*Spoilers* Anyone feel joining Emet would have been better

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Originally Posted by HappyHubris

The people of Eorzea sacrifice endless animal life for sustenance; heck they slaughtered beastmen for profit. How is that different from sacrificing animal life for a world reset?

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It probably wasn't just animal life, I doubt Ancient society would have been split over whether to hand the world over to some cows and rabbits and such.

As for the beastmen, well, I don't think anyone is arguing that slaughtering the beastmen for profit is a good thing.

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Originally Posted by HappyHubris

I agree that it's important to note that Sundering was a genocide in and of itself. The game beats us over the head with how evil it would be to extinguish the sundered to restore the ancients, but it was equally evil to wipe out the ancients to create the sundered.

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Omnicide. Wiping out a single demographic is genocide. Venat wiped out all of them. Language used is but a small difference, but it's one I feel worthy of noting. Really drives home the gravity of the act far more so than calling it mere genocide.

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Originally Posted by Absimiliard

Omnicide. Wiping out a single demographic is genocide. Venat wiped out all of them. Language used is but a small difference, but it's one I feel worthy of noting. Really drives home the gravity of the act far more so than calling it mere genocide.

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^this. And again, this is the problem I have with those who say Venat did nothing wrong. This is the reason I am dissatisfied with a great deal of EW's narrative even if I loved Elpis and Ultima Thule. SE not sufficiently painting Venat's actions as being as wrong as they were "necessary" [note the necessary in quotes, it would not have been if she had actually told people what they were up against.] was highly disappointing. Whitewashing of something that is a crime no matter how you slice it just bothers me to no end.

I normally stay off the forums but read them, but on the whole subject here.

People calling Zodiark's summon idiotic because it would only delay the End of Days. Consider this people, they NOT KNEW of the final days, it was a catastrophic event for them destroying their lives, and since Venat not told them at all, how should they had known it would return at all? We as players know details they not know or can't know, we have seen things and know things yet also not share info only when the plot demands it, we are the same in this case.

Both sides in this are neutral and acted out of desperation, but I do agree that the story painting Venat as the good sacrificial person is bs. On top of the Scions showing doubt but never question it. I enjoyed Endwalker a lot, but those points are terrible writing. Venat should have forgotten all like the rest, and rest had played out and even should have stayed in mystery why she did what she did in becoming Hydaelyn, but at least make it fair for both sides, and not get me started on the imagery of her as Angel while Zodiark is this hideous beast. Because tell me this, if Primal represent the belief of their summoners, WHY do they both look so different of the same race? It is cliché in my eyes, because i guess traditions of their artwork dark vs light.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Except we do know this. We’re told this in the short story. Even the “tempered” convocation was split on the idea of the sacrifices. They didn’t calm down about it until Elidibus ejected from Zodiark and they saw a soul could come out of Zodiark, so i’m not sure where you’re getting this from.

As for the idea that they would continue sacrificing and sacrificing….we’re told via Hythlodaeus that once the 3rd set was done they planned to resume their duties as stewards of the star, there is nothing indicating they would continue sacrificing. For all we know they could have put Zodiark into Pandaemonium afterwards or put him in the center of the star like Hydaelyn was.

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There's no indication that it was the Convocation that was split, Eldibus is pretty clearly referring to the Convocation on one side and Venat and co on the other.

The only time the Convocation is ever referred to as being hesitant or split on a decision is about Elidibus being the Heart and thats pre Summoning

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Originally Posted by Absimiliard

Omnicide. Wiping out a single demographic is genocide. Venat wiped out all of them. Language used is but a small difference, but it's one I feel worthy of noting. Really drives home the gravity of the act far more so than calling it mere genocide.

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Omnicide is the destruction of all life, or all human life, depending on context.

Life still exists and humanity still exists, the sundered are still human beings, even if they are individually weaker than the Ancients.

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Originally Posted by Jandor

How is it Omnicide? Life still exists, mankind still exists for that matter. The sundered are still mankind, even if they are individually less powerful than the Ancients.

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The complete elimination of their culture? That counts as omnicide.

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Originally Posted by redheadturk

The complete elimination of their culture? That counts as omnicide.

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Omnicide has a pretty binary definition. Are all humans dead? If they're not, it's not omnicide.

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Originally Posted by Slatersev

There's no indication that it was the Convocation that was split, Eldibus is pretty clearly referring to the Convocation on one side and Venat and co on the other.

The only time the Convocation is ever referred to as being hesitant or split on a decision is about Elidibus being the Heart and thats pre Summoning

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The french version goes over it. This poster went over it pretty well, just scroll to the elidibus section.

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post5565636

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Originally Posted by Jandor

Omnicide has a pretty binary definition. Are all humans dead? If they're not, it's not omnicide.

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They as a people no longer existed. Changed or not, they did not exist in the form they once did. The Ancients no longer existed after Venat's actions, and now that we have killed the last three Unsundered they never will again.