Claim System + Call for Help Code = Win

[Glamdring]

I do recall that they changed the claim system awhile back in response mostly to HNM claimers who would simply claim and kite until the rest of the LS showed for the kill, but I don't recall the specifics of the change, except I think that's when rage was implemented. At the time I solo'd almost exclusively on beast, and the only interest I had in HNM was behemoth hides since my main craft is leather; because of the monopolizing HNMLS's and how much they QQ when someone takes "their" mob it simply wasn't worth the aggravation of having to /blist an entire LS after I took initial claim so I stopped doing them with my social shells. They've been good enough to add much easier alternatives to behemoth materials at those levels so I don't even care about that. Also, since I did solo beast for almost my entire career I have enough KS to fight behemoths pretty much any time I feel like it.

In any event, that shows that SE is willing to fix some of the "wtf?" elements in the system. No matter how you feel about it, we all must admit there are plenty of things about it that make you go "huh?" For me it's DoT, if I'm taking damage, and I know who did it I will remain pissed at them, also some of the debuffs. This really isn't that much of an issue if they do revise it to make it realistic, most level-appropriate NMs have such high resistance to anything that even with top skill that DoT is gonna wear very fast, unlike how it acts when landed on us... Some of the debuffs should also spark hate, while they are active. How pissed do you get when para lands on you? Is there any reason to think a mob wouldn't feel the same way?

As to giving a claim away, there's really only 3 ways to do it: 1. die-death settles alot of scores, and noone is advocating getting up and still having hate established; 2. run through water-stuff that tracks by scent loses the scent this way, and eventually gives up if it can't see/hear you as well, deodorize works if you are far enough away that it can't still see/hear, thief has hide; 3. zone/flux since your bod basically disappears from the face of the earth for a time, again it can't track. A reset button won't work, whatever you did to piss it off, you still did it, and it should still be pissed, at everyone that's taken an action on it or healed someone that did..

[rog]

The change was requiring 2 consecutive actions to claim a mob that had hate on someone else.

[Glamdring]

This.
Been playing this game off and on since the PS2 beta test and never ever ever ever ever had spamming abilities on a claimed enemy magically made someone lose claim. If that were possible, it'd have been fixed a hell of a lot quicker than it was because EVERYONE would be abusing that.

point of fact, you generally can't take any hostile action on a mob once it's taken the 1st point of damage, so you couldn't spam anything but cure. I don't recall anytime you could. The biggie that I recall is that if your claim did no damage (provoke) or you had simultaneous attacks there was a chance to fight over claim until 1 side firmly established it.

[rog]

point of fact, you generally can't take any hostile action on a mob once it's taken the 1st point of damage, so you couldn't spam anything but cure. I don't recall anytime you could. The biggie that I recall is that if your claim did no damage (provoke) or you had simultaneous attacks there was a chance to fight over claim until 1 side firmly established it.

You are wrong. Damage has never played any roll whatsoever in claim.

[Glamdring]

positive that, just recently I and another guy were fighting over claims on soulflayers, and we were both whacking on it, neither of us had claim until Numbnuts (my auto) landed its 1st range attack, then it went red. I was there for a trial, he was trying to clear a pulling path for the NM, so don't know why he wanted that particular mob, but he just grabbed another without bitching about it, so it was all good.

[Alhanelem]

Aggressive actions which result in some amount of hate by players cause claim. Damage has nothing to do with it. (Further, for pets, only certain actions can cause claim). Claiming is all about hate, nothing else.

[Hoshi]

Saw another mob go white while engaged yesterday. We were trioing Ovni NIN BLM WHM (no one else around to do anything to mess w/ hate mechanics). Only the ninja was engaged. He remained engaged for the duration of the fight and was not back tanking. I guess it's possible I took hate on BLM but I was 17 away (and standing right next to the WHM) from Ovni, well within the range that he would have just moved to hit me and not deaggroed. In between melee swings by the ninja Ovni went white and then was reclaimed the next hit. I don't remember seeing engaged mobs go white before maybe a year ago?

[rog]

Claiming is all about hate, nothing else.

Unless the mob was declaimed (but not deaggroed) for whatever reason.

[Chocobits]

This.
Been playing this game off and on since the PS2 beta test and never ever ever ever ever had spamming abilities on a claimed enemy magically made someone lose claim. If that were possible, it'd have been fixed a hell of a lot quicker than it was because EVERYONE would be abusing that.

It was possible, and as I said in my post I did extensive testing on it. Claim stealing was possible on any mob by spamming spells/JA. The mob's name color never changed during the period in which claim was lost because it was a < 1 second window. Every mob had a split second window where any nearby player could perform an action on it. It was quickly ninja patched when people began posting about lost NMs.

It's cool you didn't know about it. It wasn't a widely known fact (being one of the few exploits that was hush hush, like the salvage hacks). Just because you didn't know about it =/= it didn't exist though. It doesn't matter because it doesn't exist now; I'm just stating for the record it was possible and I don't gain any kind of super reputation for pointing it out/fabricating it.

[Khiinroye]

Your automaton example is because claiming with automatons is glitched.