Pretty much. Every expansion that focused on the top end failed hard after Wrath. TBC still did fine despite being top heavy because it was still the most casual game on the market. Didn’t mean that 90% of the endgame was only ever seen by 1% of the players though. Every time they tried to cater to top players after Wrath failed. Cataclysm, WoD, BfA, Shadowlands… No one wanted to go back to overtuned heroic dungeons. I quit Cata after the first couple weeks of those idiotic heroic dungeons. I didn’t want to slog through Burning Crusade nonsense again. Didn’t have the time or patience for that crap. As for BFA forward? Yeah, not gonna do a Mythic+ 15 with some toxic windbag yelling at everyone just to get the gear I need. Thanks, but no thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kes13a
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03-01-2022, 07:23 AMRoflcopter
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03-01-2022, 07:31 AMRoflcopter
Everquest was far harder and more unforgiving than WoW, but it never had that toxic angle to it. We all struggled together. Even early WoW felt that way. Eventually, it became an ordeal of dealing with the ego of other players and they felt entitled to abuse everyone else. Blizzard just fed into it and encouraged the behavior.
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03-01-2022, 07:34 AMConundrumPeople know you're a troll because all you do is post intentionally controversial topics to annoy others.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiros
No one buys the doe eyed innocent act you pull. -
03-01-2022, 07:37 AMZephyrMenodoraAre they all you, having matured over the years so I don't find you unhinged right now? lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Skiros
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03-01-2022, 07:39 AMRoflcopterI’m sure his next username will be doucheknuckle6969. Seems to be his maturity level.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora
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03-01-2022, 07:48 AMSieyaMI was playing EverQuest when WoW launched and I remember most everyone that played thinking WoW was just EQ for people the couldn't hack it in game. I mean WoW had already drawn maps and quest markers, talk about handing it to the players. Also who remembers having to travel by boat, not loading in fast enough and getting dropped into the ocean when it crossed a zone line? The atmosphere of EQ though was more of a group effort and led more to helping others get up to speed and knowledgeable rather than the environment WoW seems to have leaned into where it is all about proving yourself better than others.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roflcopter
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03-01-2022, 07:54 AMAnvaireI've played since ARR beta... does that make my opinion more valid than yours?Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiros
In all seriousness, WOW and FFXIV have very different design approaches. I think FF's strength is that you can take a break for a couple of patches, come back and have decent means to catching up. All this casual, hardcore, and midcore stuff is just pointless labelling. The harder the content the less the player uptake and conversely the easier the content the larger portion. I really think we give these terms to content, but in reality it is just content and has a key audience in mind. hardcore raiders get Ultimate, but casual to mid get almost everything else. Take Bozja as an example. On the whole it is very casual friendly. But it also has content for mid-high players with the duels and Delubrum avage raids.
At the end of the day the key difference is that FF respects the players time, it does not make it mandatory to play every day. If you take a break its very easy to catch upand the longest "grind" in catch up would be MSQ. But that is only due to time spent playing through the story. With wow if you take 3 months off, you pretty much will struggle to raid unless you spend a lot of time farming and playing catch up. I think that is the difference.
Personally i dont think it is healthy to compete one against the other anyway. Both have good points, both have bad points and just because FF is moving to a more easy job rotation o make it more accessibile, does not mean the game is dying. I will always feel for those who are dissatisfied, but making jobs simpler does make it more accessible, does mean that with effort people can improve. Thats not to say they always get it right, they don't. But the beauty of a mmo is it is always organically changing. So even if the job is terrible for someone to play, at some point it will always be adjusted. -
03-01-2022, 07:57 AMRoflcopterWow has morphed to the expectation that everyone has mastered the content even before it is released. I mean they made a meme of expecting the heroic achievement for an invite to a day 1 normal raid, but that isn’t far from the truth.Quote:
Originally Posted by SieyaM
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03-01-2022, 07:57 AMShougunNot EQ but I remember missing a boat in FFXI and arriving to the party location like 30 minutes late because of it. . . . . Part of my brain is like "what good times" and the other part is trying to beat it up "YOU FOOL!". lol. I personally like the idea of trying to bridge the ease with the old-school-cool discovery and role play concepts. Like I think traveling is an important aspect of gameplay, but at no point would I be wanting people having to constantly do double digit marches on repeat. There has to be systems on systems to ensure an active cadence, and I do appreciate the drop in and drop out nature too (which I can understand is a preference and not a be all end all opinion).Quote:
Originally Posted by SieyaM
Where you might say you're constantly putting up large problems but then also offering QoL / solutions to them not too long afterwards to quell them before they go from novel to absolutely irritating. Just since it's a recent example, say in Elden Ring they have loads of teleports but the mount is so fast and so fun that honestly you don't really need to use it all that often unless the journey is a huge distance. One thing I feel FFXIV could have done better is making 'movement' itself more fun, but that's time for another post lol.
Never had it happen to me at level 75, but there was a time in that dang jungle where I deleveled a few times..... I couldn't let my party wipe when someone linked but benediction was always pull the entire zone on you button lol. -
03-01-2022, 07:58 AMLily_Skye
wow died because no catgirl or lizardgirl race