Once you start giving out the Carbontwines

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Originally Posted by KaedrianLiang

No one is forcing you to replace gear. continue wearing FCoB pieces as if its some special badge of being "hardcore." Pretty sure titles are meant to be that badge of accomplishment.

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Maybe you should learn to read. I specifically stated I don't even do final coil. I just don't think anything given in the sleep inducing WoD raid should be better then stuff in final coil.

it would be nice if there were more interesting secondary stat choices so that another i130 gear set would actually have some necessity.

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Originally Posted by ScarletDawn

Again why does having to do coil seem like the only way ur aloud to max out your char? People back in (other mmo with pandas) would try max stats without raiding because idk they liked to obtain gear and max out their char.

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Uhh... SE gives people more high ilvl gear than Blizzard. In WoW, if you want the highest ilvl, you better be clearing mythic raids. People were min/maxing with what they had available.

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Originally Posted by Galliano

We need more content of the same calibre offering the same ilvl. If we had 5-6 different forms of content all offering different i130 gear it would be much more fun working out which slots you want from which content and gathering up different friends to tackle the different challenges. As it is now it's either faceroll hunts or rigid static for coil.

I would love to see this go hand in hand with more hard open world content designed for 8 players, poppable boss mobs with hard to obtain pop items, very dangerous areas . .

For dangerous areas it would be cool to have a void that warps you to a harder version of the zone (just change the lighting to make it all dark and ominous and fill it with tough mobs and wandering boss mobs), with that zone still being completely open world (so anybody who has the void unlocked can enter).

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Yes, please. More different types of end game would make this game fun.

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Originally Posted by Utsu

There is two solutions to get gear, "skill" and "farm" with RNG in both of them. And if skill = farm, Coil = Hunting > WoD = farming tokens. I only talk about ilvl, not "best gear".

So, if ppl want i130 in WoD, they need more "skill" or more "farm", imo. Farm would be the best way as I said, or probably a mix.

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A wonderful breakdown of the problem. The carboncoats being handed out via a weekly quest where you must farm all 3 dungeons is a great example of this principle in action as well as the Zodiac weapon questline compared to Raid weapons.

The third option tends to be crafting, but in this game with how materia is these days we can't really count that anymore.

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Originally Posted by CYoung187

Maybe you should learn to read. I specifically stated I don't even do final coil. I just don't think anything given in the sleep inducing WoD raid should be better then stuff in final coil.

it would be nice if there were more interesting secondary stat choices so that another i130 gear set would actually have some necessity.

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Most of the WoD wouldnt be BIS and there is also ironworks so having 3 sets at 130 would be nice for getting those stats you want.

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Originally Posted by Utsu

So, if ppl want i130 in WoD, they need more "skill" or more "farm", imo. Farm would be the best way as I said, or probably a mix.

Feel free to correct me if I missed something.

Cheers.

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I don't think anyone in here was suggesting just throwing i130 gear at anyone that did WoD in the first place - the upgrade item would require some degree of farm or similar to obtain in the first place. (Similar to how poetics gear is upgraded currently).

Hell, just throw it in T10 as a guaranteed drop to everyone in the party. Might encourage the non-raiders to at least join a PUG.

They could add a weekly item just like carboncoat or maybe make you pick which upgrade item you take for that week, which would mean you still farm weekly.

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Originally Posted by FranSeara

Sorry, you dont know this and you couldnt know. Here's why: Try beating Odin at item level 95 in Df (you won't win) Try beating Shiva Ex at item level 95 ( I'd love to see the vids of that fight!!!) Point being is not eveyone comes into fights at high item levels, some player will try fights at item level, you gotta overgear for that...trust me. Also, the gear in this patch is a JOKE. Non-Raiders and Non Hardcore players who want to clear stuff are going to need every bit of gear they can get. This argument is a Dead Duck in the water, leave it be. Raiders get the best gear first, everyone else waits. We've waited, now please just let US enjoy our leftovers, thank you very much.

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If that's the minimum ilvl to get in then yes it can be completed even in duty finder. Have I tried those particular fights a minimum ilvl, no dont plan to either. Unlock, clear, never touch again unless helping friend or fc member. That's how I've done all trials. I've went into onlder coils at min ilvl (on an alt) and still managed to come out near the top of dps (if not the top) with ridiculously over geared players. The ilvl requirement is not the ilvl requirement needed to beat content. Example T9: was beaten in i90 pre echo and now you cant even enter without being i105. So yes a good player can enter at minimum ilvl and clear. Ilvl requirement and echo is so non raider can be closer to raiders skill.
Also only job I dont recommend being at min ilvl is tanks. Good luck at i95 while everyone else is getting close to i130

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

A wonderful breakdown of the problem. The carboncoats being handed out via a weekly quest where you must farm all 3 dungeons is a great example of this principle in action as well as the Zodiac weapon questline compared to Raid weapons.

The third option tends to be crafting, but in this game with how materia is these days we can't really count that anymore.

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A quest like "purify one piece of Demon Armor of your choice" would be amazing imo. With Allagan Catalysts and some CT farming.

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Originally Posted by Altena

I don't think anyone in here was suggesting just throwing i130 gear at anyone that did WoD in the first place

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Yeah, you're right, sorry !

I just want to pop my head in cause this is an argument I have quite often in-game. I think enough has been said for both sides by this point (although it took quite a while for defenders of Utsu's side to show up). I'd like to direct everyone to Kumabear76's post. Maybe 2 or 3 people responded to his ideas, and those 2 or 3 only chose to correct him about 130 being available to only raiders atm. Nobody chose to address the meat of his position which is really a more thorough explanation to Utsu's and my side of the argument.

I always chose to relate this argument to things outside of the video game. I put it very, very simply (probably not the best thing because many of you like to tear holes through generalizations or like to derail the argument completely by strawmanning); Skill/Effort = Best rewards ... that's the way it is in nature, and that's the way it SHOULD be in-game.