Do Relic, Mythic, and Empyrean staves lack utility?

[Leonlionheart]

What's your point, anyway? This isn't about being the best DD ever. It is, however, about increasing SMN's damage output beyond what is typical of the job.

Cool, so we are at an understanding that SMN is quite a poor DD. Using the staff makes it better than it used to be, obviously.

SE needs to get fixing SMN.

[Alhanelem]

And that's about the only thing I can half-heartedly agree with you on, that the job could use a boost. But it's far from "broken." There's only so much they can do to increase its capability without making the things it's already good at (kite-killing) too good. It is not however, "poor."

[Greatguardian]

Ignoring massive amounts of pDif/cRatio differences even when Haste is equal is nothing short of irresponsible anyways. SMN will never come close to being capped on Attack, and yes that is a big deal.

[Alhanelem]

There isn't a massive amount of difference. And if you want to play the buffing game, again, whatever supporting buffs anyone else receives from other people, I can too.

If you're talking about 999 attack, I've seen evidence that attack is not really capped at 999 and that the equipment display is simply locked to displaying a 3 digit number. And I'm quite certain I can reach 999.

[Neisan_Quetz]

ITT: fucking pDIF how does it work

[Alhanelem]

The issue I take, and took, and that you ran headlong into on page 3 of this thread without bothering to read for comprehension everything that was being said, is simply Dallas claiming that SMN Emp Staff can do more total damage than a Ukonvasara WAR.

I never claimed dallas was right on this, and I wasn't the one who made the comparison in the first place? So why aren't you attacking him instead of me? You keep quoting me and going at me over this, putting the burden on me to prove this and that, but I wasn't even the one trying originally to argue it!

ITT: fucking pDIF how does it work

http://ffxi.gamerescape.com/wiki/PDIF

[Greatguardian]

I never claimed dallas was right on this, and I wasn't the one who made the comparison in the first place? So why aren't you attacking him instead of me?

I am.

I never said attack capped at 999. I said attack capped. cRatio caps. 2.2 for 2-handers. WAR doesn't need minuets to easily cap cRatio on a lot of things, assuming Berserk (fair enough since we're already assuming Smn/Sam and War/Sam are using Hasso which is native too). Since I pulled in bards, we may as well give the Smn Minuets in addition to marches just to be nice. Should we SV them too for fun? You're still looking at only 840~ attack if you assume 550 with RCB SMN/SAM.

No. That's not negligible.

Again, I'll say for the dozenth time, SMN hitting things is better than SMN not hitting things. SMN hitting things isn't total suck. But SMN hitting things cannot effectively compare its personal DD power to a "true" DD. It absolutely cannot. Be it WAR, or MNK, or NIN, or DRG. They will do more damage, and have a greater overall utility (aside from DRG).

Does that mean SMN is total ass? Meh. Depends on who you ask. It'll always be better than a total gimpcrap player. But comparing yourself to a gimpcrap player, or a DRK of any kind, is like kicking a toddler and bragging about winning the fight.

[Leonlionheart]

Again, I'll say for the dozenth time, SMN hitting things is better than SMN not hitting things.

Ehh... you could get into situations where TP feed is a problem but they aren't as common as what 75% of the population does anyway (Farm 85 Empyrean mats till their eyes fall out).

Assuming abyssea, and non-heroes content, SMN hitting stuff would be better than SMN not hitting stuff. Otherwise the only NMs it would be prudent to TP on would be like Orthrus, Respheph, or Bennu, and only if your WHM has a great bar-spell or the SMN is changing to Titan every so often for Earthen Armor.

[Alhanelem]

Assuming anything where "feeding TP" isn't an absolute death sentence

Fixed that for you. Not just Abyssea or just a certain area of it, any place and situation where it is OK to have more than one melee on a mob.

[Greatguardian]

Ehh... you could get into situations where TP feed is a problem but they aren't as common as what 75% of the population does anyway (Farm 85 Empyrean mats till their eyes fall out).

Assuming abyssea, and non-heroes content, SMN hitting stuff would be better than SMN not hitting stuff. Otherwise the only NMs it would be prudent to TP on would be like Orthrus, Respheph, or Bennu, and only if your WHM has a great bar-spell or the SMN is changing to Titan every so often for Earthen Armor.

Oh I'm definitely assuming if the SMN's in a group, they're being treated the same as any other "DD" as far as cures and TP feed goes. Of course, that's a somewhat outlandish assumption if only because I don't think it ever happens in reality.