only one that comes rushing in, when theres specific pro-venat ones that do the same. Again, this is the bias im talking about with you and Sanna.

I will say though again, its sad to see you try so hard to downplay the video when really i know it makes you all seethe, seeing all those comments of people agreeing and calling the character out for what she is. Also...not really sure how this is derailing when this thread is literally about a video calling out Venat's actions. You really do try so hard to silence people and stifle discussion its outright pathetic.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

The hour long video is full of bias and was made in bad faith. Someone in this thread already explained to you why that was so I don't feel the need to repeat it. Again, when you twist and or leave out things that give a bigger context to what is being said is no different from lying. Elidabus as a character was fond of doing that. Kinda the reason he was my favorite among the three unsundered.

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True, there's simply massive bias and deliberately false interpretations of the story going on in the video, for example at 48:56 where she mentions Venat never even mentioning her plans when she clearly did at the end of Elpis?!!? How can you be so dishonest and just pull stuff out of your butt? If you wanna criticize something you have to actually deal with the matter at hand rather than making stuff up or ignoring what was said and deliberately misrepresenting it!

I'm glad we can just ignore the video. It's just a minority opinion anyway and minorities don't matter.