The tanking shortage reasons

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

Actually yes, I do. The mechanics to Monk are straight forward and simple to learn compared to Brd all you have to do is dodge, position, and use a rotation vs keep up with songs at certain points, keep your buffs and debuffs up, and use all your procs. But that's my main point, it's all subjective.

And personally I find it way more demanding to tank or heal than to Mnk. It's actually MY lazy job.

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WHM hardest job in Titan EX. MT hardest job in T4. Bard harder than Monk. Monk lazy job.

Yup. I've now heard it all.

I realize you're trying to state a point here, but what the things you are saying fringes on insanity.

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Originally Posted by givemeraptors

People love to say that DPS are the least important, and I just can't believe that people who have tanked (and done it at least decently) can say that honestly.

When I tank I TOTALLY know when the DPS is doing a bad job (attacking the wrong target, not doing enough damage) and IT MAKES MY JOB HARDER, and by extension strains the healer. Bad DPS can easily cause a wipe, not insta-gibb like a dead tank or healer usually signifies, but over time which is why their responsibility seems diminished.

IMO if you think DPS are useless you have either never tanked, or are not very good at it.

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You just answered your own post.

Fishing for in-progress dungeons is certainly part of the cause, and something square can actually fix.

I think it's mostly just the pressure of leading. I never really noticed how much I'm on auto-pilot when playing DPS. I recently started tanking (level 38 or something I think) and I suddenly realized that I was used to just following the tank around. In more than a few places I was unsure what rooms had to be cleared and which direction to go. I never really noticed which mobs roamed outside of a confined area and weren't linked up with other mobs. Granted I do know this stuff for the 50+ dungeons that I've done dozens and dozens of times, but the ones I only did 2-5 times? Nope.

I actually do like tanking (on WAR anyhow. Only have GLA at 22), and I haven't had many bad experiences outside of the normal people being silent and apparently put upon that they have to play this game. I wouldn't say it requires more effort exactly, I just don't like being the person to set the pace and decide what to skip (I usually ask and am met with "eh, whatever" if anything). There's also the ratio issue for low level content. There's so little reason to run low level dungeons with a level 50 class that you can more or less only expect this to happen as a favor. Technically this is probably a worse issue for healers though since you can level all jobs to 50 while only doing it once as a healer.

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

Depends on what you're doing. Fight Turn 4 as OT, Titan EX as a Whm, or Twintania as Sch and tell me again that DPS is the hardest. DPS also have it super easy on any dungeon.

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Titan Ex as a whm is a joke

One side problem, is that the amount of personal skill required to judge the two DPS is far higher the amount of skill needed to judge a tank.

If Tank lose aggro often, then, you cannot know if tank is bad or some dps is having fun hitting certain mobs on purpose. I've seen a good amount of geared couples (usually healer+dps) who join DF on the scope of this low level fun.

When DPS is low, unless you resort to external parser, you cannot know who blame, because the gear ilvl does not automatically equals better damage dealing of the player. Then, parsers are not a solution because a good dps, in some fights he will go to do things that have to be done, but he see no one were going to do them, and stops dps to help the group avoid wipes.

A dps who does not take attention to aggro will eventually remove it from tank, making pressure on tank who needs regain it, that is not easy sometime.

Some healers will just heal. Yes it is their main role, but when there is no pressure, they also can help with debuffs and so on.

Some dps when gets aggro and are not geared enough to take the mob, will not stop dps the mob, making almost impossible for tank to remove aggro from him.

Some dps goes ahead the tank and aggro mobs. That happens quite often on guildhests. They are confident to take down mob in no time. That's ok if happens, but don't have fun of the tank that cannot remove your aggro because it is too late.

Some dps and healers will panic when they get aggro, running around the room eventually causing more aggro, rather than just go near tank for help. Then they yell for help, expecting the tank leave the boss and joining them in the carosel.

Some tanks forgets to mark 2nd mob (I'll take for granted that "1" is always targeted), and when 1st mob dies, dps targets at random and some aggro may be lost.

ALL of this, ends with "bad tank" certification. What a pity.

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

Actually yes, I do. The mechanics to Monk are straight forward and simple to learn compared to Brd all you have to do is dodge, position, and use a rotation vs keep up with songs at certain points, keep your buffs and debuffs up, and use all your procs. But that's my main point, it's all subjective.

And personally I find it way more demanding to tank or heal than to Mnk. It's actually MY lazy job.

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haha wow, bard harder than monk, i've heard it all. Im guessing you just pump out a whopping 150 dps on your monk then call it super easy cause your bard is only pulling 130.

This thread has served a purpose. I am leveling Marauder when I need a break from the main story on my SMN.

I picked SMN as my first 'main' class because it brings a certain element of awesome to the main story due to how egis are acquired, and the battle mage gear looks pretty great. It also lets me run dungeons as a SCH whenever I want to cut a longer than half an hour wait time down to about five minutes and play what seems (to me, because I have a lot of experience playing healers) what feels like a job class with a much less intricate toolbox.

Marauder is level 12 or so now, and I'm enjoying the animations and the ability to grab aggro. Because it already has respectable DPS on its own, and because GIANT BATTLEAXE, I figured it would be easier to level up and begin running dungeons almost exclusively so that I can get as much experience tanking as possible in party situations.

Yes, I do plan to bounce to GLD and grab its tanker toolbox eventually, but I should be fine to start with on my tank side project.

So thanks!

It's funny because so many people go crazy at tanks but in the end pissing them off is not always a good idea because since there is a tank shortage then its best to not personally attack them because they could just always leave and that's it enjoy looking for a replacement tank which might take awhile. DPS should be the most scrutinized role in the game because everything revolves around how long the fight takes. If they're not trying to push 100% all the time then the fight takes longer and the tank takes more damage and the healers mp pool can run out. The tank has one simple role and that is to keep the monsters off the party members. If people are having trouble doing that then they need to review on what they're doing wrong and fix it. I find tanking far easier and a lot less stressful then playing either healer or dps but that could just be me.

A beginner tank's opinion:

I love duty finder for Ultima HM. It's sooo funny looking at people running around in total confusion at Ifrit stage and getting run over by Ifrit. Worth repair costs. The only thing I like in df tanking though.