Please continue bringing up AST and SCH issues.

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Originally Posted by Miziliti

I do hope they know about whole healer role situation. The question is how fast they gonna respond. My tank queue are getting worst during off peak time that's not midnight.

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I suspect they are aware of the discontent (though an acknowledgment would be nice); however, I also suspect that they don't have any clear plans for what to do about it, so for now they are staying silent and letting things play out...

As bad as it sounds, the game has grown a lot with Shadowbringers, so from a pure numbers perspective if the Healer drop-off isn't big enough to cause a major disruption (which, honestly, it hasn't been) then from their perspective the current Healer design is 'fine', or at least not something that needs to be urgently addressed (as any major change is going to annoy those who do like the current design).

I've been a SCH since release in ARR, and it hurts to watch this class degrade and get chipped away with every expansion. Just simply not having aetherflow work out of combat is a baffling change, and I was hoping that the devs realized their errors with the return of Energy Drain (why did they even take that away?)...

you all have brought up a lot of issues regarding both SCH and AST but shouldn't u summarize all that has been said here in the first page to make it easier to follow?

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Originally Posted by CrimsonGunner

you all have brought up a lot of issues regarding both SCH and AST but shouldn't u summarize all that has been said here in the first page to make it easier to follow?

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I mean, the point isn’t to give a list of talking points and have every healer repeat them to the devs ad nauseum. The point is for the many dissatisfied healers to share their own feedback. No summary needed for that.

There is a thread compiling all these issues (which I know you know about because you had an argument in it despite that not being the place to have an argument), but there’s no problem with this thread.

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Originally Posted by Hatstand

I mean, the point isn’t to give a list of talking points and have every healer repeat them to the devs ad nauseum. The point is for the many dissatisfied healers to share their own feedback. No summary needed for that.

There is a thread compiling all these issues (which I know you know about because you had an argument in it despite that not being the place to have an argument), but there’s no problem with this thread.

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in this thread u also compile arguments and points that are probably not on the other thread,and the point of the summery is just to follow what points were mentions in the feedbacks and allow people reading this to follow and contribute more feedback's on subject's also to allow people to come up with new ones that weren't noted rather then make it so that "every healer repeat them to the devs ad nauseum".

and since u mentioned the other thread,are u sure all the points of the feedback's brought here are mentioned there?
i sure don't know could u check then?
a list of all the issues that brought here is just an idea to allow all feedback's and notes be knows to all since this is a rather long thread.

From another thread :

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Originally Posted by Hatstand

Honestly I preferred it when none of the healers had a full healing kit. SCH has powerful shields but weak heals. WHM had powerful heals but no mitigation. Either could complete 4 man content but you needed one of each for serious 8 man content. The introduction of AST made this more complicated, since healing was previously designed to require two roles. So AST has the sects. At the same time SCH got a lot more direct healing power (hello Indom) and so became more capable of being filling either/both roles. WHM was still stuck in its rut. Adding a 4th healer could help them get back into a better balance with WHM and AST (without nocturnal) as the big heal-y/Regen healers and SCH (with a bunch of their big heals reworked into mitigation) and (new healer) as the mitigators. You could further divide by having WHM and SCH be the personal dps healers and AST and (new healer) be the buff healers. You could then differentiate again by having WHM and (new class) as the simpler offensive skill healers and SCH (with old dps abilities restored and chain strategem replaced with a personal buff) and AST (with old cards restored) as the more complex offensive options healers. The new healer could even use the new AST cards with a reskin as their buff mechanic.

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This vision is what SE should choose if they want to have 4 different and interesting healers who are fun to play.
We need differenciation, and for that each healer need to have strenghts and weaknesses.
Pure healers strengths would be raw heals and HoT while Shield healers strenghts would be shields and mitigation. That's mean their weakness is the strenght of the other.
For example, WHM is still quite weak for shield/mitigation with only one mono shield (every 30 sec) and one 10% mitigation ability (every 120 sec) for the party.
SCH should have several abilities tied to Pure being just removed or nerf to make him weak in this Pure category.

Additionnaly, each healer would have different strenghts and weaknesses in their category.

Pure Healers :
WHM strenghts : Raw heals and damages, mana management.
WHM weaknesses : Mobility, no buffs

AST strenghts : HoT, support abilities (various buffs + duration extended), mobility
AST weaknesses : Mana management, RNG cards system (previous)

Shield Healers :
SCH strenghts : DoT, Shields, some assist healing+buffs
SCH weaknesses : Difficult to find because we had a combination of pet, aetherflow abilities, mobility and mana to manage together which weren't quite evident.

4th healer strenghts : SoT (Shield over Time), damage buffer, mobility (teleportation type for self and allies), and some speed GCD / haste status.
4th healer weaknesses : Very few mitigations, some slow GCD and slow/heavy status consequence due to some abilities.

It looks like a Time Mage, maybe.


It can be totally balanced and will be easier. Why ?
Because already we set up the fundation with 2 healers categories which should work in duo : "The strenght of one is the weakness of the other."
We begin by balance Pure and Shield as stated above.
It's easy, imagine you create a Pure healer like Chemist, you know already it will have maybe one shield or not, and maybe one mitigation or not, for example. You do this, and you have already balance him with the Shield healers.
Then after we have just to balance healers from Pure category, and healers from Shield category.
Having to balance 2 healers together, 2 times, it shouldn't be too difficult nor too long.
Of course, each should be unique and bring something (or more) than the others have not to create a good identity.

Considering the different contents in this game, the duo Pure/Shield would me mandatory for Savage and Ultimate fights (and maybe some EX trials like Thordan, Shinryu, etc.)

The problem with having something that's exclusively a mitigation healer is that it tends to struggle in PUG content. :/

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Originally Posted by Wawachume

The problem with having something that's exclusively a mitigation healer is that it tends to struggle in PUG content. :/

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From what I understand, SCH seemed to do just fine in HW when most of it's healing was just mitigation.

I was still too new in Heavensward---like, biting my nails while running Sastasha as a white mage new---so I couldn't say.

I guess it would really depend on exactly how much healing vs. mitigation there is in the toolkit.

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Originally Posted by Wawachume

The problem with having something that's exclusively a mitigation healer is that it tends to struggle in PUG content. :/

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sch did great in pfs before it kept getting more and more heals no one ever excluded schs