WoEs

[Olor]

If you're a BST, you should have a WHM sub around 50, so just take that to 90 and 12 hours later you can get seals in pick ups.

Sure, and I will pay for all those spells with my imaginary gil!

Anyway - someone asked why people would solo in an MMO - I replied by pointing out that people might want to put their effort into soloing because they can't find other people to do content with them (unless they say, level a job they don't want to play...)

Like if I wanted to be a whm... I probably would have leveled whm, not BST.

Anyway, I am leveling BLU for seal pick ups because at least I enjoy playing BLU.

That said, I can understand why people would want to solo, what with so many people out there demanding you play a job you don't want to play etc. in order to gear the job you do want to play.

I can understand WHY seal groups want people to be on those jobs (they don't want to waste their time or have 1 more person to share with/whatever) - but I also understand that someone who doesn't want to play by those rules might want to solo. And I generally agree with that person wanting to solo, and think there should be options for people to get things without having to bow to other people's rules.

/shrugs

[Zagen]

the trouble is not everyone can get a group for the things they want and need - especially when they are just starting out. As a BST, for example, no one will take me on seal runs. I've asked and they say "do you have another job?"

I joined a seal farming shout the other day that was led by a SMN. While the job has its uses but for seal farming it provides no real needed help, much like BST would. No one in the group questioned that the SMN went SMN to farm, we went with a NIN tank, BLM, and WHM to farm seals everyone got the seals they wanted and all were happy.

The difference between you and the SMN in my story is the SMN was the one shouting not asking to join a group, s/he took the role of leader (one few want myself included) and got the key jobs to farm seals with. If you don't have a "key" job then take the role of leader because most people don't want it, they are usually quite happy being your sheep(BST pun haha).

Well when you've just started a new character and toiled all the way to 90 (it took me about 4 months cause I can't play non-stop) - it is pretty sucky to be told to go level a new job if you want to play with other people

I created a character for my wife and its level 76 now with 85 limit atm. It took her 8 weeks or so to get to 76 through leeching my whisker farming parties. Keep in mind I also seal farm for jobs I've leveled, kill Sobek after farming KIs and work on random NMs as needed for drops or to help others in the LS so she wasn't grinding away 24/7 or anything remotely close to that.

Now I know what some will say about leeching being bad or how if you have 0 Cruor you can't shout and be the Key Person. Personal thoughts aside willingness to be a leader again means you prosper from it. If you're willing to take on the "leader" role you can get away with a lot such as getting 15-16 people to kill monsters and 1-2 key people. All while you reap the EXP and no one will complain because most people enjoy being sheep.

Then you are still stuck even if you do level another job because you can't afford to gear it properly/get spells for it/whatever and people don't necessarily want to help you.

If you do some research you'll find that 1 Cruor is worth 2.5 Gil. Since you're leading EXP runs and you have others opening boxes for you, you are profiting from all that Cruor. After a few runs you'll be at 70 so you can work on skill ups to take on Maat and you'll have a few hundred thousand Cruor saved up you can turn into Gil, before you know it you'll have over a million Gil to spend on gear.

Now, I am fairly lucky to have a nice LS - but still there isn't many of us and everyone has different goals, and people are often with pick up groups and stuff so - it isn't very often that people are able to put together a group for something they want out of LS mates. Add to that the fact that we aren't very pro (no one in the shell has an emp weapon for example) - and then it becomes clear that content that is designed for 18 people is really unfriendly to a LOT of the playerbase.

What content is designed for 18 people currently? Aside from Voidwatch possibly, not sure about that event yet I haven't checked it out.

TL : DR Having the guts to be the leader will get you very far in this game and any MMO.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

What content is designed for 18 people...?

Also, BST is a solo job, so I'm not sure what you expected but if you make a party of 4 people and you need 1x WHM, 1x BLM/BRD, 1xBLU or THF and 1xTank (Can be BLU, THF, MNK, NIN, etc) it's fairly easy to see that you don't exactly fit any of those aside from maybe THF, but Dipper can't proc additional TH so...

If you're a BST, you should have a WHM sub around 50, so just take that to 90 and 12 hours later you can get seals in pick ups.

Bst is not a solo job, nin is not a tank. These are roles that have been forced upon them by the community. I for one never solo'd bst and leveled nin as DD with /drk.

[Olor]

TL : DR Having the guts to be the leader will get you very far in this game and any MMO.

Thanks, that was a nice post. I don't generally have trouble leveling up (it isn't difficult) - I do have limited playtime however, and would rather spend my limited time playing a job I want to play and gearing the job I want to play by playing that job - as opposed to leveling a job I don't want to play.

Luckily I do like playing BLU so leveling that doesn't bother me... but I still have a lot of sympathy for people who would rather solo than put up with the (oftentimes unreasonable) demands of others.

Also I agree with the above poster - It really is silly to pidgeonhole jobs when they can perform a lot of roles. BST can make a great tank - for example, for a party. It can also be DD, or support. It is a solid damage dealer with a meat shield that isn't an MP sponge. It does good things for a party.

[Cream_Soda]

Bst is not a solo job, nin is not a tank. These are roles that have been forced upon them by the community. I for one never solo'd bst and leveled nin as DD with /drk.

Too bad /war gives more dmg than /drk.

Not sure what you leveled it as, but certainly wasn't a DD. (at least a competent one)

[Rearden]

Gimps gon' gimp

[Doombringer]

Sure, and I will pay for all those spells with my imaginary gil!

Anyway - someone asked why people would solo in an MMO - I replied by pointing out that people might want to put their effort into soloing because they can't find other people to do content with them (unless they say, level a job they don't want to play...)

Like if I wanted to be a whm... I probably would have leveled whm, not BST.

Anyway, I am leveling BLU for seal pick ups because at least I enjoy playing BLU.

That said, I can understand why people would want to solo, what with so many people out there demanding you play a job you don't want to play etc. in order to gear the job you do want to play.

I can understand WHY seal groups want people to be on those jobs (they don't want to waste their time or have 1 more person to share with/whatever) - but I also understand that someone who doesn't want to play by those rules might want to solo. And I generally agree with that person wanting to solo, and think there should be options for people to get things without having to bow to other people's rules.

/shrugs

the issue isn't people soloing. the issue is what some people THINK is soloing. if people were actually soloing walk of echos then this change doesn't effect them.

the people complaining are the people who crash other groups WoE runs to steal drops, and try to justify it by calling it "soloing"


if people wanna ACTUALLY solo stuff, then they can go nuts with it for all i care.

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

This animosity between endgame linkshells and leechers wouldn't be such an issue if the drops weren't so competitive to begin with.

Getting a Walk of Echoes weapon isn't supposed to be hard. It isn't supposed to involve sitting in Port Jeuno. Just look at the trials that follow WoE: kindred's crests and high kindred's crests. Most people have enough to complete those last two trials before even starting their first trial! It shouldn't require much more coordination among players than what we see in going after VNMs, for which there is a general lack of concern for jobs or tactics.

The main problem with WoE isn't the lotting system; lotting drama is just a symptom here. The main problem is that these are battlefields. They require the kind of coordination and dedication that only a committed group can provide. But individuals naturally aren't going to make that kind of commitment without some sort of return on their investment.

Trying to "fix" WoE by catering to these groups, however, won't get you anywhere. If you've assembled such a group, you're 95% of the way towards getting actual empyrean weapons, so why bother with WoE? Even with plans to allow groups to monopolize a battlefield and its drops, to "give them exactly what they're asking for," I don't see WoE becoming any more popular.

On the contrary, I see it making WoE even less popular. Perhaps its greatest appeal is its appearance of being a pick-up-and-go activity. Of course, we're here having this discussion because it's exactly the opposite, but the idea of being able to pay your fee and stroll on in is supposed to be an advantage over sitting in Jeuno dealing with /shouts for an hour. Locking such people out will just turn Walk of Echoes into what Dynamis was this time last year.

Groups can lay claim to areas in Limbus and Einherjar, too. How popular are those nowadays?

We're not talking about building relic or mythic weapons here. Again, looking at the so-called "trials" for level 85 and 90 weapons, it's not supposed to be grueling. What's breaking WoE is the fact to get weapon "A" you need to focus exclusively on battlefield "B," which all but requires "C" number of players with "D" job mix executing playbook tactic "E." And job mix "D" specifically doesn't include any jobs that can wield weapon "A" to begin with.

At worst, unlocking an empyrean weapon skill shouldn't be worse than unlocking a mythic weapon skill was back in Nyzul's heyday.

[Camate]

Howdy!

As there has been quite a lot of feedback already on the topic of Walk of Echoes adjustments, we’d just like to confirm the type of system everyone really wants, one more time.

We’d like to decide what the best option for the renewed system is based on your feedback, so please post your opinions by 7/18 (Monday).


(1)Original open-access system

•Proceed with adjustments based on the current system.

(2)Change to reservation system

•For the reservation system, we are planning to make it similar to regular battlefields. It will be different than Dynamis and Assault.
•Planning to make entry limited to once per real world day.

We are also looking into the below regardless of which system we chose to adopt:

•Reward revamps
•Item drop rate on regular monsters
•Difficulty level of Magian-related trials that require different types of coins

When responding to this post, We ask that you please begin your post with "1" or "2" so that we can easily tally the votes up during our information gathering.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

Howdy!

As there has been quite a lot of feedback already on the topic of Walk of Echoes adjustments, we’d just like to confirm the type of system everyone really wants, one more time.

We’d like to decide what the best option for the renewed system is based on your feedback, so please post your opinions by 7/18 (Monday).


(1)Original open-access system

•Proceed with adjustments based on the current system.

(2)Change to reservation system

•For the reservation system, we are planning to make it similar to regular battlefields. It will be different than Dynamis and Assault.
•Planning to make entry limited to once per real world day.

We are also looking into the below regardless of which system we chose to adopt:

•Reward revamps
•Item drop rate on regular monsters
•Difficulty level of Magian-related trials that require different types of coins

When responding to this post, We ask that you please begin your post with "1" or "2" so that we can easily tally the votes up during our information gathering.

Regardless of which ever it comes down to, you still need to retain the ability to allow people to still go in solo if they so chose.