How would you design Avatar's Favor?

[Kisuke]

Just for fun, I'm not really concerned with the mechanics and balance side.

"Avatar's Favor" was introduced partially as a mechanics response to the tendency of summoners to cycle avatars for their abilities rather than leave them out for longer stretches. However, it could also be said that Avatar's Favor is thought to have the 'story component' to show how the summoner had bonded with their avatar and that the avatar grew increasingly potent based on the duration (strength) of that bond. Previous FF games come to mind, with characters that had specific avatars they could summon, or something like FF8's system where each character had an affinity stat for each avatar depending on how much they had been called forth.

If it were you designing a system for FF11 that stressed the bond between Evoker and Evokee, or lent some advantage to leaving an avatar out for long periods of time, what would you do? Something like the buffs of Avatar's Favor, or an entirely different mechanic? I'd like to hear what creative things the summoners among us come up with!

[Ninian]

Not specifically creative but, the longer you leave the avatar out, the shorter your BP timers would be would be very nice. Perhaps add MAB+ and STR+ or something as they're left out too. Maybe give access to new BPs as well.

[Malamasala]

I would have done it almost the same.

Pros:
Aura effect (choose in list of 10 effects available to all avatars)
-Perpetuation

Cons:
Summoner slow cast (takes twice as long to summon a new avatar, or cast a cure spell etc)

I.e. put the focus on the avatar, and lower the subjob reliance by force. Also of course no weaker BPs, or lowering of potency on using BPs. This would also motivate more people to melee, since spells become weaker.

[Arciel]

if it were up to me, I'd make Avatar Favor effects apply the maximum effect you can get from the moment you summon the avatar and leave the effect tier linked to smn. magic skill. and increase the radius to like 15 yalms.

Also since rage pacts are put at a disadvantage I'd say I'd also make it so that BP timer is reduced with favor up.. like by 15s.

..for the lore element and discouraging pet switching.. hmmm...
I'd make it so that if your avatar is out for more than 75s (current time it takes to hit max favor), the SMN gains access to a 3rd Blood Pact category..

since this is for creative fun...
Blood Pact: Favor
- either adds an additional effect onto the Favor, or grants a bonus effect to the avatar.
lasts for as long as Avatar's Favor is effective. all BP:Favors are 0 mp, but only 1 BP:Favor effect can be applied at a time on the avatar (the latest one overwrites the previously used one)
Lv55 - Astral Ward: damage taken -10% added to aura
Lv65 - Avatar Bless: recover's 20% of avatar max HP and grants avatar 5hp/tic regen.
Lv75 - Astral Breeze: 3hp/tic Regen, 1mp/tic Refresh and 1tp/tic Regain added to aura
Lv85 - Avatar Guard: removes status effects from avatar and grants avatar damage taken -15%
Lv95 - Astral Paling: Occasionally nullifies damage / magic damage added to aura
Lv99 - Avatar Cede: Convert avatars TP into Summoner's MP. inhibits avatar from gaining TP.

[Razushu]

I would have done it almost the same.

Pros:
Aura effect (choose in list of 10 effects available to all avatars)
-Perpetuation

Cons:
Summoner slow cast (takes twice as long to summon a new avatar, or cast a cure spell etc)

I.e. put the focus on the avatar, and lower the subjob reliance by force. Also of course no weaker BPs, or lowering of potency on using BPs. This would also motivate more people to melee, since spells become weaker.

Why would you want to motivate people to melee? What is the fixation on utilizing the WEAKEST aspect of a job a side that's not meant too be used in a serious manner/situation.

If I were designing a system for FF11 that stressed the bond between Evoker and Evokee

Infused Summoning

recast 5 minutes
duration 2hrs or avatar death

Summoner sacrifices health to empower currently summoned

drains 25hp per tick from summoner

grants following bonuses to avatar:
Blood pact Damage +20%
Melee damage +50%
regen +20
Haste +20%

grants Summoner the following bonuses:
Blood Boon +10
BP delay -10 passes cap

[Soundwave]

if it were up to me, I'd make Avatar Favor effects apply the maximum effect you can get from the moment you summon the avatar and leave the effect tier linked to smn. magic skill. and increase the radius to like 15 yalms.

Also since rage pacts are put at a disadvantage I'd say I'd also make it so that BP timer is reduced with favor up.. like by 15s.

..for the lore element and discouraging pet switching.. hmmm...
I'd make it so that if your avatar is out for more than 75s (current time it takes to hit max favor), the SMN gains access to a 3rd Blood Pact category..

since this is for creative fun...
Blood Pact: Favor
- either adds an additional effect onto the Favor, or grants a bonus effect to the avatar.
lasts for as long as Avatar's Favor is effective. all BP:Favors are 0 mp, but only 1 BP:Favor effect can be applied at a time on the avatar (the latest one overwrites the previously used one)
Lv55 - Astral Ward: damage taken -10% added to aura
Lv65 - Avatar Bless: recover's 20% of avatar max HP and grants avatar 5hp/tic regen.
Lv75 - Astral Breeze: 3hp/tic Regen, 1mp/tic Refresh and 1tp/tic Regain added to aura
Lv85 - Avatar Guard: removes status effects from avatar and grants avatar damage taken -15%
Lv95 - Astral Paling: Occasionally nullifies damage / magic damage added to aura
Lv99 - Avatar Cede: Convert avatars TP into Summoner's MP. inhibits avatar from gaining TP.

I like seems like T2 Favors with less suck.

[Malamasala]

Why would you want to motivate people to melee? What is the fixation on utilizing the WEAKEST aspect of a job a side that's not meant too be used in a serious manner/situation.

It is the ONLY thing you can do except stand and watch, that is part of your main job. And I'm all about using the main job and ignoring the sub since it has dominated too much in the past.

[Razushu]

It is the ONLY thing you can do except stand and watch, that is part of your main job. And I'm all about using the main job and ignoring the sub since it has dominated too much in the past.

If you're just standing and watching you're doing it wrong. Why ignore the subjob job it's there to enhance your role in a party, it's the reason it's there. I was never dominated by my subjob in the past I used it to expand my usefulness to a party.

[Karbuncle]

If you're just standing and watching you're doing it wrong. Why ignore the subjob job it's there to enhance your role in a party, it's the reason it's there. I was never dominated by my subjob in the past I used it to expand my usefulness to a party.

I can't honestly name 1 single time I've done anything on SMN outside of maybe throwing 1-2 -na spells between BPs, because well, i play with good people.

Truthfully, there are actually some mobs a SMN would be better of meleeing than dropping Cure IVs that you don't need if you're in a good group, or standing around with their thumb up their but waiting for BP Timer and desperately trying to find something to do to look productive.

This really only works in Abyssea though, Outside our terrible accuracy, terrible attack, and bad Staves really don't make it viable. That and inside Abyssea we have more "survivability", and Atmas to augment our fighting skills that wont completely gimp us (since Predator claws/etc Benefit from those DD atmas as well).

Its obvious not useful on every mob, and its obviously not going to match a real DD's potential. But if you're in a good group, and the mob doesn't have Super-WTF AoEs, Melee on SMN would actually be slightly better than sitting around looking for something to do.

Now, I'm not saying you neglect Cures if someone needs them, You would still perform that if your WHM came behind. a good SMN would know when to draw the line and pull back from the frontlines and help around the back. These are rare situations with a good WHM though...

Sometimes you're not always with a WHM though!
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on the topic of Avatar's Favor, I'd of made it the following-

"Avatar's Favor"
Dur:1hr recast:1min

I would remove the "Negative Impact" on the Avatar. The Aura should be a benefit the avatar gives from its presence, it should not weaken it, and further it should gain the actual benefit of the Aura itself too.

that being said, I would enhance the potency of some of the buffs, and change some around/improve them, also, also add some job traits that enhance Avatar's Favor, and 1 special JT at level 90+ that gives each favor another bonus. Like follows-

(These Effects are gained at level 90 when you get the Trait i talked about above)
Carbuncle - Adds Regain (1-2Tp/tic)
Fenrir - Adds Triple Attack (~5%)
Diabolos - Adds "Drain or Aspir" to Melee Attacks
Ifrit - Adds "Attack Bonus" (Scale % same as Dbl)
Shiva - Increases Magic Crit.rate/dmg (Same % as MAB)
Leviathan - Increases Cure Potency (+~20%)
Garuda - Adds Haste Effect (~+10% JA Haste)
Titan - Adds a -DT Effect (-10~15%)
Ramuh - Increases Critical hit Damage (Scales same as Crit-rate)

Bonus!
If Summoned with Avatar's Favor currently Active, Odin/Alexanders will perform different actions.

*"Odin's Favor" will grant a powerful buff to all stats(+30) and add a small chance to "death" enemies on striking (Similar to Twilight Scythe, Low Activation rate though 1-2%)

*"Alexander's Favor" will raise all Elemental Resistance to 200, and occasionally absorb Physical and Magical Damage (~10% Rate).

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And how about a Job Trait specifically for Favor? if you can't remove the bad effects, maybe give us something like this

*JT "Celestial Favor"
55/65/75/85/95
-Decreases the penalty on avatar's when using "Avatar's Favor". Increases Stats in relation to Avatar.
*First Trait would reduce the penalty to attack/matk by 5%, each trait after would be 3 for 17 back. (Would still have a small penalty in effect)
*+5 To Stat related to Avatar's Element (bar fen/dia), +3 Each level after.
**Fenrir Would get an increase to all Stats @ +3 First Stage, +2 Each after
**Diabolos Would Increase MP, +30 first stage, +15 each after.

[Razushu]

I can't honestly name 1 single time I've done anything on SMN outside of maybe throwing 1-2 -na spells between BPs, because well, i play with good people.

Truthfully, there are actually some mobs a SMN would be better of meleeing than dropping Cure IVs that you don't need if you're in a good group, or standing around with their thumb up their but waiting for BP Timer and desperately trying to find something to do to look productive.

This really only works in Abyssea though, Outside our terrible accuracy, terrible attack, and bad Staves really don't make it viable. That and inside Abyssea we have more "survivability", and Atmas to augment our fighting skills that wont completely gimp us (since Predator claws/etc Benefit from those DD atmas as well).

Its obvious not useful on every mob, and its obviously not going to match a real DD's potential. But if you're in a good group, and the mob doesn't have Super-WTF AoEs, Melee on SMN would actually be slightly better than sitting around looking for something to do.

Now, I'm not saying you neglect Cures if someone needs them, You would still perform that if your WHM came behind. a good SMN would know when to draw the line and pull back from the frontlines and help around the back. These are rare situations with a good WHM though...

Sometimes you're not always with a WHM though!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

on the topic of Avatar's Favor, I'd of made it the following-

"Avatar's Favor"
Dur:1hr recast:1min

I would remove the "Negative Impact" on the Avatar. The Aura should be a benefit the avatar gives from its presence, it should not weaken it, and further it should gain the actual benefit of the Aura itself too.

that being said, I would enhance the potency of some of the buffs, and change some around/improve them, also, also add some job traits that enhance Avatar's Favor, and 1 special JT at level 90+ that gives each favor another bonus. Like follows-

(These Effects are gained at level 90 when you get the Trait i talked about above)
Carbuncle - Adds Regain (1-2Tp/tic)
Fenrir - Adds Triple Attack (~5%)
Diabolos - Adds "Drain or Aspir" to Melee Attacks
Ifrit - Adds "Attack Bonus" (Scale % same as Dbl)
Shiva - Increases Magic Crit.rate/dmg (Same % as MAB)
Leviathan - Increases Cure Potency (+~20%)
Garuda - Adds Haste Effect (~+10% JA Haste)
Titan - Adds a -DT Effect (-10~15%)
Ramuh - Increases Critical hit Damage (Scales same as Crit-rate)

Bonus!
If Summoned with Avatar's Favor currently Active, Odin/Alexanders will perform different actions.

*"Odin's Favor" will grant a powerful buff to all stats(+30) and add a small chance to "death" enemies on striking (Similar to Twilight Scythe, Low Activation rate though 1-2%)

*"Alexander's Favor" will raise all Elemental Resistance to 200, and occasionally absorb Physical and Magical Damage (~10% Rate).

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And how about a Job Trait specifically for Favor? if you can't remove the bad effects, maybe give us something like this

*JT "Celestial Favor"
55/65/75/85/95
-Decreases the penalty on avatar's when using "Avatar's Favor". Increases Stats in relation to Avatar.
*First Trait would reduce the penalty to attack/matk by 5%, each trait after would be 3 for 17 back. (Would still have a small penalty in effect)
*+5 To Stat related to Avatar's Element (bar fen/dia), +3 Each level after.
**Fenrir Would get an increase to all Stats @ +3 First Stage, +2 Each after
**Diabolos Would Increase MP, +30 first stage, +15 each after.

I play with good people too and I still find myself very useful on SMN and it's very rare I'd find myself doing nothing between BP timers. I love your ideas for favor esp. the trait, I always thought Avatar's favor as is is weak enough that it could've been made a Job trait - the damage gimp.